PDA

View Full Version : Projection or MEoDP



Ikamato
October 22nd, 2013, 12:13 PM
Hi, I would be quite interested what's your favourite MC "power" is.

For me, I can't really decide since I like both.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 12:15 PM
We should have an MC that has both, and also the fifth magic and Aoko's insane mana processing efficiency. Brb, heading to the fanfiction forum.

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 12:16 PM
I thought this was asking which one I'd rather have at first. Good thing I read the OP before voting.

Kat
October 22nd, 2013, 12:18 PM
Shiki Ryougi is my favorite Type-moon MC, so the answer is obvious.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 12:20 PM
Mikiya is both the protagonist and heroine of KnK. Ryougi is just some side character.

Ikamato
October 22nd, 2013, 12:22 PM
We should have an MC that has both, and also the fifth magic and Aoko's insane mana processing efficiency.

And just make him a True Ancestor. Would be the most OP character ever.

Neir
October 22nd, 2013, 12:28 PM
>satoshi



anyway, I thought mystic eyes were cool, but making shit out of nothing is cooler.

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 12:30 PM
MEoDP is better for shounen power protag adventures

Projection is better for day to day life

Crown
October 22nd, 2013, 12:30 PM
Where is my demons manipulation option?

Screw this poll, it doesn't satisfy my needs.

Kat
October 22nd, 2013, 12:33 PM
Making shit of nothing is the First. Shirou still needs prana to pull-off temporary creation of NPs.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 12:37 PM
That's fanon, we don't actually know anything concrete about the first. Other than Ether Clumps and the Great Three might be related somehow, maybe.

Mare Boy
October 22nd, 2013, 12:37 PM
Projection. MEoDP is nice and all, but nothing to something > something to nothing for me. I also happen to be a fan of Conjurers in HxH.

Servant Shiki
October 22nd, 2013, 01:24 PM
I don't think I need to say it.

LJ3
October 22nd, 2013, 01:27 PM
That's fanon, we don't actually know anything concrete about the first. Other than Ether Clumps and the Great Three might be related somehow, maybe.

Enlighten me Mcjon. What are Ether Clumps and the Great Three.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 01:28 PM
Useless blobs of ether, and spoilers.

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 01:30 PM
Taiga, Neco and Amber

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:07 PM
MEoDP. Lets you fight characters way outside your tier without any obvious effects to you, unless you try and kill things you cannot think about easily.

bahamut zero
October 22nd, 2013, 02:09 PM
I choose Meodp, but I would rather have True Magic :/

eddyak
October 22nd, 2013, 02:09 PM
MEoDP. Lets you fight characters way outside your tier without any obvious effects to you, unless you try and kill things you cannot think about easily.
Except it's literally you seeing the end of everything you've ever known and loved, as well as the bad stuff. You forget that Shiki would've gone insane years ago unless he turned into an indifferent, soulless, joyless thing like Ryougi, if he didn't have those glasses.

Mare Boy
October 22nd, 2013, 02:13 PM
Seeing only two options makes me sad because we have yet to see a third original superpowered teenage harem male MC with issues so we can have an MC trio.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:15 PM
MEoDP. Lets you fight characters way outside your tier without any obvious effects to you, unless you try and kill things you cannot think about easily.

You don't get silly superhuman assassin skills just because you have the MEoDP, so you can't actually fight characters outside your tier. You'd probably just end up working as a faith healer in some third world shithole, killing people's diseases and wishing you were as charismatic and successful as your rival, Kotomine BEAUTIFUL.

Hopeluvjoy
October 22nd, 2013, 02:16 PM
I would love to have the eyes of depth perception. It would be really useful in day to day life.

Nihilm
October 22nd, 2013, 02:18 PM
Eh, I think MEoDP are cooler than projection/UBW. Though I really like them both.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:19 PM
Except it's literally you seeing the end of everything you've ever known and loved, as well as the bad stuff. You forget that Shiki would've gone insane years ago unless he turned into an indifferent, soulless, joyless thing like Ryougi, if he didn't have those glasses.

Everything ends at some point. Seeing it or conceptualizing it, all the same to me.

Mcjon, basic training in any form of knife style combined with MEoDP would mean you could fight people beyond your normal physical capacity. Was not saying that you become Nanaya-tier or anything like that.

Hopeluvjoy
October 22nd, 2013, 02:22 PM
Everything ends at some point. Seeing it or conceptualizing it, all the same to me.

Pretty much this. I already imagine how things will look broken anyway half the time. A bigger issue is it gives you high chances of your brain exploding.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:24 PM
Pretty much this. I already imagine how things will look broken anyway half the time. A bigger issue is it gives you high chances of your brain exploding.

In some cases it'd be interesting, going by the KnK movie visual, it'd be like vivisecting someone without actually having to do the work!

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:25 PM
Also note that the only reason Ryougi doesn't suffer any physical damage from her eyes is because she was the end product of the Ryougi Family Eugenics Program to create the perfect empty vessel. And even she still feels mental stress from looking at death.

Tohno's brain, on the other hand, is melted just from using his eyes no matter what he does, even if he doesn't purposefully strain himself. Since he's wielding power above his pay grade, so to speak.

Petrikow
October 22nd, 2013, 02:26 PM
My favorite MC power is Soujuurou's.

Being a countryside hick.

deimos
October 22nd, 2013, 02:27 PM
I would love to have the eyes of depth perception. It would be really useful in day to day life.
http://i.imgur.com/VeUgmHQ.png

Huitante
October 22nd, 2013, 02:27 PM
Projection in my eyes has an advantage of being a creative ability, in contrary to destructive MEoDP. But MEoDP is much more interesting and refreshing concept.

Can there possibly exist Mystic Eyes of Meta Death Perception? Ones which would allow to see the lines and points of death on lines and points of death.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:30 PM
Also note that the only reason Ryougi doesn't suffer any physical damage from her eyes is because she was the end product of the Ryougi Family Eugenics Program to create the perfect empty vessel. And even she still feels mental stress from looking at death.

Tohno's brain, on the other hand, is melted just from using his eyes no matter what he does, even if he doesn't purposefully strain himself. Since he's wielding power above his pay grade, so to speak.

If someone had an origin of "death" would they be extremely compatible with MEoDP, or is Ryougi the best you get?

Also projection is boring, would rather have head explode looking at something interesting.

Kat
October 22nd, 2013, 02:31 PM
I used to have Tohno Shiki like rage fits when I was kid. Nearly strangled my classmate in primary school and then stoned him to the point he still bears Harry Potter esque scar. And he looks like HP anyway. I was Voldemort before it was cool. So I shouldn't have MEoDP, too dangerous for enviroment.

eddyak
October 22nd, 2013, 02:31 PM
Everything ends at some point. Seeing it or conceptualizing it, all the same to me.
It really isn't. Take a look at the KnK movies, when Ryougi wakes up in the hospital- the flowers dying, the nurse falling apart into pieces- she had to become the emotionally deadened living zombie she is now to cope with it. Look at the other Shiki, waking up from nightmares when he was a kid about how easily everything died around him, how the people around him, and even the ground and the sky could fall apart at any moment.

Now imagine seeing that for the rest of your life- everything you ever knew or loved, everyone you ever knew or loved, all dead, every moment you looked at them. You can't control it, you can't stop it by closing your eyes, you couldn't stop seeing it even if you gouged out your eyes.

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 02:34 PM
It really isn't. Take a look at the KnK movies, when Ryougi wakes up in the hospital- the flowers dying, the nurse falling apart into pieces- she had to become the emotionally deadened living zombie she is now to cope with it.

Ah, but she also had Mikiya. Mikiya is the best T-M guy.

Neir
October 22nd, 2013, 02:36 PM
Yeah, Ryougi at least had a steady sex life.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:37 PM
It really isn't. Take a look at the KnK movies, when Ryougi wakes up in the hospital- the flowers dying, the nurse falling apart into pieces- she had to become the emotionally deadened living zombie she is now to cope with it. Look at the other Shiki, waking up from nightmares when he was a kid about how easily everything died around him, how the people around him, and even the ground and the sky could fall apart at any moment.

Now imagine seeing that for the rest of your life- everything you ever knew or loved, everyone you ever knew or loved, all dead, every moment you looked at them. You can't control it, you can't stop it by closing your eyes, you couldn't stop seeing it even if you gouged out your eyes.

Yeah. You seem to think this bothers me. I've never loved a person, merely the concept of a person's ideals. Everything I could love is more then likely replaceable, as it is probably some sort of machine or book.

Also if overload still exists, the rest of my life would most likely not be that long, and could you imagine the dreams you would get from seeing death all day? Sick as hell, and not only in the grim way!

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 02:37 PM
Yeah. You seem to think this bothers me. I've never loved a person, merely the concept of a person's ideals. Everything I could love is more then likely replaceable, as it is probably some sort of machine or book.

man, yo life must really fucking suck

Break
October 22nd, 2013, 02:40 PM
Yeah. You seem to think this bothers me. I've never loved a person, merely the concept of a person's ideals. Everything I could love is more then likely replaceable, as it is probably some sort of machine or book.



Okay that was chuuni as fuck.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:41 PM
man, yo life must really fucking suck

Eh, not really. Its just that nothing has interested me enough for me to care about it. I find the concept of unconditional love, such as loving your parents, to be silly.

EDIT: Break, you mean 'chuunibyou' or something else?ni

Neir
October 22nd, 2013, 02:42 PM
so edgy

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:42 PM
Yeah. You seem to think this bothers me. I've never loved a person, merely the concept of a person's ideals. Everything I could love is more then likely replaceable, as it is probably some sort of machine or book.

Also if overload still exists, the rest of my life would most likely not be that long, and could you imagine the dreams you would get from seeing death all day? Sick as hell, and not only in the grim way!

2edgy4me

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 02:42 PM
Eh, not really. Its just that nothing has interested me enough for me to care about it. I find the concept of unconditional love, such as loving your parents, to be silly.

You know, you don't have to love your parents unconditionally; if they molest and abuse you, I won't judge you for not loving them.
But not loving your parents is kinda sad.

Strife ❤️
October 22nd, 2013, 02:43 PM
Here I come, King of Heroes - do you have enough weapons in stock?

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 02:43 PM
Eh, not really. Its just that nothing has interested me enough for me to care about it. I find the concept of unconditional love, such as loving your parents, to be silly.

not only does your life suck, you're kind of a shithead

Nihilm
October 22nd, 2013, 02:44 PM
Eh, not really. Its just that nothing has interested me enough for me to care about it. I find the concept of unconditional love, such as loving your parents, to be silly.



Eh, I can sympathize with your point unconditional love is kind of silly, not having any love for your parents however is just kind of sad :/

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:45 PM
2edgy4me

Not trying to be edgy, it simply is.

Polly, people trying to force me to believe in their racist paranoid agenda aren't really my thing, especially when I am forced to be stuck with them due to money.

shithead, leo? why?

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:46 PM
Eh, not really. Its just that nothing has interested me enough for me to care about it. I find the concept of unconditional love, such as loving your parents, to be silly.

3edgy

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 02:46 PM
Not trying to be edgy, it simply is.

Polly, people trying to force me to believe in their racist paranoid agenda aren't really my thing, especially when I am forced to be stuck with them due to money.

shithead, leo? why?

because love your parents asshole, even if they're crazy racists

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:47 PM
Not trying to be edgy, it simply is.

oh god stop I can't take it

I can't

Kotonoha
October 22nd, 2013, 02:47 PM
Okay that was chuuni as fuck.
The most chuuni. The king of chuuni.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:47 PM
because love your parents asshole, even if they're crazy racists

Why?

Petrikow
October 22nd, 2013, 02:48 PM
because love your parents asshole, even if they're crazy racists

Stop forcing your confucian-sino cultural imperialism down my throat.

My parents raped me. metaphorically.

no not really

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 02:48 PM
Polly, people trying to force me to believe in their racist paranoid agenda aren't really my thing, especially when I am forced to be stuck with them due to money.

My parents are very conservative and narrow minded Catholics, and I'm a liberal godless lesbian. I still love them very much.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:49 PM
I can't decide if this guy is wearing a fedora or a pleather trench coat right now.

Kotonoha
October 22nd, 2013, 02:49 PM
Why not both?

Neir
October 22nd, 2013, 02:49 PM
I can't decide if this guy is wearing a fedora or a pleather trench coat right now.

Both.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:50 PM
Mental profile... complete.

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 02:50 PM
Stop forcing your confucian-sino cultural imperialism down my throat.

My parents raped me.

well i'm sorry for that but it's okay, you loved them even more than I did mine


I can't decide if this guy is wearing a fedora or a pleather trench coat right now.

MLP print t-shirt.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:50 PM
MLP print t-shirt.

You are so wise.

Kat
October 22nd, 2013, 02:51 PM
The thread derailed strangely quickly.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:52 PM
I can't decide if this guy is wearing a fedora or a pleather trench coat right now.

An orange Columbia sportswear shirt, meant for fishing. Oh, and blue jeans.

Polly, I'm not going into detail about my parents, for that is neither here nor there, and I doubt anyone would care.

Also, if someone here chooses projection, what would they want to project?

Neir
October 22nd, 2013, 02:52 PM
swords and shit. Duh.

Nihilm
October 22nd, 2013, 02:52 PM
The thread derailed strangely quickly.

People are in the mood to gang up on anyone that thinks differently today it seems.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:53 PM
swords and shit. Duh.

Shit projection? Unlimited Monkey works?

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 02:54 PM
People are in the mood to gang up on anyone that thinks differently today it seems.

i am indeed euphoric that i have used my powers of logic to determine that loving my parents is illogical.. in this moment, i am enlightened

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:54 PM
The thread derailed strangely quickly.

An emo spiel about how seeing the death of everything would be wonderful because you're a sociopath will do that.

Petrikow
October 22nd, 2013, 02:55 PM
People are in the mood to gang up on anyone that thinks differently today it seems.

I agree, if we had thought-crime laws in effect on BL we wouldn't even need to gang-up on people, it's so unnecessary.

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 02:55 PM
i am indeed euphoric that i have used my powers of logic to determine that loving my parents is illogical.. in this moment, i am enlightened

Please share your enlightenment with me, Leo. I want to be as wise as you are.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:55 PM
An emo spiel about how seeing the death of everything would be wonderful because you're a sociopath will do that.

Never said it would be wonderful, said it wouldn't bother me as much as Eddyak was saying.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:55 PM
People are in the mood to gang up on anyone that thinks differently today it seems.

Let us take a moment and weep for the pedophiles and psychopaths, for their plight is truly the greatest of them all.

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 02:56 PM
Please share your enlightenment with me, Leo. I want to be as wise as you are.

you should marry a man to propagate the specie

Credit
October 22nd, 2013, 02:56 PM
Not sure why that's Confucian-Sino Imperialism.

That's basic Christianitu right there.

Kotonoha
October 22nd, 2013, 02:57 PM
~~~****~~~
you laugh at me because i'm different
i laugh at you because you're all the same
~~~***~~~

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 02:57 PM
I think GNFNR is trying to say he's a Nihilist.

A very Chuuni Nihilist

Kat
October 22nd, 2013, 02:58 PM
I'm sure medicine will let lesbians procreate on their own without male semen in the equation.

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 02:58 PM
you should marry a man to propagate the specie

But whom to choose?! Who here has the best genes for me to take and pass on to my offspring?

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 02:59 PM
But whom to choose?! Who here has the best genes for me to take and pass on to my offspring?

the yellow man is appropriate for spreading the science skills we need for the 21st century

Nihilm
October 22nd, 2013, 02:59 PM
I think GNFNR is trying to say he's a Nihilist.

A very Chuuni Nihilist

Nihilism is a pretty interesting philosophy to be honest.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 02:59 PM
~~~****~~~
you laugh at me because i'm different
i laugh at you because you're all the same
~~~***~~~

We are not all the same, we are all very different.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 02:59 PM
Never said it would be wonderful, said it wouldn't bother me as much as Eddyak was saying.

Which is ridiculous, because no matter what your mental state is your brain is being forced into processing a channel that it is physically unequipped to handle. The point is that the ability isn't unsettling because you're afraid of losing things you love, it's unsettling simply because you're human, and humans don't see death. And that's discounting the actual brain melting.

Break
October 22nd, 2013, 03:00 PM
I guess projecting Books i've seen once in the store would save me a million bucks.

Kat
October 22nd, 2013, 03:00 PM
But the American science is SEKAI ICHI!

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 03:00 PM
It's not really true that everything can die. Types cannot die, Ryougi said it in MBAA and ORT is stated to have no concept of death. What food's puppet said it's basically "but Nasu is wrong" or "what these characters say is right and what those other characters say is wrong". You cannot partially lack the concept of death, you either have it or you don't, no two ways about it.

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 03:00 PM
the yellow man is appropriate for spreading the science skills we need for the 21st century

That's racist.

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 03:01 PM
That's racist.

If you prefer I could advise you to look for the long nose if you want to be financially secure?

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 03:01 PM
Nihilism is a pretty interesting philosophy to be honest.

I personally find it to be a really silly philosophy


Also a wild dartz appeared

Break
October 22nd, 2013, 03:02 PM
~~~****~~~
you laugh at me because i'm different
i laugh at you because you're all the same
~~~***~~~

technically, since we are all different by definition, it is normal to be abnormal aka the term normal by definition is contradictory.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 03:02 PM
It's not really true that everything can die. Types cannot die, Ryougi said it in MBAA and ORT is stated to have no concept of death. What food's puppet said it's basically "but Nasu is wrong" or "what these characters say is right and what those other characters say is wrong". You cannot partially lack the concept of death, you either have it or you don't, no two ways about it.

Everything dies. Cthulhu exists in the Nasuverse thanks to Zero, so canonically in some strange aeon even death will die. You just aren't counting the strange aeons, only the normal aeons.

Strife ❤️
October 22nd, 2013, 03:02 PM
Types cannot die

What about Archetype-Earth?

Ratman
October 22nd, 2013, 03:02 PM
I've had the board games room on a con some time ago, and there was a guy who spent quite a bit of time in it on the first day, playing against the preconstructed sinlge-color pauper MtG decks I've had for people with his (his words) esper control which was actually terrible, he had a single Sphinx's Revelation in it, like 12x situational counters, and 4x(or more? he drew it a lot) Tragic Slip without any other removal or creatures aside of Disciples sacrificing other Disciples, and Venser(with nothing for him to work with) and stuff. He had some other decks too, like Golgari and Elementals, but this one was the most memorable.
He kept lying to the people I've been trying to teach Magic about rules, because he kept losing to the pauper decks.
Then he stained one of the tables and himself with coke(nothing else, fortunately) and asked me to clean it up, so I've given him the piece of cloth I've had in the corner, and he stared at it for a while, as if he actually really had wanted me to clean it up.
When I've been closing and cleaning the room the first night, I've found a fedora lying in a corner on the floor, and couldn't remember anyone in one coming through, meaning it had to get in when I was out and someone else was taking care of the room, so I've hidden it.
Of course, this guy came on the third/last day, and asked me if he didn't leave his hat here.

I've never told this story to anyone, how did I ever forget it?

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 03:02 PM
Which is ridiculous, because no matter what your mental state is your brain is being forced into processing a channel that it is physically unequipped to handle. The point is that the ability isn't unsettling because you're afraid of losing things you love, it's unsettling simply because you're human, and humans don't see death. And that's discounting the actual brain melting.

I never discounted the fact that literal brain melt, however eddyak was saying stuff like imagine everything and everyone you love constantly in a state of death. I merely replied that would not bother me, it would be somewhat interesting, but not bothersome. The actual brain-melt however, probably painful. 'Probably'

Break
October 22nd, 2013, 03:03 PM
That's racist.

There are some genes of people who dont gain weight no matter what they eat in abundance on this board, at least.

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 03:03 PM
I never discounted the fact that literal brain melt, however eddyak was saying stuff like imagine everything and everyone you love constantly in a state of death. I merely replied that would not bother me, it would be somewhat interesting, but not bothersome.

http://i.imgur.com/Oyqh7vu.gif

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 03:04 PM
Chuunihilism

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 03:05 PM
There are some genes of people who dont gain weight no matter what they eat in abundance on this board, at least.

Wouldn't touch you with a 100-foot pole over the internet.

- - - Updated - - -


Chuunihilism

Seems more like sociopathy to me.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 03:06 PM
http://i.imgur.com/Oyqh7vu.gif

Scratch that, it would be bothersome trying to drive with cars exploding or falling apart in front of you! Could you imagine trying to read a traffic light when it kept spazzing out?

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 03:06 PM
I dunno, he doesn't seem to have the calculating depth and ability to properly mask his fucked uppedness of a sociopath

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 03:08 PM
I dunno, he doesn't seem to have the calculating depth and ability to properly mask his fucked uppedness of a sociopath

What is there to hide? I am merely expressing my thoughts, though I do not act all grim-dark seriousness in actual conversation.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 03:08 PM
Scratch that, it would be bothersome trying to drive with cars exploding or falling apart in front of you! Could you imagine trying to read a traffic light when it kept spazzing out?

You wouldn't literally see any of those things. All you would see are strange lines that make you start to freak out if you stare at them too hard, for reasons you can't understand.

Strife ❤️
October 22nd, 2013, 03:09 PM
Senpai Sensei would come and give you glasses!

Nihilm
October 22nd, 2013, 03:09 PM
Honestly it sounds less like sociopathy and more like being extreme desensitized

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 03:10 PM
You wouldn't literally see any of those things. All you would see are strange lines that make you start to freak out if you stare at them too hard, for reasons you can't understand.

Hmnn...the knk movie showed it differently, so sorry if I got a mistaken opinion on the view.

Ratman
October 22nd, 2013, 03:11 PM
But whom to choose?! Who here has the best genes for me to take and pass on to my offspring?

I could make glourious tall slavic kids in tracksuits with you as I would with any other.
Considering, on one hand you seem to be the outgoing kind of girl I tend to like, on the other, this speaks of my horrible taste, so decide for yourself.

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 03:11 PM
Seems more like sociopathy to me.

Sociopathy is an actual thing. This is "CRAWLIING IN MY SKIN!!" syndrome.

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 03:12 PM
Honestly it sounds less like sociopathy and more like being extreme desensitized

So it's sociopathy bordering on psychopathy?

- - - Updated - - -


Sociopathy is an actual thing. This is "CRAWLIING IN MY SKIN!!" syndrome.

I know, I'm just throwing fancy words around to sound smarter.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 03:12 PM
Sociopathy is an actual thing. This is "CRAWLIING IN MY SKIN!!" syndrome.

I've never listened to a whole linkin park song. Nor am I emo or whatnot, just my text in this appears to be. Trust me im a lot more happy in conversation.

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 03:13 PM
I've never listened to a whole linkin park song. Nor am I emo or whatnot, just my text in this appears to be. Trust me im a lot more happy in conversation.

DEAD INSIDE, DEAD INSIDE

You
October 22nd, 2013, 03:14 PM
Is this projection without UBW? cos then it's lame.

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 03:14 PM
I could make glourious tall slavic kids in tracksuits with you as I would with any other.
Considering, on one hand you seem to be the outgoing kind of girl I tend to like, on the other, this speaks of my horrible taste, so decide for yourself.

No, I want an Aryan superhuman, a man with whom I can make lovely blue-eyed Aryan babies.

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 03:15 PM
What is there to hide? I am merely expressing my thoughts, though I do not act all grim-dark seriousness in actual conversation.

yup, totally not sociopath behavior in the slightest

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 03:15 PM
What about Archetype-Earth?

AE is the baseline example we were given since in MBAA Ryougi said the problem wasn't her being unable to see her death, but the fact she had no death so there was nothing for her to see. This really destroys the notion of everything in the Nasuverse having an end, there are obviously existences that are paradoxical in nature, such as high-level Divine Spirits that shouldn't exist in the presnt but they do so anyway because they aren't affected by the time axis.

Also, stop it with the derail guys, at least keep the threat Nasu related.

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 03:15 PM
No, I want an Aryan superhuman, a man with whom I can make lovely blue-eyed Aryan babies.

oh well then you want break

Ratman
October 22nd, 2013, 03:16 PM
No, I want an Aryan superhuman, a man with whom I can make lovely blue-eyed Aryan babies.

Tak si trhni nohou, ty náno pitomá.

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 03:17 PM
oh well then you want break

I'm too old for him.

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 03:17 PM
oh well then you want break




Wouldn't touch you with a 100-foot pole over the internet.

It's like that guy who has all the time in the world to read every book and then his glasses break.

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 03:18 PM
Tak si trhni nohou, ty náno pitomá.

Oprosti ako sam te povrijedila.

Hopeluvjoy
October 22nd, 2013, 03:18 PM
Everything dies. Cthulhu exists in the Nasuverse thanks to Zero, so canonically in some strange aeon even death will die. You just aren't counting the strange aeons, only the normal aeons.

Remind me to throttle gen for that. Considering last time he almost woke up people where dying on the other side of the planet from the strain.


So it's sociopathy bordering on psychopathy?

- - - Updated - - -



I know, I'm just throwing fancy words around to sound smarter.

You said two words with the same meaning that are no longer in use and still managed to get the meaning wrong.

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 03:18 PM
yup, totally not sociopath behavior in the slightest

The funny thing is that if you read this line without sarcasm it's correct.

Break
October 22nd, 2013, 03:19 PM
Wouldn't touch you with a 100-foot pole over the internet.- - - Updated - - -Seems more like sociopathy to me.That hurts :( you dont even know meAlso i wasnt talking about just me, theres a whole bunch of us lightweights here on BL.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 03:20 PM
AE is the baseline example we were given since in MBAA Ryougi said the problem wasn't her being unable to see her death, but the fact she had no death so there was nothing for her to see. This really destroys the notion of everything in the Nasuverse having an end, there are obviously existences that are paradoxical in nature, such as high-level Divine Spirits that shouldn't exist in the presnt but they do so anyway because they aren't affected by the time axis.

「ふん、言ってろ吸血姫。
おまえが何であれ、
寿命が何万何億だろうと関係ない。」


「どっちにしろ夢の終わりだ。
行くぞ―――生きているなら、
神さまだって殺してみせる―――。」

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 03:20 PM
The funny thing is that if you read this line without sarcasm it's correct.

It's cause it's not sarcasm.

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 03:21 PM
It's cause it's not sarcasm.

But...but...

Dammit.

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 03:22 PM
The funny thing is that if you read this line without sarcasm it's correct.

Oxford's Medical Dictionary:

"Antisocial personality disorder: A personality disorder characterized by callous unconcern for others, irresponsibility, violence, disregard for social rules, and an incapacity for maintaining enduring relationships."


The question is; how many of these ring true for our friend here?

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 03:23 PM
Oxford's Medical Dictionary:

"Antisocial personality disorder: A personality disorder characterized by callous unconcern for others, irresponsibility, violence, disregard for social rules, and an incapacity for maintaining enduring relationships."


The question is; how many of these ring true for our friend here?

Who knows, but talking about it on the internet doesn't make a symptom.

Otherwise the human race is pretty screwed.

Break
October 22nd, 2013, 03:23 PM
I'm too old for him.

What month are you born again?

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 03:23 PM
「ふん、言ってろ吸血姫きゅうけつき。
おまえが何であれ、
寿命が何万何億だろうと関係ない。」


「どっちにしろ夢の終わりだ。
行くぞ―――生きているなら、
神さまだって殺してみせる―――。」

That just seems like boasting. We already know she cannot kill God.

SeiKeo
October 22nd, 2013, 03:24 PM
Oxford's Medical Dictionary:

"Antisocial personality disorder: A personality disorder characterized by callous unconcern for others, irresponsibility, violence, disregard for social rules, and an incapacity for maintaining enduring relationships."


The question is; how many of these ring true for our friend here?

Probably, he's on BL so probably, no evidence, probably, quite possibly given previous statements.

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 03:24 PM
That just seems like Ryougi boasting. We already cannot she cannot kill God.

Why is one Ryougi boasting and the other Ryougi being right, despite the fact that she has no real way of knowing when giving either statements?

Reiu
October 22nd, 2013, 03:27 PM
I'm sure medicine will let lesbians procreate on their own without male semen in the equation.
One day. (http://www.nature.com/news/stem-cells-egg-engineers-1.13582)

http://i.imgur.com/gn1fiCI.png

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 03:29 PM
Speaking of science and stuff.

Was there any follow up on that research to replace human skin with spider silk to make humanity Spider men?

Hopeluvjoy
October 22nd, 2013, 03:29 PM
Oxford's Medical Dictionary:

"Antisocial personality disorder: A personality disorder characterized by callous unconcern for others, irresponsibility, violence, disregard for social rules, and an incapacity for maintaining enduring relationships."


The question is; how many of these ring true for our friend here?

Less how many is true more is it damaging his life or the life of others? Impossible to say online. He might just be a cold person naturally or other factors could be involved.



One day. (http://www.nature.com/news/stem-cells-egg-engineers-1.13582)

http://i.imgur.com/gn1fiCI.png

I've always been interested by the possibility here. One could always use the possible future of this research to mass produce people based on the genes of a genius.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 03:31 PM
Why is one Ryougi boasting and the other Ryougi being right, despite the fact that she has no real way of knowing when giving either statements?

Because Ryougi is known for boasting; "I can kill God", when she can't, but she is not boasting in the first line. And she sees death, so of course she would know if the being she is seeing carries death or not. Besides AE said she herself cannot die too.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 03:31 PM
That just seems like boasting. We already know she cannot kill God.

「然り、語るまでもない。
この器は貴様を呼び出したモノの消去対象。
この星でもっとも遠大な寿命の顕現である。」

What do you call the end of a lifespan, Dartz?

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 03:32 PM
The beginning of a deathspan?

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 03:32 PM
Less how many is true more is it damaging his life or the life of others?

"Sociopathy" doesn't say anything about damaging anyone's life.

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 03:33 PM
One day. (http://www.nature.com/news/stem-cells-egg-engineers-1.13582)


But Hayashi and Saitou have little to offer to the infertile couples begging for their help. Before this protocol can be used in the clinic, there are large wrinkles to be ironed out.


Saitou and Hayashi have found that the offspring generated by their technique usually seem to be healthy and fertile, but the PGCs themselves are often not completely 'normal'. For example, the second-generation PGCs often produce eggs that are fragile, misshapen and sometimes dislodged from the complex of cells that supports them1 (http://www.nature.com/news/stem-cells-egg-engineers-1.13582#b1).

When fertilized, the eggs often divide into cells with three sets of chromosomes rather than the normal two, and the rate at which the artificial PGCs successfully produce offspring is only one-third of the rate for normal in vitro fertilization (IVF). Yi Zhang, who studies epigenetics at Harvard Medical School in Boston, Massachusetts, and who has been using Saitou's method, has also found that in vitro PGCs do not erase their previous epigenetic programming as well as naturally occurring PGCs. “We have to be aware that these are PGC-like cells and not PGCs,” he says.


In addition, two major technical challenges remain. The first is working out how to make the PGCs convert to mature sperm and eggs without transplanting them back into testes or ovaries; Hayashi is trying to decipher the signals that ovaries and testes give to the PGCs that tell them to become eggs or sperm, which he could then add to artificial PGCs in culture to lead them through these stages.


But the most formidable challenge will be repeating the mouse PGC work in humans. The group has already started tweaking human iPS cells using the same genes that Saitou pinpointed as being important in mouse germ-cell development, but both Saitou and Hayashi know that human signalling networks are different from those in mice. Moreover, whereas Saitou had 'countless' numbers of live mouse embryos to dissect, the team has no access to human embryos. Instead, the researchers receive 20 monkey embryos per week from a nearby primate facility, under a grant of ¥1.2 billion (US$12 million) over five years. If all goes well, Hayashi says, they could repeat the mouse work in monkeys within 5–10 years; with small tweaks, this method could then be used to produce human PGCs shortly after.

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 03:37 PM
All technology needs ironing out, Polly.

Think not of you right now.

Think of your Gender queer double post op great great great grand child of the future who wishes to be identified as a feline, but not a tabby cause fuck tabbys

Hopeluvjoy
October 22nd, 2013, 03:39 PM
"Sociopathy" doesn't say anything about damaging anyone's life.

That's the basics of what a personality disorder is. If it doesn't cause either others or themselves harm it can't be a disorder. It won't be mentioned because it's inherit in the category itself.

Reiu
October 22nd, 2013, 03:39 PM
Hey, looking on the bright side, that's a pretty short timescale when you compare it to some other fields (http://blogs.nature.com/news/2013/08/pitch-drop-custodian-dies-without-witnessing-a-drop-fall.html).

Biomed people so spoiled.

- - - Updated - - -


The beginning of a deathspan?
:neco_arc:

「星は晩年を迎えようと、人の歴史はいまだ幼年。」

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 03:44 PM
That's the basics of what a personality disorder is. If it doesn't cause either others or themselves harm it can't be a disorder. It won't be mentioned because it's inherit in the category itself.

Difficulties =/= harm.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 03:45 PM
「然り、語るまでもない。
この器は貴様を呼び出したモノの消去対象。
この星でもっとも遠大な寿命の顕現である。」

What do you call the end of a lifespan, Dartz?

It says manifestation of lifespan, it's not really saying she has a lifespan, just that she is manifesting for something that has one. Any other way it would contradict other statements such as TAs not having lifespan.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 03:51 PM
It says manifestation of lifespan, it's not really saying she has a lifespan, just that she is manifesting for something that has one. Any other way it would contradict other statements such as TAs not having lifespan.

I don't know, man. Couple that with Ryougi's comeback about it not mattering what she is or how many hundreds of millions of years her lifespan is, and that's an awful lot of lifespan talk for something with no lifespan.

Or do you really think that nitpicking word of god will let Arcueid survive not just past the end of the planet, but the ultimate end of existence itself?

Ikamato
October 22nd, 2013, 03:53 PM
「星は晩年を迎えようと、人の歴史はいまだ幼年。」

Anyone knows what that means? I feel like I'm the only one here who can't read Japanese T_T

Reiu
October 22nd, 2013, 03:55 PM
^

lifespan talk
.

- - - Updated - - -

Relating more to Nasu's general philosophy rather than making a specific argument though.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 03:56 PM
Anyone knows what that means? I feel like I'm the only one here who can't read Japanese T_T

The planet is on its last legs, but mankind's story is just beginning.

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 03:56 PM
Anyone knows what that means? I feel like I'm the only one here who can't read Japanese T_T

It's a comment on how even when the planet will die, human history will still only be beginning.

CompositeGNFNR
October 22nd, 2013, 03:56 PM
Oxford's Medical Dictionary:

"Antisocial personality disorder: A personality disorder characterized by callous unconcern for others, irresponsibility, violence, disregard for social rules, and an incapacity for maintaining enduring relationships."


The question is; how many of these ring true for our friend here?

Only disregard for social rules, and then only loosely. Just because I do not love anyone does not mean I am not concerned with anyone. I am responsible for all my actions, though that does not stop me from lying to protect myself occasionally. I've had plenty of friends for a multitude of years as well. Also the only time I've ever fought anyone the other person throws the first punch.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 03:57 PM
:neco_arc:

「星は晩年を迎えようと、人の歴史はいまだ幼年。」

Who gives a fuck about what Gil thinks? :mad:


I don't know, man. Couple that with Ryougi's comeback about it not mattering what she is or how many hundreds of millions of years her lifespan is, and that's an awful lot of lifespan talk for something with no lifespan.

Or do you really think that nitpicking word of god will let Arcueid survive not just past the end of the planet, but the ultimate end of existence itself?

But you said for all we know Types are destined to become Type Galactus and survive the end of existence in response to eddyak claiming Types will die from heat death. It's not cool if you change your argument just to argue with me. Will there even be an end of all existence in the Nasuverse?

You
October 22nd, 2013, 03:57 PM
Anyone knows what that means? I feel like I'm the only one here who can't read Japanese T_T

Even if the planet's at it's end, human history has yet to finish it's infancy.

Basically what they said in the new superman movie.

Hopeluvjoy
October 22nd, 2013, 03:57 PM
Difficulties =/= harm.

personality disorder

n (Psychiatry) Psychiatry any of a group of mental disorders characterized by a permanent disposition to behave in ways causing suffering to oneself or others.

Either way the disorder itself has to cause suffering/Difficulties. Which I would say is the disorder causing damage to either the persons life or the life of others for a long enough length of time. If neither is occurring it can't be a personality disorder.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 03:58 PM
But you said for all we know Types are destined to become Type Galactus and survive the end of existence in response to eddyak claiming Types will die from heat death. Are you changing your argument just to argue against me? Will there even be an end of all existence in the Nasuverse?

Yes, I am, and we know that there's an end to everything because that's the Root. The beginning of everything, and the end.

(And obviously you know I was joking, then, or you wouldn't be bringing it up now.)

You
October 22nd, 2013, 03:58 PM
But you said for all we know Types are destined to become Type Galactus and survive the end of existence in response to eddyak claiming Types will die from heat death. It's not cool if you change your argument just to argue with me. Will there even be an end of all existence in the Nasuverse?

Aoko can kill Types. Discuss.

Reiu
October 22nd, 2013, 04:02 PM
:mad:

That's just one quote I chose because it puts it succinctly and I posted it before so I don't have to recheck it.

Also:


Relating more to Nasu's general philosophy rather than making a specific argument



EDIT: Hey, and looking back I just realized that my prediction from nearly three months ago (http://forums.nrvnqsr.com/showthread.php/3574-Fate-Extra-CCC-Translations-SPOILERS?p=1253108&viewfull=1#post1253108) came true!

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 04:08 PM
Dartz doesn't believe in children outliving their parents. He thinks that it's a parent's duty to kill all their kids one by one as they come to see them off at the hospice, and barring that maybe just leaving some shotgun traps rigged around the house is fine too.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 04:10 PM
Yes, I am, and we know that there's an end to everything because that's the Root. The beginning of everything, and the end.

(And obviously you know I was joking, then, or you wouldn't be bringing it up now.)

Yet in Arc's info dump she stated she has no death/end during the night and knowing that also stated everything that has a beginning has an end. This doesn't really work if she has an end, it's completely contradictory. And when Shiki stated everything dies at some point he explicitly excluded Arc during the night.

You didn't sound like you were joking, because you answered a serious post from eddyak.


Also:

That sounds more like Gil's philosophy and his boundless hatred towards the planet. I don't think Nasu has stated the planet will die anytime soon in the mainverse. In the Extra verse it's obviously near dead after the pole shift though.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 04:14 PM
You're right, I would never answer a serious post with ridiculous nonsense.

- - - Updated - - -

And Arc at night was filled to the brim with death as soon as Shiki killed the world. Obviously, her deathless nature is contingent on the planet, and the fact that she's an extension of it. When the planet dies, she isn't going to keep getting special treatment.

Break
October 22nd, 2013, 04:17 PM
The fuck are you talking about, Dartz? Gil has near boundless hatred towards the gods, and love towards humanity; he does want humanity to leave Gaia and travel space, but it never says how he feels toward the planet itself. It could be hate, love, indifference, mild sympaths, whatever.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 04:18 PM
You're right, I would never answer a serious post with ridiculous nonsense.

Though your post was in a joking tone, the point you were arguing for was completely valid. Since it was an argument against the claim that even Types will die despite the fact that death doesn't exist for them. Claiming Types can die is basically saying "but the author is wrong!".

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 04:20 PM
Though your post was in a joking tone, the point you were arguing for was completely valid. Since it was an argument against the claim that even Types will die despite the fact that death doesn't exist for them. Claiming Types can die is basically saying "but the author is wrong!".

Just because they can't die doesn't mean they can't stop being alive.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 04:22 PM
The fuck are you talking about, Dartz? Gil has near boundless hatred towards the gods, and love towards humanity; he does want humanity to leave Gaia and travel space, but it never says how he feels toward the planet itself. It could be hate, love, indifference, mild sympaths, whatever.

Well Gods are part of the planet. IIRC they used to be something like the old Counter Force.


Just because they can't die doesn't mean they can't stop being alive.

But death is the termination of life.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 04:23 PM
But death is the termination of life.

lol, whatever you say, Roa.

Sherrinford
October 22nd, 2013, 04:25 PM
tl;dr

It's difficult to choose to me too, but I opted for MEoDP.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 04:30 PM
What about the Third Magic. It is supposed to grant true immortality.

Ossan99
October 22nd, 2013, 04:30 PM
@All
I was consumed my time what is MEoDP but I get what does it means in English. It is a tough question, I want need some time to which is better by my feeling.

Strife ❤️
October 22nd, 2013, 04:31 PM
@All
I was consumed my time what is MEoDP but I get what does it means in English. It is a tough question, I want need some time to which is better by my feeling.

直死の魔眼

Polly
October 22nd, 2013, 04:32 PM
What about the Third Magic. It is supposed to grant true immortality.

Not if you've got a soul-killing weapon it doesn't.

deimos
October 22nd, 2013, 04:37 PM
You're right, I would never answer a serious post with ridiculous nonsense.

- - - Updated - - -

And Arc at night was filled to the brim with death as soon as Shiki killed the world. Obviously, her deathless nature is contingent on the planet, and the fact that she's an extension of it. When the planet dies, she isn't going to keep getting special treatment.
Here:

http://i.imgur.com/ENF0Ld3.jpg
some supporting evidence.

Ossan99
October 22nd, 2013, 04:42 PM
@Strife212
Thank you for your following. I found this word meaning by my google search.

Huitante
October 22nd, 2013, 04:49 PM
What about the Third Magic. It is supposed to grant true immortality.
There was a discussion about that. The result is still killable by Shiki.

Kuradora
October 22nd, 2013, 04:57 PM
That sounds more like Gil's philosophy and his boundless hatred towards the planet. I don't think Nasu has stated the planet will die anytime soon in the mainverse. In the Extra verse it's obviously near dead after the pole shift though.

Man, it looks like all of Atlas is completely wrong. I guess Dust of Osiris must have been materializing a hallucination instead of the end of the world.

deimos
October 22nd, 2013, 05:07 PM
The planet died in Notes and Ado Edem killed Type Jupiter and Type Saturn; therefore, it should be possible to kill AE somehow.

You
October 22nd, 2013, 05:14 PM
But death is the termination of life.


"What are you going to do? Even if you have the same objective, that Cross and you are different things right? Then your body will be destroyed along with this city. You said you died instantly, but that's in our standards. I doubt the concept of death on this planet applies to a life form on another planet. Aren't you able to move already?"

They can Earth die. But they can't (insert planet) die on Earth.

Hopeluvjoy
October 22nd, 2013, 05:14 PM
The planet died in Notes and Ado Edem killed Type Jupiter and Type Saturn; therefore, it should be possible to kill AE somehow.

I always kind of think of it as sure you can kill a type. But it is possible they could like 2000 years down the line wake up or something.:nasu:

You
October 22nd, 2013, 05:15 PM
Ado Edem killed Type Jupiter and Type Saturn; therefore, it should be possible to kill AE somehow.
He Earth killed them. He didn't Jupiter kill Jupiter.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 05:18 PM
Man, it looks like all of Atlas is completely wrong. I guess Dust of Osiris must have been materializing a hallucination instead of the end of the world.

It's the Dark Six's ritual what causes the end of the world. As of now it could very well be averted, it's not like the Atlas people are the strongest in Nasuverse Earth. Oh and what Dust materialized (rather extracted) was the replica of the end of the world that Arc envisioned, nothing more.

Kuradora
October 22nd, 2013, 05:26 PM
It's the Dark Six's ritual what causes the end of the world. As of now it could very well be averted, it's not like the Atlas people are the strongest in Nasuverse Earth. Oh and what Dust materialized (rather extracted) was the replica of the end of the world that Arc envisioned, nothing more.

Strength is irrelevant. They all QED'd that the world was going to end and there was nothing that humanity could do to stop it.

Even if Arc envisioned it, it was still the term of Zepia's contract with Altrouge, so it is more than what Arcuied invisioned.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 05:37 PM
Strength is irrelevant. They all QED'd that the world was going to end and there was nothing that humanity could do to stop it.

Even if Arc envisioned it, it was still the term of Zepia's contract with Altrouge, so it is more than what Arcuied invisioned.

Humanity, maybe, but Arc might have the power to save the world, it's her job after all. All I'm saying is the fate of the main verse isn't set in stone, whatever the Atlas people believe. Even if there is a 0.000000001% chance of salvation, there is a chance Nasu would still make it possible.

Arc created it through her imagination, it's not like she traveled through time, saw the end of the world, went back and recreated it. It was all in her head.

ChronoReverse
October 22nd, 2013, 05:39 PM
I prefer MEoDP. Shiki should become a doctor. Tohno Shiki, M.D.

Gives new meaning to "under the knife"

Ratman
October 22nd, 2013, 05:41 PM
The M.D. stands for "Most Dangerous (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffl4HDp-_S4)".

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 05:41 PM
it's truly something how dartz' RM can shift the world to a Arc centric existence.

Ikamato
October 22nd, 2013, 05:47 PM
I''m still new here ... do you often change the theme so many times? From Projection or MEoDP to Types, to Arc and so on XDD

Nihilm
October 22nd, 2013, 05:47 PM
I''m still new here ... do you often change the theme so many times? From Projection or MEoDP to Types, to Arc and so on XDD


Yes, this is a common occurence.

Ikamato
October 22nd, 2013, 05:49 PM
Yes, this is a common occurence.

Haha, I see, well at least I know it now, thank you.

Daiki
October 22nd, 2013, 05:56 PM
Best MC power? Shooting down giant flying crosses.


We should have an MC that has both, and also the fifth magic and Aoko's insane mana processing efficiency. Brb, heading to the fanfiction forum.

You said you would do it, you can't chicken out now.

Kuradora
October 22nd, 2013, 06:14 PM
Humanity, maybe, but Arc might have the power to save the world, it's her job after all. All I'm saying is the fate of the main verse isn't set in stone, whatever the Atlas people believe. Even if there is a 0.000000001% chance of salvation, there is a chance Nasu would still make it possible.

Arc created it through her imagination, it's not like she traveled through time, saw the end of the world, went back and recreated it. It was all in her head.

The end of the world is set in stone it's common fan knowledge that Gaia is dying. It's not about what Atlas magi believe, it's the fact that every single one of them comes to the same conclusion with nothing but logic. There's no chance of saving the world.

That aside, note how even Arc doesn't go all: "What the heck are you talking about? End of the world?" She accepts it as fact and explains how Dust of Osiris' record plan is obsolete.

My point with Zepia and Altrouge is that they both agreed that that particular moon would be the end of the contract. Unless she can read Altrouge's mind, it's likely the real end of the world.

At the end of the day, the planet dies.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 07:30 PM
In 8 billion years the planet is gonna fall into the sun anyway, so, you know, good luck with that one, Arc.

mAc Chaos
October 22nd, 2013, 07:49 PM
Arc VS The Sun

Ratman
October 22nd, 2013, 07:52 PM
The Sun is just some guy behind a prop whose stand is a fireball. I don't see him having a chance.

Kuradora
October 22nd, 2013, 09:11 PM
The Sun is just some guy behind a prop whose stand is a fireball. I don't see him having a chance.

Stands are OP.

Oblivion
October 22nd, 2013, 09:19 PM
I think I would choose MEoDP.
Yes, you will live with the burden of those eyes, but if you stumble upon Aoko and she randomly gives you some weird looking glasses, you will live your life just fine with the ability to kill almost anything, given the right circumstances.

That's enough for me at least.

deimos
October 22nd, 2013, 09:30 PM
Arc VS The Sun
The Sun (and its future Red Giant phase) win.
http://i.imgur.com/o8wBosA.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/I35BD59.jpg

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 09:49 PM
The end of the world is set in stone it's common fan knowledge that Gaia is dying. It's not about what Atlas magi believe, it's the fact that every single one of them comes to the same conclusion with nothing but logic. There's no chance of saving the world.

That aside, note how even Arc doesn't go all: "What the heck are you talking about? End of the world?" She accepts it as fact and explains how Dust of Osiris' record plan is obsolete.

My point with Zepia and Altrouge is that they both agreed that that particular moon would be the end of the contract. Unless she can read Altrouge's mind, it's likely the real end of the world.

At the end of the day, the planet dies.

That fan knowledge became obsolete when it became clear Land of Steel is an alternate verse (coming from Extra verse). The world won't die anytime soon without the occurrence of a cataclysmic event, as it happened in the Extra verse and the Tsuki no Sango verse. The Sixth is said cataclysmic event.

Arc being casual about anything like she always is doesn't prove anything.

Again, unless Arc can see into the future she is not going to know how the Moon in the future looks. And it's not like there aren't infinite amounts of paralel worlds, just because one future is the most likely outcome, doesn't mean another different future can't exist. Unless you bring proof that there is an absolute zero chance the planet might survive in the main verse, then you are wrong.

The planet won't die without an event that causes destruction on a planetary scale. Stay mad.


In 8 billion years the planet is gonna fall into the sun anyway, so, you know, good luck with that one, Arc.

Isn't Amaterasu the sun itself? Archetype vs Amaterasu :p

LJ3
October 22nd, 2013, 10:15 PM
Humanity, maybe, but Arc might have the power to save the world, it's her job after all.

Isn't this stretching a bit? By that, I mean role as world savior.

Kuradora
October 22nd, 2013, 10:22 PM
Arc being casual about anything like she always is doesn't prove anything.
Unless you bring proof that there is an absolute zero chance the planet might survive in the main verse, then you are wrong.

The planet won't die without an event that causes destruction on a planetary scale. Stay mad.


That would hold water if it wasn't serious Arc instead of casual Arc.

Also, Melty Blood clearly states that the world will end. Not that it might end.



"Any highly−skilled alchemist can find the path to it after hard work. We have none of the qualms a sorcerer would.
Anyone could find the answer after knowing everything about this world and making precise calculations.
That unchangeable end.
Atlas is a warehouse of madmen.
Even knowing that there is an inescapable end, they come up with ways to try and resist it.
But the more they come up with these ways, the worse the future destruction becomes.
There is no salvation. Working to achieve a world of equality, we try to read the future and manage it. But from the very beginning, there was nothing but destruction waiting.
I thought. And thought. And thought. And thought. And thought. And thought. And thought. And thought. And thought. And thought. And thought. And thought......!!
Yes, I simulated all the different ways!
But no matter what method is used, the future is steered only towards a more grotesque fate!
I went mad. All alchemists who foresee the impending destruction go mad. Defying the future as if crazed. That is truly going crazy.
───Ah, since you bear the name Atlasia, you will eventually fall into that pit.
Successor Atlasia, you will go crazy while falling into hell and calculating new destruction!
I───challenged that.
Making the impossible possible is what it means to be Atlasia.
I became a vampire to increase my own abilities to obtain that miracle."
Bold mine.

Try harder, Dartz.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 10:23 PM
Isn't this stretching a bit? By that, I mean role as world savior.

Not really. Zepia truly believed that becoming Arcueid, a True Ancestor, would give him the power to defeat the Sixth. So Arc having a chance against the Sixth is not really fanboy belief, but it was Zepia's last resort and the reason of all the events in Melty Blood.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 10:26 PM
And Arcueid was Sion's last resort for a vampirism cure, and look how that turned out.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 10:28 PM
That would hold water if it wasn't serious Arc instead of casual Arc.

Also, Melty Blood clearly states that the world will end. Not that it might end.

Arc is always serious regarding casual stuff, doesn't mean she doesn't always stay calm and collected. Just because she doesn't go "what the fuck?" doesn't mean she agrees with what Zepia and Dust profess.

Again, it all comes down to stopping the Sixth. Just because the means necessary to do that aren't available to Atlas alchemist or humanity doesn't mean they aren't avaialble to someone like Arc or extremely rare humans like Shiki.

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 10:29 PM
I wonder if Alt was like "Go bug my dumb baby sister, maybe she'll get something or whatever"

You
October 22nd, 2013, 10:30 PM
Again, it all comes down to stopping the Sixth. Just because the means necessary to do that aren't available to Atlas alchemist or humanity doesn't mean they aren't avaialble to someone like Arc or extremely rare humans like Shiki.

This is called plot. I'm sure Mcjon's MC could stop the Sixth.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 10:31 PM
And Arcueid was Sion's last resort for a vampirism cure, and look how that turned out.

Well, Arc is kinda whimsical like that.

- - - Updated - - -


This is called plot. I'm sure Mcjon's MC could stop the Sixth.

Well, that's partly my point.

Kuradora
October 22nd, 2013, 10:34 PM
Arc is always serious regarding casual stuff, doesn't mean she doesn't always stay calm and collected. Just because she doesn't go "what the fuck?" doesn't mean she agrees with what Zepia and Dust profess.

Again, it all comes down to stopping the Sixth. Just because the means necessary to do that aren't available to Atlas alchemist or humanity doesn't mean they aren't avaialble to someone like Arc or extremely rare humans like Shiki.

Then why, when she is explaining Dust's obsoleteness, doesn't she explain that part as well? She did tell Sion that there was no cure for vampirism after all.(Although she was wrong about that.)

Except that they have enough knowledge that Sion can make plans for and even predict Arcueid.
It can therefore easily be inferred that some alchemists have engineered potential solutions involving Arc, only for my prior quote to hold true and it to result in even greater destruction. They'd likewise have made plans involving strange humans since super-rare abilities like MEoDP are something that mages just know about.

You
October 22nd, 2013, 10:37 PM
They'd likewise have made plans involving strange humans since super-rare abilities like MEoDP are something that mages just know about.

This sounds like a commentary on basement dwellers and how we should fear them.

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 10:39 PM
didn't we already confirm NEETs > Heroes

Arashi_Leonhart
October 22nd, 2013, 10:40 PM
Whar blow-shit-up magecraft or beat-down punchcraft, depending on definition of MC?

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 10:41 PM
Then why, when she is explaining Dust's obsoleteness, doesn't she explain that part as well? She did tell Sion that there was no cure for vampirism after all.(Although she was wrong about that.)

Except that they have enough knowledge that Sion can make plans for and even predict Arcueid.
It can therefore easily be inferred that some alchemists have engineered potential solutions involving Arc, only for my prior quote to hold true and it to result in even greater destruction. They'd likewise have made plans involving strange humans since super-rare abilities like MEoDP are something that mages just know about.

She was in her apathetic and lofty Princess Arc mode. Not even normal serious Arc.

Just let it go, man. Sion only predicted non serious Arc, she admited she would become swiss cheese if Arc was serious predictions or not. Zepia is the most proactive of alchemists and he believed becoming Arc would grant him power to defeat the Sixth, he didn't even know Arc's full power until he became her (what makes you think the average alchemist or even Sion would?), only then did he realize the extent of her power and how he could never control her. And the MEoDP is an ability so rare that even True Ancestors consider it to be a fairy tale, there is no way it would be common sense among magi, let alone Atlas alchemist including it in their plans as a possible solution.

Kuradora
October 22nd, 2013, 10:46 PM
Just let it go, man. Zepia is the most proactive of alchemists and he believed becoming Arc would grant him power to defeat the Sixth, he didn't even know Arc's full power until he became her (what makes you think the average alchemist or even Sion would?), only then did he realize the extent of her power and how he could never control her. And the MEoDP is an ability so rare that even True Ancestors consider it to be a fairy tale, there is no way it would be common sense among magi, let alone Atlas alchemist including it in their plans as a possible solution.

Don't miss my point. Canon already says that the end of the world cannot be stopped. You can't argue with that. I'm not going to spend my evening shooting down you hypothetical 'what-if' scenarios.

Tobias
October 22nd, 2013, 10:46 PM
While I don't intend to get into the entry of the argument, its likely alchemists have at least some ability to predict death perception and incorporate it into their calculating models as zepia predicted the death of Nero chaos well before he ever went to misaki

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 10:47 PM
Whar blow-shit-up magecraft or beat-down punchcraft, depending on definition of MC?

you can't have Nasu waifu power set

and too Neckbeard to be manly bear puncher

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 10:50 PM
But this isn't about what we want.

It's just about what's cooler.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 10:50 PM
Don't miss my point. Canon already says that the end of the world cannot be stopped. You can't argue with that. I'm not going to spend my evening shooting down you hypothetical 'what-if' scenarios.

Stop being childish. You accept Zepia's claims that alchemists have no way to stop the destruction of the world yet deny his strong belief that becoming Arc would give him the power to save it. You entire argument can be summoned up to "I don't like it so it's not true".

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 10:52 PM
But this isn't about what we want.

It's just about what's cooler.


too bad, your collective unconscious mind has already put it forth. if anything, curse your existence for being so narrow.

You
October 22nd, 2013, 10:52 PM
While I don't intend to get into the entry of the argument, its likely alchemists have at least some ability to predict death perception and incorporate it into their calculating models as zepia predicted the death of Nero chaos well before he ever went to misaki

Maybe they calculated the wrong side of the moon.

Mcjon01
October 22nd, 2013, 10:53 PM
Now that you bring it up, yes, I do trust the judgment of the Zepia from before he drove himself insane way more than the judgment if the Zepia from after.

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 10:54 PM
Beside, setting aside matters of Zepia being right or not, "Zepia with Arcueid's power" is not the same as "Arcueid".

Zenieth
October 22nd, 2013, 10:54 PM
Now that you bring it up, yes, I do trust the judgment of the Zepia from before he drove himself insane way more than the judgment if the Zepia from after.

but he has such a personable smile.

Kuradora
October 22nd, 2013, 11:00 PM
Stop being childish. You accept Zepia's claims that alchemists have no way to stop the destruction of the world yet deny his strong belief that becoming Arc would give him the power to save it. You entire argument can be summoned up to "I don't like it so it's not true".

Nope. I just dropped trying to argue against your points because they no longer have worth to me. Canon says that the end is inevitable. You can't say otherwise.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 11:03 PM
Now that you bring it up, yes, I do trust the judgment of the Zepia from before he drove himself insane way more than the judgment if the Zepia from after.

Insane Zepia managed to become part of the Sixth, even though he didn't manage to overwrite it. Insane or not he made great progress after trying. And it's not like alchemists can gauge Arc's full power, he likely doesn't even know Archetype's existence or how powerful she is.

- - - Updated - - -


Nope. I just dropped trying to argue against your points because they no longer have worth to me. Canon says that the end is inevitable. You can't say otherwise.

No, you just don't want to admit you just lost the argument and are now keeping this just to save face. It's your argument the one that never had any worth and placed a single likely scenario against an infinite number of possibilities. And stop making it seem like it was Word of God, it was Zepia who said so and he was explicitly talking about the means used by alchemists, nvm the fact he believes becoming Arc might give him power to defeat the Sixth.

You
October 22nd, 2013, 11:04 PM
Insane Zepia managed to become part of the Sixth, even though he didn't manage to overwrite it. Insane or not he made great progress after trying.

A for Effort.

Kuradora
October 22nd, 2013, 11:05 PM
No, you just don't want to admit you just lost the argument and are now keeping this just to save face. It's your argument the one that never had any worth and placed a single likely scenario against an infinite number of possibilities. And stop making it seem like it was Word of God, it was Zepia who said so and he was explicitly talking about the means used by alchemists, nvm the fact he believes becoming Arc might give him power to defeat the Sixth.

Don't be so childish, Dartz. I found no merit in your arguments, so I stopped bothering. Stop trying to bait me into arguing with you.

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 11:06 PM
And stop making it seem like it was Word of God, it was Zepia who said so and he was explicitly talking about the means used by alchemists, nvm the fact he believes becoming Arc might give him power to defeat the Sixth.

Come on, this was the one time you could have brought up that a guy who has seen the future says that the end is totally escapable and have it work out in your favor.

You know you want to do it.

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 11:10 PM
Don't be so childish, Dartz. I found no merit in your arguments, so I stopped bothering. Stop trying to bait me into arguing with you.

Sure, Kuradora, you are free to believe that.


Come on, this was the one time you could have brought up that a guy who has seen the future says that the end is totally escapable and have it work out in your favor.

You know you want to do it.

Well, it was a possibility he believed in. I wouldn't say totally escapable, but the possibility is there, however small it might be.

lolque
October 22nd, 2013, 11:32 PM
But there are some people with True Magics (specially Zelretch, despite being weakened), powers that can change the Reality, Mystic Eyes of Death Perception and all those strange things. If no one of these can stop the end of the world, why Arcueid could? I mean, it's for power? I think Zelretch and in general True Magic users can overcome that (I don't say they win in a versus against Arc, but the thing they made are more impressive and without logic, no?) It's for concept? I don't know, but we don't overestimating Arcueid a little bit?

Dartz
October 22nd, 2013, 11:36 PM
Eh, it's debatable if all those things are superior to Arc. Gaia does make things superior to Magic like Avalon, even if it can't do Magic after all. At any rate I think it had more to do with her immortal durable body.

lolque
October 22nd, 2013, 11:42 PM
Eh, it's debatable if all those things are superior to Arc. Gaia does make thoings superior to Magic like Avalon, even if it can't do Magic after all. At any rate I think it had more to do with her immortal durable body.

But if you can use something without any logic that desestabilize the Sixth in any form (I don't know how the Magics works, for example Aoko's Magic), don't you be more perfect for the mission than someone with a great immortality? I mean, if Arcueid doesn't have the power (or the concept, or the illogical) to make that rupture... doesn't matter how powerful she is in numbers. She need to be special in this case. I don't know if I'm explained xD.

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 11:45 PM
But if you can use something without any logic that desestabilize the Sixth in any form

You imply that we know what the Sixth actually is.

We don't.

lolque
October 22nd, 2013, 11:50 PM
You imply that we know what the Sixth actually is.

We don't.

I always thinking of it at something like a chain of events that makes the world fall into the end, not really a abrupt thing. But, yeah, so much assumptions :S

You
October 22nd, 2013, 11:51 PM
You imply that we know what the Sixth actually is.

We don't.

It's the imaginary Sixth Magic, the power to make everyone happy.

Wallachia was trying to be a party-pooper. So is Arc according to Dartz.

We should all embrace the Sixth.

Siriel
October 22nd, 2013, 11:53 PM
I always thinking of it at something like a chain of events that makes the world fall into the end, not really a abrupt thing. But, yeah, so much assumptions :S

If it was just a chain of events, Zepia's body shouldn't have been destroyed by it.

Unless he was trying to stop an explosion or something, but that seems doubtful.

Break
October 23rd, 2013, 01:30 AM
Guys, guys, calm down. Okay the end of the world is inevitable, and okay, some twerp will likely come along and save it anyways, because that always happens when Nasu says something is impossible/inevitable/unavoidable. He just likes the phrasing.

aldeayeah
October 23rd, 2013, 07:05 AM
Can there possibly exist Mystic Eyes of Meta Death Perception? Ones which would allow to see the lines and points of death on lines and points of death.

Maybe with some strange aeons.

(EDIT: and then i saw mcjon ninja'd this quote. great job.)

- - - Updated - - -


It's not really true that everything can die. Types cannot die, Ryougi said it in MBAA and ORT is stated to have no concept of death. What food's puppet said it's basically "but Nasu is wrong" or "what these characters say is right and what those other characters say is wrong". You cannot partially lack the concept of death, you either have it or you don't, no two ways about it.

Something that can't die, is probably something that was never alive to start with.

aldeayeah
October 23rd, 2013, 07:24 AM
TAs not having lifespan


That is the lifespan of those that don't have a lifespan

:ciel:

- - - Updated - - -


lol, whatever you say, Roa.

See, that would certainly explain his infatuation with Arc!

eddyak
October 23rd, 2013, 11:57 AM
nvm the fact he believes becoming Arc might give him power to defeat the Sixth.
To overcome the sixth. Or, at least, that's what every translation I've read has said. It could be the Sixth Magic, or the Sixth Sister, or the Sixth Law, or the Sixth Whore of Babylon. Maybe he doesn't think his undulation is good enough to overcome her hip-swaying, and needs Arc's 'leet stripping skillz to stand a chance.

CompositeGNFNR
October 23rd, 2013, 12:33 PM
It's clearly the sixth sin.