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Crown
July 8th, 2012, 11:33 PM
We wait for that day ITT.

http://i.imgur.com/GTW9V.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/AcrEX.jpg
「『劇場版「空の境界」未来福音』制作決定!!」

Kara no Kyoukai Official website (http://www.karanokyoukai.com/)

ufotable (http://www.ufotable.com/index.html)

You
July 8th, 2012, 11:38 PM
And everyone laughed it off as an April Fools Joke. Harharharhar.

Crown
July 8th, 2012, 11:41 PM
And everyone laughed it off as an April Fools Joke. Harharharhar.

Who were those oafs?

I3uster
July 8th, 2012, 11:45 PM
I can't wait for ufotable to once again ejaculate happiness into my eyes.

KnK movies were the 2nd best Anime I ever saw. Of all time.

SeiKeo
July 8th, 2012, 11:48 PM
Shit now I need to delete posts so I can be first poster.

one piece of infinity
July 9th, 2012, 12:32 AM
*.*
whoo!

ItsaRandomUsername
July 9th, 2012, 12:32 AM
Hey ho, looking forward to this. More Kara no Kyoukai is something I can't say no to.

Crown
July 9th, 2012, 12:35 AM
http://i.imgur.com/GTW9V.jpg

Mirri
July 9th, 2012, 12:37 AM
I can't wait for ufotable to once again ejaculate happiness into my eyes.

KnK movies were the 2nd best Anime I ever saw. Of all time.

You know, clearly this makes me a disgusting awful person but...

the first thing I thought when I read this was "why would you say you can't wait for them to ejaculate in to your eyes? that hurts so bad."



anywaaaaayyyyy


I'm excited. I'm curious though, will this mean anything regarding release of the original movies on BluRay again? In singles, perhaps? 'Cause I could see this causing an increase in demand for the first seven films + first epilogue when it's released. Probably not, but from what I've read around the internets I'm not the only one hoping this.

SeiKeo
July 9th, 2012, 01:12 AM
You know, clearly this makes me a disgusting awful person but...

the first thing I thought when I read this was "why would you say you can't wait for them to ejaculate in to your eyes? that hurts so bad."



anywaaaaayyyyy


I'm excited. I'm curious though, will this mean anything regarding release of the original movies on BluRay again? In singles, perhaps? 'Cause I could see this causing an increase in demand for the first seven films + first epilogue when it's released. Probably not, but from what I've read around the internets I'm not the only one hoping this.

I don't think so, the only re-releases I think are happening are the Aniplex DVD releases. If we get a BluRay rerelease, I am all over that shit.

Ero Erohim
July 9th, 2012, 01:19 AM
All I can say is...

http://sadpanda.us/images/864497-TG0IUTK.gif



This is basically a KnK with a loli named Mana Ryougi right?

SeiKeo
July 9th, 2012, 01:21 AM
Basically this is Shiki kills the future and her daughter goes yan on Mikiya.

Crown
July 9th, 2012, 01:44 AM
Basically this is Shiki kills the future
Where is Cruor's post about this so that many don't fall for this.

SeiKeo
July 9th, 2012, 01:45 AM
But we want them to fall for it.

Rowanism
July 9th, 2012, 02:25 AM
I'm so happy right now. I'm crying. This....... makes me so happy.

Arashi_Leonhart
July 9th, 2012, 02:59 AM
What they should've done is waited until Maaya Sakamoto and Kenichi Suzumura had a kid, and then in a few years that kid could voice Mana.

I mean, not really, but it'd be funny.

Break
July 9th, 2012, 03:03 AM
ohhh yeah. i haven trea dmirai fukuin yet so ill wait for the mvoie to let new story rain on my brain.

Magicholic
July 9th, 2012, 03:52 AM
Yes!
http://i.imgur.com/2G6UX.jpg

New
July 9th, 2012, 04:22 AM
Carnival Phantasm -> Fate Zero -> Tsukihime remake + KnK Mirai Fukuin
Looks like Type Moon people were busy this past 16months.

Never read the books so. I wana see this story too :D

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 08:11 AM
What they should've done is waited until Maaya Sakamoto and Kenichi Suzumura had a kid, and then in a few years that kid could voice Mana.

I mean, not really, but it'd be funny.

I don't suppose they could show the process they used to make that kid. It could be educational.

I still don't understand why they fogged out the shower scene in the 7th movie. They showed Fujino in all her glory so why censor Shiki?? It would be nice to be spared all the mushroom brain fuck and just have Shiki strip naked and do a lap dance in front of her daughter or something. This would actually be logical considering both she and Mikiya are now drug addicts.

Then again from what was seen in the movie her breasts make Akiha seem well-endowed in comparison so I guess there's nothing missed there. And I'm not eager to find out how many tattoos Shiki got in her new "job".

Break
July 9th, 2012, 09:09 AM
I don't suppose they could show the process they used to make that kid. It could be educational.

I still don't understand why they fogged out the shower scene in the 7th movie. They showed Fujino in all her glory so why censor Shiki?? It would be nice to be spared all the mushroom brain fuck and just have Shiki strip naked and do a lap dance in front of her daughter or something. This would actually be logical considering both she and Mikiya are now drug addicts.

Then again from what was seen in the movie her breasts make Akiha seem well-endowed in comparison so I guess there's nothing missed there. And I'm not eager to find out how many tattoos Shiki got in her new "job".

flat is ncie too! xD but nah, i suppose the msot theyd go for would be strippign asnd fadign out to a black screen withsome moaning. which could be ncie sicne shiki's VA has a very beautiful voice.
(but hwo the hell did they both end up Drug addicts? wasnt "normality" like, kokutou's origin? )

Keyne
July 9th, 2012, 09:17 AM
flat is ncie too! xD but nah, i suppose the msot theyd go for would be strippign asnd fadign out to a black screen withsome moaning. which could be ncie sicne shiki's VA has a very beautiful voice.
(but hwo the hell did they both end up Drug addicts? wasnt "normality" like, kokutou's origin? )
IdontunderstandonehalfofthisstuffAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAH!

I3uster
July 9th, 2012, 09:18 AM
I don't suppose they could show the process they used to make that kid. It could be educational.

I still don't understand why they fogged out the shower scene in the 7th movie. They showed Fujino in all her glory so why censor Shiki?? It would be nice to be spared all the mushroom brain fuck and just have Shiki strip naked and do a lap dance in front of her daughter or something. This would actually be logical considering both she and Mikiya are now drug addicts.

Then again from what was seen in the movie her breasts make Akiha seem well-endowed in comparison so I guess there's nothing missed there. And I'm not eager to find out how many tattoos Shiki got in her new "job".
Wait you don't think yakuza tattoos are hot?

getout

Mcjon01
July 9th, 2012, 09:30 AM
It's not like tattoos mean anything when it's Ryougi, anyway. If she gets tired of it, she can just kill the tattoo.

terraablaze
July 9th, 2012, 09:34 AM
Assuming her body doesn't just magically sweat it out like it did with the muscle relaxant.

Break
July 9th, 2012, 09:49 AM
id assume yakuza-tattoos would look incredibly sexy on ryougi.

etherlite
July 9th, 2012, 10:16 AM
What they should've done is waited until Maaya Sakamoto and Kenichi Suzumura had a kid, and then in a few years that kid could voice Mana.

I mean, not really, but it'd be funny.

AWSM idea, if only we don't have to wait for like... 25 years to go?

ZidanReign
July 9th, 2012, 10:28 AM
MOAR WEEOGEE :D

...

Dammit morm.

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 10:46 AM
id assume yakuza-tattoos would look incredibly sexy on ryougi.

Does this look sexy to you?

6191


Blerghh :p I don't want my image of Ryougi despoiled by such filth. But if thats your thing suit yourself.

Also I don't think she can kill those tats that easily. The ink was mixed into her cells. More likely the skin cells would be removed along with the tattoos and since everything she kills cannot be healed that would mean she would need a lot of skin grafts. Tohko could probably help with that. But more importantly I don't think she would willingly cut them off when she chose to be inked in the first place. I don't know much about Yakuza culture but I do know their tats are a sign of "honor" or power to them and even ex-Yakuza don't bother removing them in Japan.

terraablaze
July 9th, 2012, 10:48 AM
Direct Death only kills what you want it to kill and nothing else. Which is why she can stab herself and Asagami Fujino with abandon without worrying about it. She killed a spirit possessing her, she killed appendicitis, she can kill the bad smell of food or a precise amount of salt.

SeiKeo
July 9th, 2012, 11:00 AM
I could go for a Taijitu tattooed on her back.

Black Sword
July 9th, 2012, 11:04 AM
I cannot wait for this!

Crown
July 9th, 2012, 11:14 AM
I don't suppose they could show the process they used to make that kid. It could be educational.

I still don't understand why they fogged out the shower scene in the 7th movie. They showed Fujino in all her glory so why censor Shiki?? It would be nice to be spared all the mushroom brain fuck and just have Shiki strip naked and do a lap dance in front of her daughter or something. This would actually be logical considering both she and Mikiya are now drug addicts.

Then again from what was seen in the movie her breasts make Akiha seem well-endowed in comparison so I guess there's nothing missed there. And I'm not eager to find out how many tattoos Shiki got in her new "job".

RV pls go to somewhere so we can talk.

SeiKeo
July 9th, 2012, 11:20 AM
I don't suppose they could show the process they used to make that kid. It could be educational.

I still don't understand why they fogged out the shower scene in the 7th movie. They showed Fujino in all her glory so why censor Shiki?? It would be nice to be spared all the mushroom brain fuck and just have Shiki strip naked and do a lap dance in front of her daughter or something. This would actually be logical considering both she and Mikiya are now drug addicts.

http://i.somethingawful.com/forumsystem/emoticons/emot-psylon.gif

terraablaze
July 9th, 2012, 11:42 AM
Yeah, not sure about the drug addiction. But they never did address how Mikiya survived his supposedly "lethal dose" of magic marijuana. Shiki could always stab it out later but it's still weird.

Black Sword
July 9th, 2012, 12:02 PM
He bled out so much that it didn't have as much poisonous impact as it should have, at least that's the understanding I derived.

Mcjon01
July 9th, 2012, 12:19 PM
Having a foreign substance inside him was considered an abnormal state and rejected by his origin. It's why he heals so fast and never gets sick.

Break
July 9th, 2012, 12:59 PM
Does this look sexy to you?

6191


Blerghh :p I don't want my image of Ryougi despoiled by such filth. But if thats your thing suit yourself.

Also I don't think she can kill those tats that easily. The ink was mixed into her cells. More likely the skin cells would be removed along with the tattoos and since everything she kills cannot be healed that would mean she would need a lot of skin grafts. Tohko could probably help with that. But more importantly I don't think she would willingly cut them off when she chose to be inked in the first place. I don't know much about Yakuza culture but I do know their tats are a sign of "honor" or power to them and even ex-Yakuza don't bother removing them in Japan.

yes, on ryougi they would indeed look sexy and tasteful. and on soem other people too. but ihm. not the weird woman-motif you posted. btu there are plenty other motify she could use. like those flowers, you know what i mean.

Hen_Ichi
July 9th, 2012, 01:18 PM
IdontunderstandonehalfofthisstuffAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAH!

They so perfect together aren't they? ^_^

http://i46.tinypic.com/wbao76.jpg

Break
July 9th, 2012, 01:28 PM
speaking of sexa tattoos, i wonder if a female Avenger would work... i shall devote a portion of my life to drawing a loli-avenger sometime in the near future!

food
July 9th, 2012, 01:35 PM
Yeah, not sure about the drug addiction. But they never did address how Mikiya survived his supposedly "lethal dose" of magic marijuana. Shiki could always stab it out later but it's still weird.

Any stoner knows you cannot die from marijuana, magical or not magical. Lio is a n00b believing everything Araya told him.

terraablaze
July 9th, 2012, 01:41 PM
That's why I said supposedly and put lethal dose in quotes. It's supposed to sit in your gut and never metabolize or allow you to develop tolerance but even with all that a "10 times" should still be way within the bonds of nonlethal.

I'm pretty sure this is like Nasu's knowledge of genetics.

BananaShiki
July 9th, 2012, 01:43 PM
They so perfect together aren't they? ^_^

http://i46.tinypic.com/wbao76.jpg

Where is that from?
I must know this.

Crown
July 9th, 2012, 05:21 PM
Heaven's Failure, chapter 3.


Thank you based google.

I3uster
July 9th, 2012, 05:50 PM
Any stoner knows you cannot die from marijuana, magical or not magical. Lio is a n00b believing everything Araya told him.

The Japanese think that weed is the devil, so maybe he once saw something comparable to the US Meth campaigns.

Break
July 9th, 2012, 05:58 PM
They so perfect together aren't they? ^_^

http://i46.tinypic.com/wbao76.jpg

..thanks, you saved me from having a new purpose in life by showing me it has already been done.
..thats the manga CP is based on, right? i cant remember the title of the manga for some reason though. but i hope that snippet gets animated when they announce "were gonna continue CP!" xD

ah nope, its from some manga or doujin called "heavens failure", huh? couldve sworn the style looked almost the same.

- - - Updated - - -


Any stoner knows you cannot die from marijuana, magical or not magical. Lio is a n00b believing everything Araya told him.
yeah this was pretty jarring for me too. im just gonna guess nasu's mom instilled so much fear of drugs into him when he was a teen that he never looked up anything on them anymore than that. but well, he used that time to come up with weird maguc systems and reading through mythologybooks o im all fine with it.

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 05:59 PM
I don't get it. Why does Nasu like Yakuza so much? He supposedly hates drugs but he likes drug dealers? Maybe he really was on drugs when he chose that career for Shiki?

Most Japanese know their scumbags and lowlives on the dregs of the society. Its not like Ryougi doesn't have some very profitable skills. She was supposed to have gone back to college in the last movie.

And if she can kill the taste in food she could make a killer chef being able to perfect the perfect taste.

Or better yet she could start an acupuncture clinic with miracle treatments or become an outstanding doctor who can "kill" HIV or inoperable cancers and prevent them from growing back or spreading. It would be the medical miracle of the century.

And theres always construction demolition work or stone cutting she could assist in.

Even if shes not interested in any of that and wants to be a recluse and sleep in all day she could have just lived off her family's income from investments and such. Her family is obviously not Yakuza so why she would choose such a stupid and pathetic line of work boggles the mind. There is nothing in any of the movies/novels beforehand that even hints at such a future career unless killing poor Araya and Leo so traumatized her she feels she has already chosen a criminal lifestyle or something.

Even Tohno Shiki would have chosen a better career getting a normal job as a salaryman, Host True Ancestor pimp, or something.

I3uster
July 9th, 2012, 06:09 PM
Because yakuza, like the Italian mafia are glorified by the media. So it's cool to be a yakuza.

terraablaze
July 9th, 2012, 06:11 PM
If the Church can have a cool militant underbelly and there can be assassination organizations that sell killers for one time use, then criminal families can act like the way they are portrayed in movies.

I3uster
July 9th, 2012, 06:13 PM
What I never got:
Are the Tohno supposed to be yakuza? Most Zaibatsu don't have small armies as far as I know.

Break
July 9th, 2012, 06:14 PM
because Nasu thinks a tattoo would look good on Shiki too? maybe a field of Higanbana's to fo with the theme or whatever.

I3uster
July 9th, 2012, 06:16 PM
Well, tattooos would look pretty awesome on her tbh.
Also fits with her leather jacket/Iwontbotherlearningthedifferencebetweenayukataanda kimonosueme combo

terraablaze
July 9th, 2012, 06:25 PM
Maybe that's how all Demon Hunter families get their funds, yakuza. Inb4 Tobias faps to Taiga the oni hunter.

Break
July 9th, 2012, 06:36 PM
Well, tattooos would look pretty awesome on her tbh.
Also fits with her leather jacket/Iwontbotherlearningthedifferencebetweenayukataanda kimonosueme combo

hm im thinking of the leather jacket-less outfit though, sicne thne she can pull the sleeves down and expse just enough shoulder and stuff tht we can actually see the Tattoos. not sure how she would pull that off with the Leatherjacket on..

food
July 9th, 2012, 06:50 PM
What I never got:
Are the Tohno supposed to be yakuza? Most Zaibatsu don't have small armies as far as I know.

They are non-specific capitalists. The main houses and the branch houses have been wealthy and powerful since ye olde days.

In other words, Nasu just wants them to be rich.

I think only Fujimuras are explicitly Yakuza, because Raiga actually had a "group".

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 07:16 PM
If the Church can have a cool militant underbelly and there can be assassination organizations that sell killers for one time use, then criminal families can act like the way they are portrayed in movies.

In other words pigs can fly, my shit's smell makes great perfume, and magic is real :neco_arc:

So just because the media says what guys and gals do in certain organizations who eventually all end up raped, dead, or life in prison is "cool" its okay to have the same fate for our favorite tsundere heroine. Whatever, the disbelief is too much. Glorification of criminals is just sad man.

Interestingly I believe the Vatican does have an army of their own in RL. I think its called the Swiss Guard or something. So technically the Church could go on a new holy war or Crusades-like conquest with their almighty military against evil heathen devils to reclaim the holy land like its the Middle Ages. Whether they survive longer than a day before the Pope gets sent to a sanitarium is up for debate...

And you don't need assassination organizations that spend 10-20 years training orphans as suicide bombers. You have drones for that that can be built and used in a matter of days. And better yet you don't even need to worry about them betraying you to become a school teacher or blabbing off to the enemy if they are captured. Nasu really likes doing things the hard way...

terraablaze
July 9th, 2012, 07:23 PM
The Swiss Guard is a mercenary group from ye olde days when nobles needed politically neutral bodyguards.

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 07:23 PM
I think only Fujimuras are explicitly Yakuza, because Raiga actually had a "group".

Yeah thats definitely true there. But the similarity ends with the name. Old Raiga was buds with Kiritsugu so he can be trusted with the deed to the house and all the finances when the Kiritsugu dies instead of Shirou? Would you leave your entire assets and property to a "good friend" like that instead of your own son or in a trust account? If that old Raiga was a "real" Yakuza he would be moving in to his nice new crib or selling off some killer real estate to a developer and sending that worthless brat Shirou to Kotomine's orphanage to feed the Gate of Babylon. If you remember those Kobe pics of the Emiya residence you cannot even imagine how much a huge property like that would be worth when most Japanese live in "mansion" apartments.

But no... Raiga's a kind charity worker with a humanitarian streak that would make Mother Teresa blush and he never does anything bad to "damage" the name of the Yakuza.


The Swiss Guard is a mercenary group from ye olde days when nobles needed politically neutral bodyguards.

That still doesn't distract from my point that today they are the Pope's personal bodyguards/army and can be used to attack nations or carry his luggage. And its hard to be politically neutral when mercenaries can be bribed by the next highest bidder... or just take your money and ditch you to take someone else's money and someone else's and so on...

lantzblades
July 9th, 2012, 07:34 PM
If that old Raiga was a "real" Yakuza

actually they are socially minded, so Raiga not being a real yakuza is bs.

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 07:44 PM
actually they are socially minded, so Raiga not being a real yakuza is bs.

LOL What? Sorry its been a while since I saw someone so brainwashed by propaganda. So your saying yakuza who any day could be killed, robbed, imprisoned, or lose a finger don't care about money as much as being "socially minded" and upholding Japanese honor is what a "real" yakuza should be. Why not get inked and join that organization for a week and then come back and tell me if being socially retarded is what the Yakuza is all about?

Ask yourself this: why do criminals do what they do and go to prison? They're stupid for sure but also it's because they are greedy as sin. If you still believe the reason is because its cool or socially acceptable you might as well join them.

That's why I don't understand the REASON Ryougi chose to become a criminal. She never expressed any interest in money or material objects besides swords and Haagen Daaz. If anyone in KnK has the necessary selfishness to be Yakuza that would be Touko and she's too smart to do such a retarded thing.

I3uster
July 9th, 2012, 07:56 PM
Yakuza love their YAMATO DAMASHII and HONOR, ensures loyality from the low-ranks and in general a coherent structure.
Image is important in crime. A boss who is feared and respect isn't getting backstabbed.

All in all it's not as simple as you make it out to be. Yes, they are murderers, human traffickers, guns and drug dealers. Doesn't make them comic book villains.

Arashi_Leonhart
July 9th, 2012, 08:00 PM
Once again, ignore the dude with no understanding of Japanese culture.

I3uster
July 9th, 2012, 08:05 PM
Wel, he is right in a way. It gets romanticized pretty hard, and the yakuza are criminal organizations and with that pretty much some of the worst people on this planet.
But they know what they are doing.

SeiKeo
July 9th, 2012, 08:09 PM
I don't get it. Why does Nasu like Yakuza so much? He supposedly hates drugs but he likes drug dealers? Maybe he really was on drugs when he chose that career for Shiki?

Most Japanese know their scumbags and lowlives on the dregs of the society. Its not like Ryougi doesn't have some very profitable skills. She was supposed to have gone back to college in the last movie.

And if she can kill the taste in food she could make a killer chef being able to perfect the perfect taste.

Or better yet she could start an acupuncture clinic with miracle treatments or become an outstanding doctor who can "kill" HIV or inoperable cancers and prevent them from growing back or spreading. It would be the medical miracle of the century.

And theres always construction demolition work or stone cutting she could assist in.

Even if shes not interested in any of that and wants to be a recluse and sleep in all day she could have just lived off her family's income from investments and such. Her family is obviously not Yakuza so why she would choose such a stupid and pathetic line of work boggles the mind. There is nothing in any of the movies/novels beforehand that even hints at such a future career unless killing poor Araya and Leo so traumatized her she feels she has already chosen a criminal lifestyle or something.

Even Tohno Shiki would have chosen a better career getting a normal job as a salaryman, Host True Ancestor pimp, or something.

See, though, she doesn't actually consider herself a Yakuza heiress or the like. Of course she could have any number of careers, she still has them open. Not that she'd probably do what you suggest because she gives no fucks, but what have you.

Arashi_Leonhart
July 9th, 2012, 08:09 PM
Nope, still vote for ignoring. Or flipping tables and storming off, since we're talking yakuza.

I3uster
July 9th, 2012, 08:18 PM
Honestly, I prefer his viewpoint to the "THEY HELPED DURING THE TSUNAMI SO THEY ARE DECENT PEOPLE, IGNORE THE MURDER AND HUMAN TRAFFICKING PLZ" rose tinted weaboo viewpoint.

Arashi_Leonhart
July 9th, 2012, 08:25 PM
Don't forget Kobe has very little street crime. Crime is more refined there.

I have the strangest urge to go watch Futakoi Alternative again.

food
July 9th, 2012, 08:26 PM
Honestly, I prefer his viewpoint to the "THEY HELPED DURING THE TSUNAMI SO THEY ARE DECENT PEOPLE, IGNORE THE MURDER AND HUMAN TRAFFICKING PLZ" rose tinted weaboo viewpoint.

They are very similar to the Mafia/Mob.
They are gangster, and they will fuck you up. However, if you are bros with the Yakuza, they are probably the most trustworthy people if you do not have blood relatives.
In Kiritsugu's case, he would have made the correct decision because he and Raiga are bros.

Twelveseal
July 9th, 2012, 08:28 PM
Not to mention that Raiga actively seems to like Shirou personally, and that Shirou does odd jobs for him, like fixing his motorcycles.

food
July 9th, 2012, 08:28 PM
Not to mention that Raiga actively seems to like Shirou personally, and that Shirou does odd jobs for him, like fixing his motorcycles.

Raiga likes Shirou, and Taiga wants to have Kiritsugu's babies.

It all worked out.

Arashi_Leonhart
July 9th, 2012, 08:30 PM
"If only I had a son like you. Instead, I ended up with--"

(Taiga decides crashing into garage with moped is better than parking in garage with moped)

"--Well, you get the point."

Five_X
July 9th, 2012, 08:42 PM
Arashi, you should update your Japanese culture thread thing with stuff about yakuza! It'd be... sort of Nasuverse relevant!

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 08:43 PM
Yakuza love their YAMATO DAMASHII and HONOR, ensures loyality from the low-ranks and in general a coherent structure.
Image is important in crime. A boss who is feared and respect isn't getting backstabbed.

All in all it's not as simple as you make it out to be. Yes, they are murderers, human traffickers, guns and drug dealers. Doesn't make them comic book villains.

I hate to break it to you buddy but thats what we call a slogan in sales talk. Its just a schtick used to lure in new saps as cannon fodder. You think an impressionable youth can be convinced to drop out of high school and join a gang by telling them do you want to go to prison, end up in the hospital, or die like a dog, and even if you live you have to do sucking dick and kissing ass?

Do you really believe those low ranked chimpiras would run out like headless monkeys at their oyabun's beck and call for "YAMATO DAMASHII and HONOR"?

It is very simple and not that complex. It involves yellow or green pieces of paper with a 1 and 3 or 4 zeros behind it depending on your country. And the fact that a lot of dudes would love to have lots of this paper to trade for interesting baubles and the like. Its almost like children playing with play money.

True there were a handful of Yakuza godfathers if I recall who talked about patriotism, Japanese honor, etc. They could this because they have a billion dollars (or a hundred billion yen) in a Swiss bank account, bribed the right politicians and police to chase away criminal indictments, and have an army of killers at their disposal.

The low ranked Yakuza's main job is to kiss enough ass and be subservient and slave-minded enough to please his immediate boss AND make enough money. Oh and those low-ranked yakuza have to pay something called a tribute up to his boss who then kicks it to his waka and so on until you reach the very top. If the chimps fail to meet the payment they have to add interest onto their "debt" or lose a finger or two. And promotion is impossible beyond asskisser #1 vs asskisser in the back of the line. The media makes me sick romanticizing what is basically a giant pyramid scheme where the only ones who benefit and get rich are the ones on the top. This is even worse then the Wall street pyramid scandals like the Madoff fiasco. At least there they could argue the participants had no idea they were being conned out of their money and time. The yakuza lowlives KNOW they are joining a scam but are too stupid to make a better choice in their life.

You don't have to believe me. Check out how the Mob romanticized today.



BEING "MADE" IN THE MOB IS DANGEROUS TO LIFE AND LIBERTY

Many younger people believe that getting "made" in the Mafia is the ultimate glory. Nothing could be further from the truth: Getting "made" is just about the worst thing that could happen to anyone:

First you have to serve an "apprenticeship," during which you'll have to kiss the asses of every member of the crew you hope to join, and turn over most of your earnings to a boss who thinks you're lower than whale s**t. If you're "lucky," the apprenticeship will last for a decade or less. By that time, you'll have convinced the boss that you're dumb and compliant enough to be "honored" by being made.

So, you'll probably be assigned to kill someone you don't know, for a reason that's not explained to you; and take all the risk on yourself with no reward. If you manage to whack the guy without being killed, injured or arrested, your "reward" will be the famous "induction ceremony"--the fingers pricked so that your blood runs together with the Don's (just hope he doesn't have AIDS or some other STD); the burning saint's card, the oath, the kisses on the cheek, etc. Now you've got it made, right?

Wrong! Your troubles have just begun:
You'll be assigned to a crew chief whose purpose in life is to squeeze you dry. You'll be given a "living"--a sports betting operation, some numbers, drugs or loan shark action. But since the Mob is a pyramid scheme, your crew chief will give you a "nut"--an amount that you must kick back to him each week, whether or not your rackets generate enough profit to cover it. He'll set the amount so high that you'll have no time or opportunity to do anything on your own except work for him. And if you fail to meet the weekly nut, he'll hit you with the same "vig" that he charges his loan shark victims--six percent per week.

Oh, and let's not forget your new "brothers" in the Mafia--the guys who kissed you on the cheek when you got made, and now refer to you as "a friend of ours." Every one of them has contacts in law enforcement that they feed info to in return for being left alone to pursue their own rackets. As soon as your ceremony was completed, they were on the phone to their favorite cops, informing them of the newest member of the Mob. Suddenly you're going to get more attention from law enforcement personnel than a visiting head of state. Your "brothers" will see you as insurance for them when they commit high profile crimes: they'll tip off their police pals that you did the dirty deeds. And, if you manage to survive all of that, the Don'll evntually get nailed on a RICO charge, and he'll rat out you and your other "brothers" in return for a free pass to the Witness Protection Program.

"Honored Society"? You'd be better off washing dishes for a living.




Honestly, I prefer his viewpoint to the "THEY HELPED DURING THE TSUNAMI SO THEY ARE DECENT PEOPLE, IGNORE THE MURDER AND HUMAN TRAFFICKING PLZ" rose tinted weaboo viewpoint.

Oh and remember those brave and courageous men who "volunteered" to save Japan by fixing Fukushima reactor? It turns out the senior scientists did not do the most dangerous part of the job: cleaning up all the radioactive waste and contaminated water in the pits of nuclear plant. For that helpful Yakuze recrutied (coerced, kidnappped) young men who owed them money or they had leverage over and were "volunteered" to jump in the radiation for free (and without any expensive protective gear or follow up medical treatment either).

The high salaries offered for this suicide job was all paid to the Yakuza contractors who found these "heroes" and who would later distribute a "fair" (Zero) amount to their "employees". Its modern day slavery at its very worst. But then again Yakuza also harvest organs from live donors and take out life insurance policies on debtors so this shouldn't be that much of a surprise. But still even I got shocked when I found out the media was deliberately ignoring this and just glorifying the scientists saving the day with all the credit. Theres a dark side and theres an even worse side to even good things these days. You don't even need Angra Mainyu for this...

food
July 9th, 2012, 08:51 PM
The truth is always somewhere in the middle.

If organized crime is as loosely structured without offering the underlings some benefit and protection, they would not have lasted that long or become so hard to root out. Some Yakuza groups in Japan have histories dating back 7~8 generations. People are not dumb. They will start to bail if they always get the short end of the stick. In some sense, the ruling individuals of the Yakuza are like feudal lords.

Of course the lowest peons get the worst gigs and will be thrown under the bus first, but it is undeniable that the Yakuza as an entirety is closely knit and one would think twice before messing with one individual and stirring the whole nest.

Also, the materials you cited are not without bias. Depending on the stance of the writer, he/she will paint the group a certain colour.

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 08:52 PM
They are very similar to the Mafia/Mob.
They are gangster, and they will fuck you up. However, if you are bros with the Yakuza, they are probably the most trustworthy people if you do not have blood relatives.
In Kiritsugu's case, he would have made the correct decision because he and Raiga are bros.

Sorry food I respect your insights but I have to disagree with you here. You got a major fact wrong. There is no honor among thieves. See my Spoiler post on the mob loyalty. It applies to all criminal organizations. Those "brothers" in the Yakuza won't be by your side long if you get shot and lying a pool of blood on the street while the sirens are coming. And the moment you got inducted into this organization, your fellow brothers would be on the phone with their favorite cop ready to pin the next murder they commit onto your ass when they give you the gun used as an introduction gift.

And if the family boss or your comrades get in trouble with the law you can bet they would rat you and everyone else out like a stuck pig to save themselves jail time. I don't think Japan has RICO but they do have hard time for gun possession, murder, and drugs so to cut a deal everyone rats everyone from day one.

The only rule in Yakuza is there are no rules. Its the law of the jungle here. And that stuff about Yakuza taking care of the family of a member whose sent to prison is BS. Try to find any news story or a real life example where the oyabun spent a single yen on the wife/kids of an incarcerated member. It'd be better to look for the Holy Grail.

Arashi_Leonhart
July 9th, 2012, 08:52 PM
I hate to break it to you buddy but thats what we call a slogan in sales talk.

I hate to break it to you buddy, but armchair knowledge isn't anything to firsthand experience. Read all you want on wikipedia, it isn't really going to give you anything but broad strokes of info.

Especially for a culture like the Japanese, where they don't really like people from the outside looking in. "Finding a news story" is not gonna happen anyway, because the Japanese don't like advertizing any of their personal actions to begin with.

Also, I love the fact that this dude equates "facts" with "cliche statements."

Twelveseal
July 9th, 2012, 09:05 PM
BL, the home of many a fine debate.
Actually, though, this is pretty civil. The main problem here is that everyone's just shooting articles, cliches, stereotypes, and the like at one another. Honestly, unless someone here has real experience with it and cares to talk, we're not going to get anything out of this besides agreeing to disagree.

Arashi_Leonhart
July 9th, 2012, 09:06 PM
My experience with being a stupid gaijin and wandering into a yakuza bar by accident equates to agreeing with I3uster and food.

Twelveseal
July 9th, 2012, 09:06 PM
Lol. Nice.

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 09:06 PM
The truth is always somewhere in the middle.

If organized crime is as loosely structured without offering the underlings some benefit and protection, they would not have lasted that long or become so hard to root out. Some Yakuza groups in Japan have histories dating back 7~8 generations. People are not dumb. They will start to bail if they always get the short end of the stick. In some sense, the ruling individuals of the Yakuza are like feudal lords.

Of course the lowest peons get the worst gigs and will be thrown under the bus first, but it is undeniable that the Yakuza as an entirety is closely knit and one would think twice before messing with one individual and stirring the whole nest.

Also, the materials you cited are not without bias. Depending on the stance of the writer, he/she will paint the group a certain colour.

People are not dumb? Um why do you see so many stories in the news these days of kids shooting up schools, doing drugs, Nigerian scams claiming more victims, and more financial fraud from Wall Street where some of the most educated people on the planet work, etc. And this isn't a new thing. This has happened in some form or another since Rome or before recorded history. It has nothing to do with intelligence so much as an appeal to base emotions of greed, hunger, power, etc. There will ALWAYS be humans who want money and would willingly blind themselves to danger and facts in their pursuit of it. Just because you know jumping off a bridge is stupid and would gain nothing doesn't mean you wouldn't do it if there is a prospect (or illusion) of getting rich further down the road.

So just because the Yakuza are 7-8 generations or whatever old does not mean anything other than 8+ generations of fools who look for gold in the ocean. No matter how you try to dress it up, shit is still shit. Thats not to say there weren't good people who made significant accomplishments in human history, just that this is not one of them.

food
July 9th, 2012, 09:10 PM
All I see you post are some random post from some random forums.

Have a read of some articles from credible sources. The Guardian has a collection of articles like this: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/jan/08/yakuza-underground-japan-less-peaceful?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487

The Yakuzas are crooks, but crooks with some shreds of honour. This, even the government and the populace acknowledge. It is not all black and white like you attempt to paint it.

Arashi_Leonhart
July 9th, 2012, 09:11 PM
People are not dumb? Um why do you see so many stories in the news these days of kids shooting up schools, doing drugs, Nigerian scams claiming more victims, and more financial fraud from Wall Street where some of the most educated people on the planet work, etc.

On a completely irrelevant topic... (http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/biased-sample.html)

Twelveseal
July 9th, 2012, 09:23 PM
Nice article, Food. Twas interesting.

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 09:39 PM
All I see you post are some random post from some random forums.

Have a read of some articles from credible sources. The Guardian has a collection of articles like this: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/jan/08/yakuza-underground-japan-less-peaceful?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487

The Yakuzas are crooks, but crooks with some shreds of honour. This, even the government and the populace acknowledge. It is not all black and white like you attempt to paint it.

Here are some more crooks with "honor":

http://latinamericanhistory.about.com/od/20thcenturylatinamerica/a/bioescobar_2.htm

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/45953714/ns/world_news-americas/t/us-mexico-kingpin-joaquin-el-chapo-guzman-worlds-most-powerful-drug-trafficker/

They all spent generously on the people in their communities and were revered as Robin Hoods, etc. And its acknowledged by everyone including law enforcement. Does that mean they don't deserve to go to prison for their crimes? You spend enough money you can buy your way out of murder, sex and drug trafficking?

Besides which there are numerous articles I won't bother to list that explains why the Japanese government "tolerated" the Yakuza. Besides the obvious bribery and election support, you also had some personal friendships between yakuza bosses/Diet members, political uses for the occasional hitman, money launderer, burglar, etc, and the complacency (or fear) of the populace to what seemed like an insurmountable pillar of Japan no different from a govt institution then.

Of course following your article, today the Yakuza elders have mostly retired, died off, etc and the ones in charge are just street punks and scumbags who continue to fleece the govt and businesses with extortion while running all the sex industries in Kabukicho. But as written in the Guardian the Japanese govt and public were getting tired of this and starting to crack down on Yakuza for what they really are: criminal lowlives period.

And for the shred of honor...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Junko_Furuta

How is this honorable? I'm still trying to understand how Yakuza are defending Japanese virtues through these acts?? Please enlighten me.



On a completely irrelevant topic... (http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/biased-sample.html)

Arashi I didn't recognize you with your new avatar, I liked your old one better to be honest. So your saying I'm reading off a prejudicial bias here huh? If its prejudicial to consider murderers, drug dealers, baby rapists, and the like "scum" instead of having a "fair" and "balanced" look at things then I'm guilty as charged. If you want to defend those kind of people with a more nuanced balanced opinion please share it.

food
July 9th, 2012, 09:43 PM
So basically you are back-paddling.

We are not arguing Yakuzas are saints. We are arguing they do have some honour and they will treat those on their side well.

The whole point of this is to show that it is not unrealistic for a Yakuza boss to watch the child and inheritance of a dead friend.

Arashi_Leonhart
July 9th, 2012, 09:56 PM
So your saying I'm reading off a prejudicial bias here huh? If its prejudicial to consider murderers, drug dealers, baby rapists, and the like "scum" instead of having a "fair" and "balanced" look at things then I'm guilty as charged. If you want to defend those kind of people with a more nuanced balanced opinion please share it.

You totally have no idea how to pay attention to even your own writing. I was referring to the fact that saying "people are dumb" because "news stories talk about dumb people" is a biased idea. What you glean from the news is not a statistical basis, so making a generalization based upon a small sampling of information isn't going to fly.

Twelveseal
July 9th, 2012, 09:57 PM
Ummm... Iirc, wasn't the point to try to explain why Ryougi Shiki would choose such a lifestyle and occupation in the first place? It wound up becoming more of an ideological discussion at that point.

I seem to remember hearing at one point that the Ryougi's had Yakuza ties, but I could be wrong.
Edit: Time for me to go. Enjoy the debate folks!

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 10:06 PM
So basically you are back-paddling.

We are not arguing Yakuzas are saints. We are arguing they do have some honour and they will treat those on their side well.

The whole point of this is to show that it is not unrealistic for a Yakuza boss to watch the child and inheritance of a dead friend.

Well then we'll just have to agree to disagree with each other. My main point was there is no honor among thieves period. I know you and others want a deep Nasu-like soul reaching explanation/philosophy but in this case, this reality is very simple and black and white. When someone is stupid enough to become a criminal and join a nest full of other criminals, betrayal should be the least he could expect. At least those in society can have legal protection when there's a dispute or things go wrong. When yakuza/mafia (ie. scumbags) screw with each other they have noone and nothing to back them up.

If you are interested read this memoir by Shoko Tendo. A Yakuza princess who I suspect Nasu may have been influenced by to model MF Ryougi after.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/jun/27/books.japan

At least one Yakuza leader had the balls (retardation) to assassinate a Japanese mayor over some car damage. The honor of his precious Mercedes must be protected after all!

And the one common denominator stressed throughout my argument was the only thing that Yakuza, Mafia, Irish Mob, etc share in common: Greed. Shirou and his father were not Yaks so screwing them over after Daddy's dead wouldn't have incurred any retaliation from a rival family. Sure Taiga could whine about it, but Raiga could just bribe her over with a lifetime supply of French pastries and Japanese restaurants. And the other Yakuza families would not look down on Raiga's looting but would congratulate him on a job well done with jealous envy they did not win the lottery like he did.


You totally have no idea how to pay attention to even your own writing. I was referring to the fact that saying "people are dumb" because "news stories talk about dumb people" is a biased idea. What you glean from the news is not a statistical basis, so making a generalization based upon a small sampling of information isn't going to fly.

*Yawn* http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man
Interesting you ignored that bit about criminal scum I was talking about and went for the side dish instead. Why won't you share how you feel about said individuals of society? Are you hiding something unpleasant?

I3uster
July 9th, 2012, 10:15 PM
I don't want to be part of this conversation anymore. The retardation thickens.

Crown
July 9th, 2012, 10:25 PM
RV pls stop!

VelspertheCat
July 9th, 2012, 11:02 PM
We wouldn't of had this conversation if Ryougi had just decided to be a pastry chef.

Also, if she wasn't a druggie.

Damn druggie.

Black Sword
July 9th, 2012, 11:10 PM
I'm starting to feel like I'm reading Mike's posts.

Moving on, how do you suppose they'll handle the scene where Mana and Mama recruit the children's book author? It's fine in text, but it's harder to be mysterious in a visual format.

Arturia
July 9th, 2012, 11:39 PM
Sorry just have to add one last thing I overlooked.



Especially for a culture like the Japanese, where they don't really like people from the outside looking in. "Finding a news story" is not gonna happen anyway, because the Japanese don't like advertizing any of their personal actions to begin with.


I got a news story right here about Yakuza taking care of their boss when he needed help.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/jun/27/books.japan

Money quote:

The popular image of yakuza families as ostentatiously wealthy and loyal to the core bears little resemblance to Tendo's early experiences of poverty and betrayal. She has a hatred of gangsters that is partly due to the shabby way in which her father's associates treated him in his hour of need.

"They gave him 'sympathy' money to tide him over after his business failed and he became ill, but they basically left him to sink on his own," she said. "Only his really good friends ever visited him in hospital."

...

She does not believe she is alone among yakuza offspring in having had a turbulent childhood. "Japanese society looks very calm on the surface, but underneath it is in turmoil," she said. "Discrimination is rife."

...


Her status as the daughter of a gangland boss was the cause of her troubled youth, a history involving being bullied at school to dealing with the expectation of drug-fuelled sex among men to whom her father was somehow indebted. As a teenager she was repeatedly raped by men who fed her addiction to drugs then left her bloody and bruised in seedy hotel rooms. Only her make-up hides the scars from the reconstructive surgery she required on her face after a particularly bad beating. Her marriage to someone with gangster ties ended quickly, although she still talks of him as a "serious, well-intentioned" man who treated her well.
Tendo's last speed fix came when she was 19, when her injuries from another beating in the room of a motel came close to killing her. "I kept thinking, 'I don't want to die in a place like this'. I was there for an hour and managed to drag myself home ... I knew it was time to stop," she said.



And this is said by someone who was born into the Yakuza you don't have to armchair this. I'll leave it at that.

And back on topic I'm wondering if Mana could be confirmed to possess Shiki's eyes. Too bad she would have to die first to find out. And has Nasu ever revealed if she has multiple personalities as the next generation of Ryougi or would she be like Shiki's brother?

And why is it Mommy Shiki or Daddy doesn't bother taking care of their daughter and leaves the babysitting to a common street thug? Too cheap to afford a good babysitter?

SeiKeo
July 9th, 2012, 11:41 PM
And back on topic I'm wondering if Mana could be confirmed to possess Shiki's eyes. Too bad she would have to die first to find out. And has Nasu ever revealed if she has multiple personalities as the next generation of Ryougi or would she be like Shiki's brother?

Never been confirmed, answer is likely no, I think.

HYuy
July 10th, 2012, 12:04 AM
Y'know, the part I'm wondering about the most is how they're going to do the part of the book where Shiki "cuts" the future and the page has a slash across it....

I can imagine a few ways, but it leaves some room for creativity on their part. MAN I'm hyped for it though!

I3uster
July 10th, 2012, 12:05 AM
ufotable are good at pulling trippy shit. See the whole touching the root sequence.

SeiKeo
July 10th, 2012, 12:05 AM
Y'know, the part I'm wondering about the most is how they're going to do the part of the book where Shiki "cuts" the future and the page has a slash across it....

I can imagine a few ways, but it leaves some room for creativity on their part. MAN I'm hyped for it though!

Shiki will cut towards the camera, and suddenly your monitor will fall apart in two pieces.

Rowanism
July 10th, 2012, 04:50 AM
In ufotable veritas.

nick012000
July 10th, 2012, 05:09 AM
Regarding Raiga being trustworthy enough to take care of the Emiya household for Shirou: I'll point out that Kiritsugu is not only a master planner, but also a wizard entirely capable of creating magically-binding contracts. It's entirely possible that he simply enchanted the documents used to sign over the house and bank accounts to be geasa contracts, and thereby made Raiga literally incapable of even considering acting against Shirou's best interests.

Besides, Kiritsugu was a mercenary assassin, and even if he might not have been Yakuza, he was probably the next-best thing. Given that we don't know how Kiritsugu and Raiga met, it's entirely possible Raiga owes Kiritsugu his life, or at least a significant portion of his business empire.

Break
July 10th, 2012, 05:47 AM
hm, as for the discussion, i have afew things to say.. 1. it may not be bad to glorify yakuza and stuff, but really, makign them seem like the devil is just as bad. "baby rapists"? Arturia seems to think once you do a crime, you cease to be human, which is at least on par with nasu's "lethal dose marihuana" dumbness.
2. whats wrong with having a FICTIONAL story havign a fictional or glorified outlook on yakuza? if we were totally realistic about it, could we enjoy baccano? no, not really, we'd ratehr be terrified of the prospect of an immortal Mafia. do we enjoy it? hell yes! plus while it usually glorifies the style, honor and "fmaily-like" bonds mafia and yakuza share, fiction rarely leaves out the fact tehy are in fact criminals, so its not like its a total glorification either. (and for soem reason i picture raiga's group beeing the kind of pseudo-yakuza that basically formed based on the glorifcated ideals from fictional yakuza, much like the ones in Kamisama no Memochou.)

and hell, just be happy Shiki didnt become a prostitute. witht he power to kill STD's, unwanted pregnancies, Stress and abusive pimops, shed be the queen of Hoe's.
speaking of which, if they become drug addicts i dotn get why shiki doesnt just "kill" their addiction.

Arturia
July 10th, 2012, 06:46 AM
hm, as for the discussion, i have afew things to say.. 1. it may not be bad to glorify yakuza and stuff, but really, makign them seem like the devil is just as bad. "baby rapists"? Arturia seems to think once you do a crime, you cease to be human, which is at least on par with nasu's "lethal dose marihuana" dumbness.

Are you really trying to defend some really bad people who did really bad things to people who really didn't deserve it? Like I mentioned it depends on the crime but certain ones like murder or rape or drug dealing would have a much more severe outlook on the offender vs jaywalking or petty theft which I couldn't care less about. And I hope you are not implying a baby rapist is still human. Thats actually kind of scary...
And if you think the yakuza won't do such things look up the crimes they committed for Moon's sake! Heres just one of them below:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Junko_Furuta



2. whats wrong with having a FICTIONAL story havign a fictional or glorified outlook on yakuza?

Having positive fake stories written about a real life criminal organization almost seems like a recruitment ad or propaganda for said bad organization. There are unfortunately many young and stupid people who get attracted to joining these groups from such positive media. Do you see any fictional stories glorifying Al Qaeda or child pedophiles? The way this "harmless" glorification you imply works is it makes the criminals seem socially acceptable or not that bad when in real life they are really bad people you wouldn't even want to pass on the street.




and hell, just be happy Shiki didnt become a prostitute. witht he power to kill STD's, unwanted pregnancies, Stress and abusive pimops, shed be the queen of Hoe's.
speaking of which, if they become drug addicts i dotn get why shiki doesnt just "kill" their addiction.

I actually wouldn't mind seeing her as a dominatrix or a maid :)
She could be S or M depending on her personality or kill any bad emotions her client feels like depression, stress, etc.
And its hard to kill the drug addiction when your eyesight is blurry and world is spinning around you. One mistaken line and you could be bisecting your torso in half.


nick012000 (http://forums.nrvnqsr.com/member.php/272-nick012000): You do know Kiritsugu had his Magic Circuits rotted away by Angra Mainyu so by that point he had no magic ability left right?

Break
July 10th, 2012, 07:01 AM
*facepalm* yeaahh, im "defendign baad peopel who do baad things"... alos i wasnt implign baby rapng owuld be acceptable, i was impling baby raping is nonsense. and even fi there was soemone who did that it doesnt mean every criminal or yakuza is automatically a "baby rapist". i was implying you are overdoing it. in case oyu dont know, overly horrid unrealistic propaganda is just as bad as glorifieng propaganda. this kind of "horror-propaganda" was ommon in WWI, which was the reason why at first many countries thought the nazi's killing the Jews liek they did woulödve just been propaganda, which led to the other couintries nto taking it seriously until it was so obviosu they had to take it seriously. so by overdoing ti like that, you make even the true stuff harder to believe for anyone who lsitens to you.

2. i guess we should stop writing about Shiki then since it could lead people to becoming murderers huh? we should prohibit anythign that could elad anyone to anything we dont like? its fiction, dammnit. ina ny case people dont just become criminals because they thought it looked cool on TV. they become criminals when they dotn have another choice left. they are pitiable. they may, after deciding to becoem a criminal or step over the lien that doesnt let them turn back, " i saw on TV that the mafia might be okay. now that i cant go back anymore, might as well try there". but thats it.

3. yes, i agree 100%. Shiki as a maid with catears would be the cause of many a heart-attack, at leats ebfore she kills the heart-attack.

uhm she could just kill the addiction while shes clear, i didnt say she could only kil the addiction while shes actually high... i said killing the addiction, not killing the "beeing high". two very different things.

Gabriulio
July 10th, 2012, 12:31 PM
*watches debate*

Wow, talk about a derailed thread. As expected from Beast's Lair.

Mashina
July 10th, 2012, 01:42 PM
Yeah, usually it's at least vaguely TM related though.

gwonbush
July 10th, 2012, 03:07 PM
But this is vaguely TM related. Shiki becomes a Yakuza and Raiga is a Yakuza.

Twelveseal
July 10th, 2012, 05:15 PM
It's a bit interesting, tbh.

Tbh, I don't agree with Art on this one simply because the point of his argument is a blanket statement: "There is no honor among thieves." There's some merit to it, but it's impossible to support an absolute blanket statement without having a total comprehensive knowledge of all parties that fall within the scope of that statement. Unless Art personally knows every crook, thief, and criminal in the whole world, and can provide proof that all conform to his statement, then it's simply rendered a 'belief' as opposed to a 'fact'. It is infinitely easier to simply state that there could be a criminal organization with a code of honor or conduct than it is to state that there absolutely is no such thing.

On that note, Art's probably right for the most part. Greed may not be the only factor involved in such a choice, but it's certainly a major motivator. And let's face it, it's an organization that ultimately profits from preying on the unfortunate. However, there is a kernal of truth in every rumor, myth, and legend out there. The stereotypical idea of the yakuza as a criminal organization with a code of honor and conduct would not exist if there wasn't at least something there to base it off of, even if that something is completely fabricated. More than likely, there is a degree of honor amongst the yakuza, at least enough to found and perpetuate the stereotype. It is almost certainly not as great as what the media shows, but it's most likely still there.

And before Art rages, no, that does not mean that they are good people, any less criminals, or the like.

And that was Twelveseal's opinion/take on the whole mess.

I3uster
July 10th, 2012, 05:31 PM
The problem is that if we go by Arturia's thinking there would be no organized crime. Because organization requires the involved to obey certain...well, let's call it "rules".

If the situation were like Arturia describes it, either the yakuza would tear themselves apart in a day and there would be no organization, or Tokyo would look like a South American Barrio during the worst gangfights imaginable. Which is not the case.

Twelveseal
July 10th, 2012, 05:34 PM
I don't know if it would be that extreme, but yeah, it would certainly be a lot more chaotic than it is. It's like what Food's article was suggesting. The Yakuza are easier to deal with as the 'devil you know' than random, unorganized crime. If it's unorganized, sure, it's easier to catch them and prosecute them, but it's also a lot harder to control, predict, or prevent than actions taken by large organizations with a public 'face' that they try to maintain.

Arashi_Leonhart
July 10th, 2012, 07:04 PM
Also, it isn't just the "media depictions." While yakuza aren't really welcome in certain social situations--try going to a public bath with a tattoo larger than your thumb, it won't fly--and certainly some parts of society just completely avoid general association with them, they are also an integrated part of society that people have everyday ties to. Go to any festival, and guess who runs a good number of the booths? Some local businesses too...if it were all "baby rapists" and "murderers" then, man, going five feet down any road in Japan would net you quite a bit of danger.

Arturia
July 10th, 2012, 08:52 PM
It's a bit interesting, tbh.

*Rolls Eyes* I don't need to know every single gangster on earth to say they are all untrustworthy and bad. Going by your logic you could say Al Qaeda isn't without honor or integrity since you don't know every single terrorist on earth. Just use simple logic and follow the system that happens to them. Every time they commit a crime they will have a chance of getting caught and busted.

When (not if) that happens the gangster then has a choice: go to jail or go to jail.

If its a serious crime where they are facing 50+ years in prison for and the prosecutor offers them a deal to kick his sentence down to 3-5 years if he rats out everyone of his gang buddies what do you think he is going to do?

If you were in his shoes would you choose "honor" and "loyalty" that the yakuza are so famous for and send yourself to be someone's butt buddy for the rest of your natural life?

Or would you give yourself a second chance at freedom again?

Its human nature for self-preservation especially when you know your buddies would do the same to you if they get caught as well. The honor and shit is completely a lie. If it was true and the yakuza was so honorable then why would you see so many decent law-abiding Japanese steer clear of the Yakuza like the plague? Not exactly the kind of respect you would show to such an honorable and decent group.

If you want to see an organization with REAL honor and loyalty and integrity look at the police department or the army in the country you live in. They are true decent people who put their lives on the line everyday to defend the nation or put away scumbags with fake honor like the Yakuza. Those are the role models you should follow not cheap crooks too lazy and selfish to do an honest day's work.



I3uster:
You need to do more research and think more carefully before responding. At least take a Criminology 101 class in college or something man.

The glue that holds these organizations together is money and do you really think anyone would be making money if they tore the place apart like a Berserker Servant?

People "obey" the rules not because they are loyal or honorable but due to two important factors: threats and greed. The boss would not want his lackeys to try to steal his cash or usurp his control so he makes it very clear from the start any punk acting out of place gets a hole in his head and concrete shoes in the ocean.

And the incentive he uses is not the shitty pay he gives to the peasants but the dangling of gold in front of their eyes.

In other words the lackeys and street cannon fodder stay in line because they see potential rewards down the road should they make or steal enough money or get promoted later and have better opportunities to steal more money. So all the potential (or illusionary) rewards are there if they behave while death is their only reward if they get out of line.

Its a simple cost-benefit analysis you would learn it if you took a basic economics course in school. People can be stupid but they are also rational animals and will follow a logical path that benefits them the most.

Even those crazy Mexican cartels that frequently go to war with each other and leave a trail of bodies and are riddled with police informants and traitors still exist because all its members see more benefit (money) belonging to the organization and being loyal to the boss. Of course once they have an opportunity for a massive payday should they betray the group, they will gladly take it. If you search enough you can find plenty of cases of mafia members running away with several kilos of coke or millions of dollars of cash they "forgot" to turn over to the boss.

So Japanese Yakuza have all the members stick together because they know the boss is doling out bits and pieces of cash to them and if they were to bolt or revolt they would gain nothing when the Big Boss empties the banks accounts and flees to Switzerland to enjoy his retirement while they are left to fight over the scraps. But if they had a chance to takeover the boss's moneymaking empire they would gladly do so.

And most importantly violating the rules is not as important as breaking the rules and NOT GETTING CAUGHT. So Yakuza can kill someone who the boss forbids them from killing as long as they are not fingered as the triggerman and they set someone else up for the hit. Hypocrisy is an essential element in these groups after all.

And contrary to the popular stereotype Japan is not as safe as you think.

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/global/2012/04/handouts-hand-grenades-yakuza-gang-war-leads-explosive-bounty/50624/

Apparently grenades are the hot new thing to settle Yakuza disputes. Smells a little like Mexico don't you think? The only reason they didn't get too out of hand is either because they don't have as many grenades as their Mexican counterparts and/or they were not able to bribe as many police/judges to ignore them when they do use it.


As Japan has put into place increasingly harsher laws regulating the actions of the Japanese mafia, aka the yakuza, forcing many out of business--the remaining thugs are fighting viciously over what's left of the pie.

...

In addition to inter-gang warfare, as the police have cracked down on organized crime in the last two years, local organized crime groups have reacted violently to efforts to curtail their economic activities. When gang members aren't lobbing grenades or shooting at each other, they are shooting at the offices of companies trying to cut organized crime Last year, on Nov. 26, Toshihiro Uchino, the 72-year-old president of Hakushin Construction --which was trying to cut ties to local gangs---was shot to death outside his home in Kitakyushu.

...

"We’re not excited about the possibility of yakuza lobbing grenades into Tokyo offices and homes."
So far, hand grenades have not been deployed in Tokyo.

...

In May 2011, a 9-year old child found a hand grenade in a rice field in Iizuka, Fukuoka prefecture, and took it home to the astonishment of his father, who handed the object to the local police station two hours after he discovered it. According to the police, there were no yakuza gang headquarters where the grenade was found.




Also, it isn't just the "media depictions." While yakuza aren't really welcome in certain social situations--try going to a public bath with a tattoo larger than your thumb, it won't fly--and certainly some parts of society just completely avoid general association with them, they are also an integrated part of society that people have everyday ties to. Go to any festival, and guess who runs a good number of the booths? Some local businesses too...if it were all "baby rapists" and "murderers" then, man, going five feet down any road in Japan would net you quite a bit of danger.

Those legit businesses you are talking about is whats called "money laundering" (ie. using the cash they got from drugs, prostitution, gambling, loanshark, etc and reinvesting in lawful businesses to "clean" the money). Its basically what those Mexican and Columbian cartels also did reinvesting the dirty money into local communities to buy popular support (or at least acquiescence) to their presence.

Probably because Japan's a cash society this kind of thing doesn't really raise any eyebrows when shady men in dark suits walk over with suitcases full of cash to buy or start a local business. Its strange that the Japanese IRS doesn't try to investigate harder on this, they could follow the American playbook and bust a lot of the top oyabun on tax evasion charges a la Al Capone. What a missed opportunity!

Also make sure you don't piss people off or do wild things in the countryside or small towns in Japan. Japanese society looks safe on the surface with low crime but is it really because there is so little crime or could it be they just cover up/don't report the crimes that could be hidden?
http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2012/07/08/outrage-at-shiga-schoolboy-suicide-scandal/

In the news article above the Japanese care a lot about face and keeping skeletons hidden in their closets. This means EVERYONE from common citizens to even the local police will try to ignore or cover up small or large crimes if there is a reasonable chance they could get away with it. Noone in Japan wants their town known as a "dangerous" place by Japanese standards and lose reputation and more importantly money from lost investment, tourism, etc so ANYTHING bad will be covered up.

The only times when crimes are exposed are when its been posted on Youtube/blogs, the person killed was important, or so many people know about it a major coverup is impossible. But even if a crime is reported in Japan they try to keep it inside the house so to speak. Just a little research on Google.jp can come up with several murder/crime stories in Japanese press that doesn't even get reported in English.

Also have you heard of the Olympus scandal where the American former CEO exposed the company "forgeting" a billion dollars in an offshore Cayman Islands account that was reported by Japanese press to have belonged to "anti-social forces"? Do you really think a multi-national company like Olympus could lose so much money that their auditors, the Japanese IRS and SEC, and their shareholders don't even notice it much less find it suspicious and it takes a foreign gaijin CEO to blow the whistle in a single day? I have no doubt that though publically the Japanese govt congratulated him for his reporting this crime, privately they must hate his guts for shaming not just the company but embarrasing the whole country with this major scandal which someone in the govt must have known about (ie. shared the pie).

Yakuza are not an integrated part of Japanese society. This is like saying the Mafia is an integral part of Italian society or the Irish Mob for Ireland, etc. Can you say every Irish or Japanese person on earth is represented by their respective Mobs?

They are more like parasites that have infected their society through the cracks and the dark side of Japan and use this Face and Cover Up tradition in East Asian societies to profit.

None of those local townspeople want to challenge Yakuza not just because they are afraid for their own safety but because they don't want to rock the boat and cause unnecessary trouble for their town.

As long as the Yakuza do not cause Public disturbance in their crimes they will not be too badly burned by the local populace (host body) they infest. So they can commit murder and do drug dealing as long as they dispose of the bodies quietly and its done without fuss.

Mcjon01
July 10th, 2012, 08:58 PM
Japanese crimes only being reported in Japan in Japanese, color me surprised, must be a conspiracy. Oh, wait, that's just how news works derp.

Char
July 10th, 2012, 09:02 PM
Can you make a TLDR version?

I3uster
July 10th, 2012, 09:04 PM
You had a good run going, then you cited Sankaku complex.

Black Sword
July 10th, 2012, 09:07 PM
Mcjon, you actually live in Japan. Since Arashi's firsthand encounter with yakuza seem to have made zero impression on him, would you kindly correct Mike Jr. so we can get back to discussing how Leo's going to be asked to have a seat over there due to Mana?

SeiKeo
July 10th, 2012, 09:08 PM
Mcjon, you actually live in Japan. Since Arashi's firsthand encounter with yakuza seem to have made zero impression on him, would you kindly correct Mike Jr. so we can get back to discussing how Leo's going to be asked to have a seat over there due to Mana?

Pardon me, that's Alf, I don't go for the child as much.

Twelveseal
July 10th, 2012, 09:19 PM
Actually, that's a valid point. I'm surprised Alf isn't in this thread already.

Black Sword
July 10th, 2012, 09:26 PM
Wait, but last night on #notes, Leo was the accused lolicon... then weird shit happened.

Mcjon01
July 10th, 2012, 09:26 PM
I don't really see much Yakuza operation outside of the gambling, really.

SeiKeo
July 10th, 2012, 09:27 PM
Wait, but last night on #notes, Leo was the accused lolicon... then weird shit happened.

I'm a scapegoat.

Twelveseal
July 10th, 2012, 09:28 PM
What happens in #notes, stays in #notes.

Trolololol.

Lianru
July 10th, 2012, 09:33 PM
I'm a scapegoat.
lolololololol

Rowanism
July 10th, 2012, 09:33 PM
I have a dream. That one day suddenly all loli disappears from the world.

It will be a glorious day.








Then again, no Mirai Fukuin.

VelspertheCat
July 10th, 2012, 09:39 PM
Mcjon, you actually live in Japan. Since Arashi's firsthand encounter with yakuza seem to have made zero impression on him, would you kindly correct Mike Jr. so we can get back to discussing how Leo's going to be asked to have a seat over there due to Mana?

Cut the Mike Jr. stuff out. At least call the guy out for being his own 'unique' style of troll.

Twelveseal
July 10th, 2012, 09:39 PM
No. No it won't. That means that there will be no female children left, either. Which means that the species is dead.

Not cool.

Rowanism
July 10th, 2012, 09:42 PM
You are talking about young girls. I am talking about the virtualized glorification of drawn young girls.

Twelveseal
July 10th, 2012, 09:42 PM
Ah, nvm then.

Black Sword
July 11th, 2012, 12:27 AM
I'm a scapegoat.

http://images.wikia.com/yugioh/images/7/72/Scapegoat-BP01-EN-SFR-1E.png

Keyne
July 11th, 2012, 06:31 AM
http://i.imgur.com/g6qq8.jpg

bahamut zero
July 11th, 2012, 06:36 AM
long arm is long

ChiakiKakumei
July 11th, 2012, 10:44 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ti8tKjuByo&feature=related

Did someone said Yakuza?

Hen_Ichi
July 11th, 2012, 01:40 PM
old pic is old

Black Sword
July 11th, 2012, 03:00 PM
Seeing that pic, I'm kind of surprised the crazy Japs haven't defiled Kara no Kyoukai with a Mikiya-Azaka-Ryougi Shiki threesome doujin.

Keyne
July 11th, 2012, 03:02 PM
Seeing that pic, I'm kind of surprised the crazy Japs haven't defiled Kara no Kyoukai with a Mikiya-Azaka-Ryougi Shiki threesome doujin.
Not enough fuel for the fire.

ItsaRandomUsername
July 11th, 2012, 03:31 PM
Seeing that pic, I'm kind of surprised the crazy Japs haven't defiled Kara no Kyoukai with a Mikiya-Azaka-Ryougi Shiki threesome doujin.

If by "defile" you mean "completely awesome", then yes.

Keyne
July 11th, 2012, 03:48 PM
If by "defile" you mean "completely awesome", then yes.
I think he meant "defile" as in "defile", Irun. Not everyone sees things as you, you know.

ItsaRandomUsername
July 11th, 2012, 03:51 PM
And not everyone's like him, either. :V

Keyne
July 11th, 2012, 03:56 PM
:V

Gilgamesh
July 11th, 2012, 04:06 PM
I've never actually read Mirai Fukuin. I was under the impression it was two short stories and three mini manga chapters and the most exciting thing in it was that Mikiya and Shiki's daughter had insult lust for her father. Was I misinformed? Because I don't see that being a very exciting movie unless there was more going on or at least one solid narrative.

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 04:11 PM
Shiki fights a guy who can see the future and, well, crazy things happen that we don't entirely understand. Also the original Seo shows up.

Hen_Ichi
July 11th, 2012, 04:15 PM
iirc this is only the opening scene but....Shiki walking along and then turned into a bloody pasty splatter all over a car park via the use of several homemade claymore style bombs

BananaShiki
July 11th, 2012, 04:33 PM
iirc this is only the opening scene but....Shiki walking along and then turned into a bloody pasty splatter all over a car park via the use of several homemade claymore style bombs

This is gonna be great.

Char
July 11th, 2012, 07:40 PM
Couldn't she just cut the shrapnel with her servant level reflexes?

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 07:48 PM
Ignoring the protests that are sure to come, she isn't Lancer with protection from arrows, she doesn't even have a sword on hand, and then there is still the concussive blast.

Edit: it's kind of a moot point for what Nasu wanted to do with the story anyway.

Edit2:
The ceiling was low, and the line of sight poor, filled with columns, cars, and other obstacles.
The girl had no idea… couldn’t guess that I was here twenty metres away, in the shadows of the wagon.
Between me and the girl are three explosives.
On the roof of the parked cars were metal pipes. The gunpowder inside was each packed with about five hundred corundums, each a few millimetres in diameter. Due to the concentration of gunpowder, both ends of the pipe were sealed. These are not like the firebombs from before, meant for pure destruction; these were made specifically to kill this girl.
From the previous failures, I have successfully concluded the most efficient method of caging her.
Once they explode, the corundums will travel in all directions for ten metres. There are absolutely no route of escape in the three-point trap; there will be no one-in-a-million chances. I have already made sure that the corundums can reach the target. As for damage, there will only be the girl whose bones will be ripped from her flesh, the surrounding cars which will be scrapped, and the family who will appear from the elevator in ten seconds.

Looked back at the novel and that's the set up. So whether or not she has EX agility like Fate Extra claims seems a bit irrelevant.

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 08:43 PM
If she had Servant-level reflexes she would be able to fight Servants. :V

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 08:45 PM
Noble Phantasms are just too great an obstacle to overcome I guess.

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 08:46 PM
Even as an omnipotent god-thing she can only fight them defensively, despite seeing lines on them, and probably their NPs too. :V

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 08:50 PM
And yet she is somehow more powerful then Ciel and Kouma. And then Fate Extra happened with what I can only assume Nasu thought was a reasonable explanation. It is a mystery.

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 08:52 PM
It's not a mystery. Your golden age of wank is finally over, now that it's confirmed that she can kill Servants like any normal thing and still is unable to win against them.

I love you Nasu, your statement that should buff her for all intents and purposes killed Ryougi-wank...it's beautiful.

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 08:57 PM
But then Fate/Extra happened. Don't be surprised if Nasu has forgotten that moldy old Q&A from so long ago.

SeiKeo
July 11th, 2012, 08:58 PM
Buster mad his waifu no get cameo.

BananaShiki
July 11th, 2012, 08:59 PM
Void is all talk. She is not a god-thingy. At all.

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 09:01 PM
Apparently it was enough to convince Nasu she deserved the number 2 spot.

Before intersetting powerlevels there would be no reason at all to doubt what she's saying is true.

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 09:09 PM
She certainly is powerful. But not fast enough for a Servant. Human bodies tend to do that. :V

SeiKeo
July 11th, 2012, 09:10 PM
She certainly is powerful. But not fast enough for a Servant. Human bodies tend to do that. :V

Yeah, just like Shirou, and Kotomine, and Ciel, and...

oh

​do not take me seriously I am just posting for no good reason

VelspertheCat
July 11th, 2012, 09:13 PM
You forgot Shiki Tohno on that list, Leo.

Oh...

Lianru
July 11th, 2012, 09:15 PM
Yeah, stop leaving people out.

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 09:16 PM
1) borrows Servant strength
2) Reinforcement
3) Reinforcement

It's just funny to see terra grasp for more straws.
Did I mention that I love Nasu?

SeiKeo
July 11th, 2012, 09:17 PM
Wat, Kotomine no use reinforcement, at least not that I remember.

Lianru
July 11th, 2012, 09:18 PM
Command Seals?

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 09:18 PM
When he doesn't he can't fight Servants. He had to suckerpunch True Assassin, remember?

food
July 11th, 2012, 09:23 PM
Wat, Kotomine no use reinforcement, at least not that I remember.

Super Bajiquan always has the reinforcement component. That's what makes it "super".

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 09:41 PM
1) borrows Servant strength
2) Reinforcement
3) Reinforcement

It's just funny to see terra grasp for more straws.
Did I mention that I love Nasu?

He was borrowing no one's strength in Unlimited Blade Works and he was still fighting defensivly against Rider, a "Saber class defender", Archer, and Gilgamesh.

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 09:46 PM
Is this an attempt to downwank Servants? Because I'd be careful with that, that makes Ryougi even weaker...

It's like a fish out of the water...struggling against the new information downwanking his waifu. I shouldn't enjoy this as much as I do.

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 09:48 PM
How can I be downwanking them when you can just read the novel and see the scenes for yourself? I wouldn't necessarily call Kuzuki Saber class even with Caster's help but that's that I guess according to Nasu.

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 09:50 PM
Well, I wouldn't call what he did against Rider "fighting" if we are talking about how he was hung up on a tree, I'll give you Kuzuki, Archer was supernerfed and he fought Gil in UBW, which, once he deploys it, should fuck over a lot of Servants.

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 09:54 PM
He was only hung from the tree because he reacted to and blocked her surprise attack with his bare hand. And he dealt with a hostile Archer more then once, there was also that surprise attack that he reacted to and wasn't insta gibbered.

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 09:57 PM
I guess it's just plot armor then.

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 09:59 PM
But it was explained with "Saber training". Also memory inheritance I suppose.

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 10:00 PM
Let third Ryougi train with Saber then, maybe she'll be able to win against Servants.

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 10:45 PM
Actually didn't Kotomine jump down from the equivalent of 9 stories without reinforcing himself? Is Super Bajiquan Hero Kotomine stuff or just what he used all the time?

food
July 11th, 2012, 10:48 PM
Actually didn't Kotomine jump down from the equivalent of 9 stories without reinforcing himself? Is Super Bajiquan Hero Kotomine stuff or just what he used all the time?

Super Baijiquan is something he uses all the time. It is part of the reason why Kotomine is better than Risei, because he weaves magecraft into his half-baked Bajiquan (while Risei is all old school).

terraablaze
July 11th, 2012, 10:50 PM
I wasn't aware that the Church taught reinforcement. Also just noticed this again and it's hilarious:

He used Black Keys during ranged battle. A single throw, complete with preparatory movements, could be completed in 0.3 seconds. He could perform four separate throws in 0.7 seconds. His accuracy rate was 100% even when striking down unconfirmed targets, such as the illusions in the Einzbern forest. The blades themselves, half-spiritual entities, could penetrate iron.
That's bloody fast.

Anyway, reinforcement just fills in flaws right? It shouldn't be able to push you past normal human limits unless you're a freak and do something weird.

ItsaRandomUsername
July 11th, 2012, 10:52 PM
Reinforcement enhances the purpose of the object/part that is being reinforced. So if limbs utilizing martial arts techniques are what's being Reinforced...

I3uster
July 11th, 2012, 10:55 PM
Anyway, reinforcement just fills in flaws right? It shouldn't be able to push you past normal human limits unless you're a freak and do something weird.
Kuzuki was reinforced.

food
July 11th, 2012, 10:57 PM
I wasn't aware that the Church taught reinforcement. Also just noticed this again and it's hilarious:

That's bloody fast.


It's literally "Magic Fist", lol. It's what makes Kotomine such a great Executor. Deadly martial arts enhanced with magecraft.

よって死徒やら何やらと殴り合って
きた修羅場の数では、息子の綺礼の方がより凄惨である。もちろん魔術とも無縁であり、綺礼のような肉体強化 によるマジカル拳法を揮うわはでもない――が、綺礼の目から見れば「正調の八極拳 」という意味では父親の方が拳士として格上であるという認識だったのだろう。ただの殺人拳ではない、その先 の領域を求めて功を積み、到達した老人であった。


Anyway, reinforcement just fills in flaws right? It shouldn't be able to push you past normal human limits unless you're a freak and do something weird.
Depends. Low-tier is "filling the flaws".

High-tier Reinforcement enhances at a conceptual level. It's saturated with wank-ability.

Mcjon01
July 11th, 2012, 11:37 PM
Reinforcement fills up flaws in the conceptual structure. Modern humans are extraordinarily flawed, disgusting creatures. Lots of room for improvement.

Char
July 12th, 2012, 03:40 AM
Lol, I was being sarcastic when I said she had servant level reactions because I knew someone would try and wank her into Superman

terraablaze
July 12th, 2012, 06:08 AM
Well, since she has precognitiveish instincts they probably should be somewhere close by. Reacting to things before they happen will do that to you.

Rowanism
July 12th, 2012, 07:12 AM
I always thought Kotomine's badassery could only be explained with "It's Kotomine."

I3uster
July 12th, 2012, 07:27 AM
Well, since she has precognitiveish instincts they probably should be somewhere close by. Reacting to things before they happen will do that to you.
And she still loses to Servants. Probably too much passion in every strike for an omniscient being.

terraablaze
July 12th, 2012, 07:30 AM
That's Mind of Eye (True) noob!!!!1!1


“Don’t group others with the likes of you, Shiki. What you have is a sixth sense that can reel in the future just by hearing and imagining, whereas precognition has both foundation and proof.

Excerpt for those who are curious.

I3uster
July 12th, 2012, 07:33 AM
This requires slightly less passion to bypass then I guess.

terraablaze
July 12th, 2012, 07:35 AM
But it's essentially what Berserker and Kojiro get. Haven't seen anyone beat out them with passion.

Anyway, I was so totally mad when I saw people talking about the other functions of the 2nd because spoilerz and then I saw this rereading Mirai Fukuin:

“Chief, are there really precognitive abilities?”
“There are. There are a lot of different kinds, so they are all put together under the same label. At its most fundamental, it is just an abnormal ability to ‘see’. Exchanging signals with the future, or seeing a future then shifting into a parallel world – we won’t include the fakes. This man is probably a born psychic, so this is different from a magecraft divination, or religious prophecy.



What, are you telling me it was there all along?

Mcjon01
July 12th, 2012, 07:54 AM
It was common sense all along is what it was. Change the past = split off a new timeline = operation of parallel worlds. That's, like, the basics of the basics for every time travel story since the many worlds interpretation got popular.

terraablaze
July 12th, 2012, 07:56 AM
I suppose, but just shifting to a parallel world doesn't seem to include being able to go into the past or see the future. Unless he's shifting to worlds that are parallel but a bit behind or a bit fast.

Actually don't tell me, I want to see whatever cokesakto comes up with first.

Mcjon01
July 12th, 2012, 08:03 AM
It's "operation" of parallel worlds, man. Just because he can only shift between different worlds now because of his age, doesn't mean that the Magic itself is restricted to that. It can probably do anything even vaguely related to parallel worlds ever, Zelretch picked himself a pretty versatile domain to get omnipotent power in.

terraablaze
August 4th, 2012, 02:58 PM
http://www.tsukikan.com/misc/kara-no-kyoukai-movie-director-of-photography-terao-yuichi-interview.html (http://www.tsukikan.com/misc/last-talk-nasu-kinoko-takeuchi-takashi-conversation.html)

Guess I will put this here.

Break
August 4th, 2012, 03:24 PM
i didnt know Nasu had a subwriter. interesting.

terraablaze
August 4th, 2012, 03:27 PM
Whoops wrong interview.

There, the other one is still in the Complete Material 5 thread.

New
August 4th, 2012, 04:35 PM
And she still loses to Servants. Probably too much passion in every strike for an omniscient being.
That's because Void doesn't fight Servants.
There's no reason for her to do so. Even if she would have a reason to fight them, she could just remove them from herself denying their existence and having them disappear as a matter of course (everything that exists must exist in the records too). Or just change their past so that they don't become heroes. Infinite possibilities with infinite power. No reason to fight at all.
But she's so bored and doesn't take anything seriously that's why you don't get to see the true extent of her power.

Now, bow before the Goddess.

Even Gil is just half God and look at how strong he is.

Dartz
August 4th, 2012, 05:51 PM
Now that was funny.

New
August 4th, 2012, 06:09 PM
Well, of course I wasn't exaggerating at all..................... nop................ not one bit............. I think
But she is supposed to be able to change stuff in the Akasha, being Akasha herself. So, her limitations are Akashic Records's limitations giving her unlimited potential.
And fits her character. I mean, if you could have everything you wanted and could do everything you wanted with just a thought and have access to a place that has records of future past and present so that you can find anything you want, of course you'll be bored and with no will to live.

You
August 4th, 2012, 06:26 PM
“Chief, are there really precognitive abilities?”
“There are. There are a lot of different kinds, so they are all put together under the same label. At its most fundamental, it is just an abnormal ability to ‘see’. Exchanging signals with the future, or seeing a future then shifting into a parallel world – we won’t include the fakes. This man is probably a born psychic, so this is different from a magecraft divination, or religious prophecy.
No one raging about this part talking about the 5th then?

food
August 4th, 2012, 10:09 PM
Why rage?

It's basically a limited version of the Second, achieved purely via ESP.

Enhance
August 5th, 2012, 03:02 PM
Woah, I can't say anything aside what I'm writing typemooning typing now.

Too busy waiting.

New
September 25th, 2012, 08:11 AM
so, any news regarding this?

bahamut zero
September 25th, 2012, 08:17 AM
yes.

New
September 25th, 2012, 08:51 AM
yes.
Yes as in
"Yes, I'm trolling you"
or
"Yes, but I ain't telling you a thing"
?

bahamut zero
September 25th, 2012, 08:55 AM
Yes as in "I made a typo and actually meant no" :neco_arc:

Rowanism
September 25th, 2012, 08:56 AM
Happens to me all the time.

terraablaze
September 25th, 2012, 09:10 AM
There was news all the way back that this was a thing that was happening if that helps you at all. Seeing how you've been here a while probably not.

New
September 25th, 2012, 09:57 AM
I was expecting something like
"The release date was announced for dd.mm.yyyy"
or
"BD is already out" (ok, I wasn't really expecting this one)

A bit more then: Its going to be done.......................someday.............som eday.........

terraablaze
October 6th, 2012, 11:13 AM
Instead of making a whole new thread just for the movies in general, I'll just mention here they are going to be screening Overlooking View in "stereoscopic" 3D (how this is different from normal 3d I'm not sure) at...some point. They haven't mentioned a schedule yet. So yeah, totally useless to most of us but hey we post about cafes we'll never get to eat at so why not.

Hen_Ichi
October 6th, 2012, 12:41 PM
maybe to distinguish from 3D CG?

how the hell does 3Ding an anime work anyways? Spending millions on adding height maps to every frame?

Strife ❤️
October 6th, 2012, 12:52 PM
The same way post processing anything into 3d works I guess?

Hen_Ichi
October 6th, 2012, 01:00 PM
^

Spending millions on adding height maps to every frame?
But I thought it was expensive and shitty?

Paitouch
October 6th, 2012, 01:11 PM
It'll feel like you could trace the lines yourself!

terraablaze
October 6th, 2012, 01:47 PM
That one scene where Araya is holding Touko's heart out sort of at the camera but out of focus will look like he's holding the heart just under the camera, totally worth it!

Rowanism
October 6th, 2012, 04:57 PM
That one scene where Araya is holding Touko's heart out sort of at the camera but out of focus will look like he's holding the heart just under the camera, totally worth it!
Huehuehue

Crown
December 13th, 2012, 03:56 PM
So here's some Mana.

http://i.imgur.com/sBg37.jpg

bahamut zero
December 13th, 2012, 04:06 PM
I like the blurr

terraablaze
December 13th, 2012, 04:33 PM
Where is this from? The new Type Moon Ace?

Crown
December 13th, 2012, 04:35 PM
Prolly.

Hey terra, did you post before? I could have sworn I saw your username, clicked the thread and saw nothing but zero's post.

Hen_Ichi
December 13th, 2012, 05:09 PM
mmmm.... dat ZR

terraablaze
December 13th, 2012, 05:20 PM
Prolly.

Hey terra, did you post before? I could have sworn I saw your username, clicked the thread and saw nothing but zero's post.

Who's post?

bahamut zero
December 13th, 2012, 05:27 PM
.-.

etherlite
December 13th, 2012, 05:38 PM
Yea, it's from ace vol 8.

terraablaze
December 13th, 2012, 05:44 PM
^^
Oh right, I think of you as bahamut and edit the zero out as unnecessary. ^^^Yes, I did post before.

^
I see

Gabriulio
December 13th, 2012, 07:58 PM
Now I'm waiting even more eagerly for Mirai Fukuin.

hinode
December 13th, 2012, 09:56 PM
http://i.imgur.com/p1k3u.jpg

Doesn't seem like there was a whole lot about Mirai Fukuin in Type-Moon Ace 8. Still more than Girls' Work though, so for now I'm presuming it'll be released first.

terraablaze
December 13th, 2012, 10:26 PM
Seo!

Or at least I assume that's her.

Five_X
December 14th, 2012, 12:55 AM
mmmm.... dat ZR

She's not even a loli; she's an actual small child! D:

ItsaRandomUsername
December 14th, 2012, 01:10 AM
Don't be silly - a Mana Ryougi isn't a real person.

Rowanism
January 15th, 2013, 06:46 PM
So where's my PV?

terraablaze
January 15th, 2013, 06:59 PM
The Tsukihime Remake PV ate it. But seriously, was there really a PV for this yet? I thought the thing at Type Moon Fes was some rough sketches with text and music. Think we would have heard more about it otherwise.

hinode
January 15th, 2013, 07:04 PM
The amazon listing for the 10th anniversary BD box specifically mentions a 劇場版『空の境界』未来福音PV, so there's definately some sort of PV.

terraablaze
January 15th, 2013, 07:06 PM
Which is why I phrased it as "really a PV", because I don't accept a single piece of artwork that they released online separately any way and some throwaway track listing.

Magicholic
January 16th, 2013, 04:42 AM
Mirai Fukuin PV:
http://www.bilibili.tv/video/av442102/

bahamut zero
January 16th, 2013, 05:02 AM
manamanamanamanamana *__*

Rowanism
January 16th, 2013, 06:32 AM
Whoa this feeling, it's like I'm in 2006 again. These kind of trailers give me shivers Q_Q

Gabriulio
January 16th, 2013, 06:47 AM
Looks pretty good.

terraablaze
January 16th, 2013, 08:37 AM
Oh cool so there was actually a trailer beyond look at some unfinished concept art and key frames.

ZidanReign
January 16th, 2013, 10:43 AM
oh shit mana

now i'm hype

Tsuchimiya
January 16th, 2013, 10:44 AM
oh shit mana

now i'm hype

This. So hard.

terraablaze
January 16th, 2013, 10:49 AM
She shows up for one or two scenes. How is she the one thing everyone is looking forward to? Look at Seo! She's cute too and she'll show up for half the movie.

bahamut zero
January 16th, 2013, 11:00 AM
tell me the name of one other kid whose parents are protagonists of a nasu story.

Tsuchimiya
January 16th, 2013, 11:01 AM
tell me the name of one other kid whose parents are protagonists of a nasu story.

^ But you know, Seo is cool too.

terraablaze
January 16th, 2013, 11:07 AM
tell me the name of one other kid whose parents are protagonists of a nasu story.

I like Mana too and think she's one of the coolest things ever to show up, I just think you guys might want to recalibrate your excitement for a character you're going to see for 15 minutes tops if ufotable stretches it. I mean, I guess they could always expand the 2008 portion but still.

bahamut zero
January 16th, 2013, 11:09 AM
I like getting hyped and disappointed, I'm a TYpe-Moon Fanboy afterall~

terraablaze
January 16th, 2013, 11:20 AM
If there's a character who's only going to get a bit of screen time you should be excited for, it's possible Mama Shiki. Assuming they make her look different at all.

Black Sword
January 16th, 2013, 11:37 AM
She's Japanese. She'll look the same until she hits menopause and then she shrinks into a tiny little grandmother creature.

That said, holy shit, Mana!

Rowanism
January 16th, 2013, 12:20 PM
Dat HD tv.

Break
January 16th, 2013, 12:30 PM
if Nasu decides to go "KnK-the next generation" and have a story centered around Mana, i'll throw my money at said TV.

Five_X
January 16th, 2013, 12:46 PM
KnK, making lolicons out of everyone.

Rowanism
January 16th, 2013, 12:49 PM
It's not about her being a loli at this time of the story, it's about being Shiki's daughter. Whether she has the potential to be host for powers (and if not she can still be a magus) a story around her would be much more than just interesting. Solely to see what happened to all the people and stuff after all these years. It's pure admiration.

Black Sword
January 16th, 2013, 01:01 PM
He's promised to write a "how Azaka met Touko" story, so surely if we beg and whine enough, the dream of a Mana-centered series of stories is possible!

urca
January 16th, 2013, 01:45 PM
FUCKING HYPED!!!!
Also Mana <33

bahamut zero
January 16th, 2013, 02:29 PM
He's promised to write a "how Azaka met Touko" story, so surely if we beg and whine enough, the dream of a Mana-centered series of stories is possible!

I would rather want a "How Ryougi Mana was made" special.

Break
January 16th, 2013, 02:32 PM
i mean, unrelated to her beeing Ryougis daughter and eventual lolicon tendencies i might harbour *cough cough*, i also find her personality in itself, or at least the little weve seen of it so far, quite interesting. quite the philosophical mafia-princess she already is and all.

Black Sword
January 16th, 2013, 03:09 PM
Remember lolicons, she'll only like you if you're plain, can't say no to pretty girls, and have a non-working right eye.