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View Full Version : Grail War RPs Discussion : Troubleshooting, Best Practices, War Stories



You
November 3rd, 2017, 01:04 AM
I know there are a lot of people on this forum who participate in Grail War RPs whether on this site, on other sites, or even through messaging apps like skype, discord or IRC.
There isn't though, a thread to about Type-Moon and more specifically Grail War RPs in a general sense.
I hope this thread will serve to guide and question processes and how people make Grail War RPs: how they go, what they lack, what worked, etc.
And also serve as a place for members of this forum to share their stories in hopes of inspiring others or maybe warning against a so-called action or attitude.
Or even collaborate on ideas for Type-Moon RPs.

To start the thread off so there's not just a blank space, I've always had this question of how to best approach applications and restrictions for applications. Or well since I've never made my own RP, question how other GMs implement it.
So when you want to get a a Grail War RP together, you want ideally 7 Servants and 7 Masters. There are many that have more. There are a few that have less.
Most of the time you will not get enough applicants or you will get too many.
On BL, the best sheets get in and that fits with the RP culture here because it's p cliquey so you trust the people you RP with. And if there are new faces, its only one or two people so its manageable, and they got in based on quality or numbers.
But there are a lot of other RPs where they'll accept as many people as possible from the interest check or its first come first serve.
Either way, when most people make applications for Grail War RPs they want to play as Servants, Heroic Spirits. So in an open application you get a giant amount of Servants and not enough Masters.

So the way this is usually remedied is by having each player make one Servant and then one Master. At least everyone will be paired up.
But the issue with that is, you end up either having to roleplay a pair or you end up having a finger in two pies. And these two pies will never come into conflict because people don't want to risk their characters. To maybe they'll even form a team. Make that usually.

So the options for a Grail War RP Character Distribution mainly goes:
1 person = 1 character
1 person = 1 pair
1 person = 1 Servant and 1 Master but not a pair
1 person = 1 Master, All Servants are GM controlled
1 person = 1 Servant, All Masters are GM controlled
1 person = x Servants and x Masters, clusterfuck ensues
1 person = x number of characters max, end up with Master-less Servants roaming

These are my experiences and I believe they all have detrimental disadvantages.

What pros and cons do you see in these set ups or have experienced? Have you seen different set ups that weren't mentioned? Do those work better or even worse? How has the setup of characters affected your RP experience; was it positive or negative?
If this isn't a question you're interested in, say something else that you've noticed about Grail War RPs that work or do not work or want to just talk about.

I hope this thread doesn't die and becomes a mainstay, since as long as BL remains there's going to be a lot of Grail War RPs and people who want to participate in them.

Soldat der Trauer
November 3rd, 2017, 02:38 AM
(...Oh, to hell with it, I've been talking about this on irc for years!)

>One thing I've seen is that many GMs (on various sites) don't really push for an engaging Masters roster, aside from maybe a circle of guys who've played a couple times before in the past (and keep doing so), and so can roll with one another's actions much more easily. These GMs tend to be rather straight-laced or hardliner on the whole "modern humans suck compared to antecedent humans" angle of the Nasuverse, even though (to a point!!!) that's not really an absolute in official narratives themselves.

The obvious problem is that what Masters do end up accepted tend to try copy-pasting Fate/Zero wholesale, doing the whole "schemers in the dark" crap, trying to manipulate the other teams while engaged in half-hearted information campaigns, or wandering around town nigh at random and conveniently triggering some sort of encounter. Bleh, it comes off as unimaginative after 10 bloody threads of this same goddamn formula. I know we have to do our best with the setting lore and mechanics as they are before the next series installment gets announced, but come on: enough with the bloody cookie-cutter setups!

Then there are GMs who go the opposite extreme and relax general powerlevels waaaaay too much, and just go full pink mohawk on the action and characterization, and all of a sudden to a newcomer it's like "what if Fate was written as TTGL?" But in either case, I've heard people say that Fate's biggest draw is the Servants, so who cares about the Masters? There's rarely incentive to really get applicants to send in something as well done as the uber Servant of clan Macleod, and beyond interpersonal interaction it seems to seep into rulings on just what an accepted Master can even do.

Bird of Hermes
November 3rd, 2017, 03:51 AM
(Never had the chance to be in a Grail RP myself) but I think what would be best would be if enough people signed up you could have seven masters and seven servants and have one player play as one character, either human or super fighting ghost. In order to stop masters getting sidelined then each person would need to submit one of each.

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I could be completely wrong though

34
November 3rd, 2017, 08:05 AM
I remembered when I once RP'd on an anon chatting site, it was one giant clusterfuck...

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 08:48 AM
Bleh, it comes off as unimaginative after 10 bloody threads of this same goddamn formula.
hey at least people in those threads submit different characters instead of the same edgy schemer in the dark

Rafflesiac
November 3rd, 2017, 10:42 AM
I've only been in the one, but 14 RPers, each on a Master or a Servant seems ideal, except for two things. The first being that the GM suffers immensely from balancing all of them and the moment they're gone it's all over (though that's the case for most RPs). The second being that with 14 people, the moment one of them bails large chunks of the story grind to a halt and the corresponding players are stuck as well. A friend of mine ended up quitting a Grail War RP solely because his Master didn't post for months.

Lycodrake
November 3rd, 2017, 10:49 AM
Grail Wars are cursed here on BL.

You
November 3rd, 2017, 11:54 AM
(...Oh, to hell with it, I've been talking about this on irc for years!)

>One thing I've seen is that many GMs (on various sites) don't really push for an engaging Masters roster, aside from maybe a circle of guys who've played a couple times before in the past (and keep doing so), and so can roll with one another's actions much more easily. These GMs tend to be rather straight-laced or hardliner on the whole "modern humans suck compared to antecedent humans" angle of the Nasuverse, even though (to a point!!!) that's not really an absolute in official narratives themselves.

The obvious problem is that what Masters do end up accepted tend to try copy-pasting Fate/Zero wholesale, doing the whole "schemers in the dark" crap, trying to manipulate the other teams while engaged in half-hearted information campaigns, or wandering around town nigh at random and conveniently triggering some sort of encounter. Bleh, it comes off as unimaginative after 10 bloody threads of this same goddamn formula. I know we have to do our best with the setting lore and mechanics as they are before the next series installment gets announced, but come on: enough with the bloody cookie-cutter setups!

Then there are GMs who go the opposite extreme and relax general powerlevels waaaaay too much, and just go full pink mohawk on the action and characterization, and all of a sudden to a newcomer it's like "what if Fate was written as TTGL?" But in either case, I've heard people say that Fate's biggest draw is the Servants, so who cares about the Masters? There's rarely incentive to really get applicants to send in something as well done as the uber Servant of clan Macleod, and beyond interpersonal interaction it seems to seep into rulings on just what an accepted Master can even do.

yeah i agree
I've rped with people who made some really great Servants
but the Masters have always been lackluster or literally sit at home

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(Never had the chance to be in a Grail RP myself) but I think what would be best would be if enough people signed up you could have seven masters and seven servants and have one player play as one character, either human or super fighting ghost. In order to stop masters getting sidelined then each person would need to submit one of each.

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I could be completely wrong though
Then you get into the issue that soldat was talking about whether due to unfamiliarity with the setting or lack of interest, fucking someone else over

Soldat der Trauer
November 3rd, 2017, 04:13 PM
>I mean, it's possible to mitigate some of the issues where it concerns team arrangements with just seven players, provided you don't let them RP a discrete duo. White Wolf had that setup with its line of Wraith games, where players pulled double duty as one another's Shadows, whose job was to intentionally screw the relevant host over. Though predictably, you run the risks of players getting salty with one another, as well as the more likely problem of players holding an advantage of two discrete sets of information pertaining to an equal number of teams (at the very least).

Honor code is fine and dandy to believe in upholding, but with unfamiliar groups, it can be nerve-wracking. Although perhaps a clever or deviant enough GM could harness even that, to be fair; plenty of traditional, non-D&D style TRPGs (especially from Europe) rely on reading of the players over reading of the "game pieces", especially through communication. Would definitely be somewhat a different style. So, who knows?

>On the topic of Masters, maaaaybe something could be accommodated if, just as Servants are divided by Class, GMs implemented an "archteype" setup. I know quests tend to make use of something similar during their own chargen, but it's usually too vague/broad. I'm thinking something more in the vein of what @Elyrin introduced a while back in two games, or even.... Crap, was it @RacingR who ran Ijyou no Kyoukai? I know @Bloble experimented with it in World of Evil, too.

Much more specific builds a GM would be able to anticipate, yet still loose enough for applicants to exercise creative liberties within established guidelines. Best of all, whether the GM in question is the sort to draft story notes ahead of play or otherwise prefers to improvise based on the final roster, they'd still be able to theoretically tailor a narrative campaign to their choosing, instead of risking being blindsided by a cluster fuck of loose ends because they allowed applicants too much leeway from the get-go.

Servants might be the agents which move the narrative, but it really should be the Masters who set it in motion.

Draconic
November 3rd, 2017, 05:03 PM
Good points all around. I agree completely.


...but the Masters have always been lackluster or literally sit at home
The key, I think, is to have a plot that keeps the Master relevant. They have to be able to participate in ways that a Servant can't. We have a ton of Servant sheets in the Create-A-Servant threads and it should really be the players' focus to work on a Master who's interesting.

Just an idea of a potential story gimmick that I wrote down in the IRC, I'll post it here just to keep it around. I don't know if it's worth expanding on, I would hope it is, but I'll leave that up to the masses.


Some magical artifact appears. It has properties similar to a grail, but it's an anomaly of sorts. For instance, it appeared seemingly on its own--it wasn't put wherever it is by humans(mages), and maybe it even created the setting in which the game will take place, i.e. it pulls an island out of the ocean or creates a fortress in the sky, some shit like that. The Characters are chosen by this Grail-thing not through command seals, but rather because it steals something or someone important to them. What/Whoever it is, they'll have vanished, and the artifact is calling out to the Character somehow. Anyway, the game will require the players have to explore the interior of this (island,castle,labyrinth,gargantuan frozen dessert, etc.) to find this magical artifact, as well as whatever they lost. their Servants come along, and from there, Things™ can Happen.

Bird of Hermes
November 3rd, 2017, 07:04 PM
Just outright giving someone a literal plot device but perhaps giving them a secondary goal would be more engaging,alternatively give them new abilities as it progresses. For example in one RP I saw one of the Masters transformed into a Dead Apostle (which is what the character was researching to loop it all in together)

I3uster
November 3rd, 2017, 07:19 PM
I personally prefer duos because the powerlevel disparity can result in less agency for the Master player though if you have a nonstandard setup like Verg did for M/W you can go ahead and do that.

That imo is the main thing though, you need some way to have GM agency and not just have a player dukeout arena. Once it turns either into a game of chicken or a massive battle clusterfuck the whole thing will just die. Think of a good setup and actually try to make it a story. In every Fate spinoff the war part itself is the least interesting thing about the story which is why Apocrypha is bad. Logistics are secondary to getting the basic necessities of an RP down.

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 07:47 PM
hey hold on get this nobody has tried a grand order rp yet

zikari8
November 3rd, 2017, 07:48 PM
hey hold on get this nobody has tried a grand order rp yet

I'm sorry...

Rafflesiac
November 3rd, 2017, 07:54 PM
hey hold on get this nobody has tried a grand order rp yet
That sounds uniquely painful in a way few Replace Shirou fanfics ever achieve

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 07:57 PM
[x] don't need to have masters, no power disparity, people can have fun with servants
[x] varied campaign settings
[x] completely variable player counts
[x] up with the kids

I3uster
November 3rd, 2017, 08:02 PM
That'd be kinda PvE which does kinda cut into the appeal of GWs specifically doesn't it

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 08:04 PM
everyone says they want to pvp but nobody wants the consequences, dudes need to look into their heart and just have a happy dungeon crawl

zikari8
November 3rd, 2017, 08:57 PM
Guys, I got it! Apocrypha Grail Wars but both sides have been Amakusa'd!



Competitive PvP between Factions
Teamwork and interactions within Factions
No need for masters since they've all been Amakusa'd, no power disparity, full servant fun
No finger in two pies dilemma; There's only two pies and you have to be in one
Currently relevant and contemporary


There are definitely no weaknesses with this idea.

I'm like time travel servant dungeon crawling though

Bloble
November 3rd, 2017, 09:22 PM
Then the RP turns into "how can I kill my own Amakusa".

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Verg's M/W had a good thing happening, but it was the players, as with most RPs, that let it down. One person deciding not to post can screw over everyone else and, with how many people are typically needed for a Grail War, that's almost guaranteed to happen unless you've deliberately picked people who won't stop posting or can be bullied into it.

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Actually nvm M/W died because the GM did. Just pick any other Grail War RP then.

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 09:30 PM
Then the RP turns into "how can I kill my own Amakusa".

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Verg's M/W had a good thing happening, but it was the players, as with most RPs, that let it down. One person deciding not to post can screw over everyone else and, with how many people are typically needed for a Grail War, that's almost guaranteed to happen unless you've deliberately picked people who won't stop posting or can be bullied into it.

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Actually nvm M/W died because the GM did. Just pick any other Grail War RP then.
This is why my favorite theoretical RP design doc was Fate/Extra where every poster had one Master/Servant team and also GM'd for another player

You
November 3rd, 2017, 09:48 PM
This is why my favorite theoretical RP design doc was Fate/Extra where every poster had one Master/Servant team and also GM'd for another player
how did this work?

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Guys, I got it! Apocrypha Grail Wars but both sides have been Amakusa'd!



Competitive PvP between Factions
Teamwork and interactions within Factions
No need for masters since they've all been Amakusa'd, no power disparity, full servant fun
No finger in two pies dilemma; There's only two pies and you have to be in one
Currently relevant and contemporary


There are definitely no weaknesses with this idea.
It's actually a p bad design.
Because there's nothing holding the teams back, they just derpcharge each other and try to beamsword or whatever as many people dead as possible.

Milbunk
November 3rd, 2017, 09:51 PM
While watching teams going all out in hilarious mayhem is a pretty interesting thought it does remind me of that one fast battle focused grail war that happened a few years back.

I also like the Extra idea, it was more representative of the tournament style grail war with a higher focus on the battles at the end of the week against the gm based team. Potentially it would have had the players finally meet up near the end but they never got that far.

Also I still like grail wars as an RP concept even if it's notoriously hard to pull off, and believe me when I say I've tried again and again to get them working.

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 09:55 PM
how did this work?
It didn't, really, it was just a design draft. But the logic went like:

GMs have to post for 5-10 players, which as a rule is more than most GMs can handle. People don't post once a day.
Players getting updated every 10 days or so was slower than most players wanted.

So, cut out the asymmetry, where the GM is the single point of failure. But to do that you need something that can mostly work PvE so the individual GM-player pairs can stay isolated, and at the time that was the only close to canon TM setting you could do it in - that also carried the side benefit of being able to reshuffle GM pairings every dungeon cycle.

The sad part is that I thought this would be easier than just running an RP with a 300 word/post limit which would have solved the same problems.

Rafflesiac
November 3rd, 2017, 10:00 PM
Whoa whoa whoa, a word limit?

How am I supposed to feel horribly inadequate whenever other people post with one of those around?

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On a different note, how would people have something like a mind-reading NP, Eye of the Mind, or feints work?

Leftovers
November 3rd, 2017, 10:03 PM
Whoa whoa whoa, a word limit?

How am I supposed to feel horribly inadequate whenever other people post with one of those around?

With overcompensating CGs.

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An EXTRA-based RP always seemed like a concept worth revisiting if only because it imposed a tighter schedule and clearer goals through the setting's rules and limitations. Less time idling about in dead time doing fuck-all.

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 10:03 PM
Whoa whoa whoa, a word limit?

How am I supposed to feel horribly inadequate whenever other people post with one of those around?

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On a different note, how would people have something like a mind-reading NP, Eye of the Mind, or feints work?
Why would you take a mind-reading NP anyway in a forum RP, just read his IC posts my dude

Leftovers
November 3rd, 2017, 10:04 PM
An EXTRA-based RP always seemed like a concept worth revisiting if only because it imposed a tighter schedule and clearer goals through the setting's rules and limitations. Less time idling about in dead time doing fuck-all.

*Theoretically, always, given how long a day can last IC.

Rafflesiac
November 3rd, 2017, 10:11 PM
Why would you take a mind-reading NP anyway in a forum RP, just read his IC posts my dude
Isn't that cheating though? For the thought processes revealed, anyways?

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 10:15 PM
Isn't that cheating though? For the thought processes revealed, anyways?
well

yes but I know you've been in a BL RP before

just metagame

Rafflesiac
November 3rd, 2017, 10:18 PM
FMWR never got far enough to metagame

RacingeR
November 3rd, 2017, 10:18 PM
*Theoretically, always, given how long a day can last IC.

we've had IC days last IRL years

it really wouldn't fix speed issues

Rafflesiac
November 3rd, 2017, 10:18 PM
And Verg survived my lethal attempt to nonlethally suppress him through sheer dumb luck

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 10:19 PM
we've had IC days last IRL years

it really wouldn't fix speed issues
yeah turns out it really just did need the word limit

I3uster
November 3rd, 2017, 10:43 PM
Word limits are a windmill, some people do 5k in a day then don't post a 500 word post in several days.

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 10:45 PM
What does that have to do with windmills?

I3uster
November 3rd, 2017, 10:49 PM
remind me not to try to translate expressions

Anyway word limits wont get rid of delays, you need GM discipline and penalize non-posting. Those are the only 2 things that have been shown to work.

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this is kinda hitting non GW-RP discussions isn't it

Rafflesiac
November 3rd, 2017, 10:50 PM
You were talking about tilting at windmills, right?

Draconic
November 3rd, 2017, 10:50 PM
…you need some way to have GM agency and not just have a player dukeout arena. Once it turns either into a game of chicken or a massive battle clusterfuck the whole thing will just die. Think of a good setup and actually try to make it a story. In every Fate spinoff the war part itself is the least interesting thing about the story which is why Apocrypha is bad. Logistics are secondary to getting the basic necessities of an RP down.
So basically, what you need to do is have an overarching story taking place, and there should be non-player entities that pose severe threats, such that even if certain players are looking to duke it out between Servants, there’s always a chance that they’ll end up having to ally with one another because, just for example an anomaly opens up and drops some sort of eldritch monstrosity on them. And by the end of the encounter, they may have new priorities or loyalties.

Hell, or it could work in a similar way that it does in SE.RA.PH. Not quite the same of course: I was thinking something along the lines of if an encounter isn’t resolved within a certain number of posts (per player, and determined by various factors only known to the GM), some sort of ‘random event happens that can either alter the situation, or even move the story along.

RacingeR
November 3rd, 2017, 10:51 PM
remind me not to try to translate expressions

Anyway word limits wont get rid of delays, you need GM discipline and penalize non-posting. Those are the only 2 things that have been shown to work.

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this is kinda hitting non GW-RP discussions isn't it

So maybe I should penalize you for not posting in Titan? :p


But yeah back to GW RP talk.

Rafflesiac
November 3rd, 2017, 10:52 PM
What's the farthest a GW RP has gotten? Was it the one where Lantz got killed?

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 10:54 PM
we did it lads, we got the furthest

RacingeR
November 3rd, 2017, 10:58 PM
What's the farthest a GW RP has gotten? Was it the one where Lantz got killed?

Define farthest.

Rafflesiac
November 3rd, 2017, 11:01 PM
Define farthest.
Most people dead, closest to ending as stated by GM, Caster hacking the Grail, etc.

I3uster
November 3rd, 2017, 11:06 PM
to at least counter the words limit thesis, fort, the RP closest to finishing (or somewhere in the same area as Ga-Rei) regularly had people write tiny novels as their posts

maybe the secret is making a minimum post length

SeiKeo
November 3rd, 2017, 11:06 PM
The exception proves the rule.

Draconic
November 3rd, 2017, 11:12 PM
So, in the vein of Create-a-Servant, why not have a competition to write the best Grail War RP premise.
I think it’s pretty clear that the most important thing here is a layered story to keep things interesting and to give the players various other goals beyond just killing each other.
The problem then comes in the form of who’s gonna host the winning entry of the creator isn’t able to host it themselves…

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I do realize that I’m jumping the gun here, and I apologize.

RacingeR
November 3rd, 2017, 11:35 PM
Most people dead, closest to ending as stated by GM, Caster hacking the Grail, etc.

Uh.

Probably none?


I mean I guess if u count dead people as a metric then it'd be the first grill war yes. Regalia was definitely ahead in terms of days passed but we were still in the prologue portion of it all tbh


edit: It occurs to me that eternal prologue mode might be the actual cancer in BL RPs

Bird of Hermes
November 4th, 2017, 06:23 AM
[x] don't need to have masters, no power disparity, people can have fun with servants
[x] varied campaign settings
[x] completely variable player counts
[x] up with the kids
That's a good idea, Grand Order dungeon crawls sound like a good idea actually

Draconic
November 4th, 2017, 11:19 AM
Actually, to be perfectly honest, while that could work, wouldn't just a regular Nasuverse dungeon crawl without Servants be more fun, as Sei has very, very clearly demonstrated?

Bird of Hermes
November 4th, 2017, 11:35 AM
Actually, to be perfectly honest, while that could work, wouldn't just a regular Nasuverse dungeon crawl without Servants be more fun, as Sei has very, very clearly demonstrated?
Both are good

Gray
November 4th, 2017, 01:18 PM
Has anyone tried one that plays like a Prisma war (every player has class cards) or a war with every participant being a pseudo servant/demiservant?
Sure it lowers master to servant interaction but each player has the agency of both without having two characters to write (unless they go for a body sharing type grail war).
Command Spells in this war would count as manual overrides to the servant's control or power boosts if they are included at all.

Soldat der Trauer
November 4th, 2017, 03:22 PM
It's been bandied about a handful of times in the past...

Slick146
November 6th, 2017, 04:15 PM
I wanna do a Grail War RP soon.

Draconic
November 6th, 2017, 04:19 PM
You'll have to make it yourself

You could always make it a community effort though. Some people (not many, but a few) would probably be willing to help you create the rulebook and story.

Milbunk
November 6th, 2017, 04:35 PM
I'm heavily considering doing one over on discord. Over the past few months I've been hosting a servant battling tournament to test fights and now I'm probably about to do a master one. Once I've gotten the basics down for those i feel like the next logical step is the grail war itself. If you folks are interested just let me know.

Draconic
November 6th, 2017, 04:43 PM
Discord Grail Wars don't work in my experience...

Last time I did one, it turned into something involving who could type the fastest. (It didn't help that no one was regulating it either, so people basically whatever the f*** they wanted, including pulling an Aperture Science facility on a mundane hospital.)

Still, there's keeping people going, and then there's just going too fast.
If you think you can though, I'd still be interested.

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That aside, have you thought up a story yet?

Milbunk
November 6th, 2017, 05:25 PM
Like I said, I already did a tourney involving servants which actually ran to completion with some pretty good fights in there so I at least know what I'm doing somewhat. I've gotten the concept of running it mostly nailed down it's just actually running is was what I was waiting to do.

As for the story, I feel like for the first one a straight traditional grail war run in Fuyuki with any canon servants is a good bet for a test run since there are a lot of factors you can work around with that.

Bird of Hermes
November 6th, 2017, 05:40 PM
I'm heavily considering doing one over on discord. Over the past few months I've been hosting a servant battling tournament to test fights and now I'm probably about to do a master one. Once I've gotten the basics down for those i feel like the next logical step is the grail war itself. If you folks are interested just let me know.
A man with a plan and the means to do it, sounds good to me.

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Even the canon restriction shouldn't be hard considering just how many servants there are now.

zikari8
November 7th, 2017, 11:51 PM
What do you guys think of a play-by-post order-based Grail War a la Diplomacy?

Basically, for clarification's sake, a more game-like Grail War where players write down and submit their actions, trading character and interaction for a more fast-paced competitive game of strategy. Not sure if something similar has been done here in the past.

SeiKeo
November 7th, 2017, 11:56 PM
First of all, I'm not sure why you would invoke Diplomacy, since I'm not sure why simultaneous resolution would make sense for Fate? And moreover once you commit to that then you have to build a really stable rulebase and combat system which is, I mean, more power to you, but good luck.

Mellon
November 8th, 2017, 01:43 PM
All this thread has done is just remind me how much I hate the world for killing the Moon White remake. ;-;

Draconic
November 8th, 2017, 02:09 PM
What do you guys think of a play-by-post order-based Grail War a la Diplomacy?

Basically, for clarification's sake, a more game-like Grail War where players write down and submit their actions, trading character and interaction for a more fast-paced competitive game of strategy. Not sure if something similar has been done here in the past.

Alfheimwander did something that sounds a bit like that. It was a turn-based thing based on the standard Mafia-style Play by Post RP, and it seemed to be working pretty well, but then the player, who I'm pretty sure was the 'murderer' character bailed, right after killing one of the more invested players, then two more bailed, and the game just died after that. However, fel free to try again, Zikari. It did work, we just didn't have the right players. That said, if you make it a comedy again, no will join.

RacingeR
November 8th, 2017, 03:22 PM
I mean, it'd just be a Mafia reskin at the end of the day.

Soldat der Trauer
November 8th, 2017, 04:05 PM
Is that necessarily a bad thing, though?

Draconic
November 8th, 2017, 05:24 PM
I wouldn't say so.

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I mean, either way, if you don't make it, you're getting it for free, and it's still a Grail War RP. Everyone seems to want one, so not joining it if it happens would be akin to asking someone to order a pizza, them paying for it and giving it to you, and then throwing it back at them because it's plain, and they didn't get your preferred topping.

Mellon
November 8th, 2017, 06:07 PM
I mean, either way, if you don't make it, you're getting it for free, and it's still a Grail War RP. Everyone seems to want one, so not joining it if it happens would be akin to asking someone to order a pizza, them paying for it and giving it to you, and then throwing it back at them because it's plain, and they didn't get your preferred topping.

I'm not so sure about that, honestly. In the end, the players will be only as invested as the GM is. Half-assed Grail War RPs don't really have a great track record on BL and there is a fair number dead corpses littering the RP section that never even got off the ground.

In the end, the impetus should be to make a good Grail War RP. The player engagement, well-made PCs (both Masters and Servants), and almost everything else mentioned here will come naturally if you give the players an actual setting and character creation that properly fuels their imagination.

Whereas if you make Grill... well you kinda get out what you put in. That is not to say that there is nothing wrong with Grill, but everyone already expects it to be kind of a short-term fling, rather than something truly fantastic.

Spicy memes though. Missile and Servant matryoshkas 4ever.

Draconic
November 9th, 2017, 09:08 PM
Hey, just because it's Mafia doesn't mean the creator isn't invested in it.

Mellon
November 10th, 2017, 03:38 AM
Hey, just because it's Mafia doesn't mean the creator isn't invested in it.

Aah, my bad. My post wasn't really referring to this idea specifically, more the general sentiment behind your statement. I'm sure that the concept itself can somehow be crafted into a viable RP.

Milbunk
November 12th, 2017, 02:57 AM
I've gotten the details fleshed out for my new Grail War Tournament, I plan on releasing it tomorrow morning so look forward to it! Though I'll warn, it's best if you consider about wanting to play the whole three or so months the tourney is going to take and teams will be allowed so if you want to team up look for a partner!

Milbunk
November 12th, 2017, 11:32 AM
Alright tourney is up. if you are interested join the discord chat labeled in the rulebook and state your intentions: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Jw6MA_pN1wpx11c-T6m1VW-R4c0zQebk2PvPvXRM32s/edit?usp=sharing

Milbunk
February 5th, 2018, 05:34 PM
Hey folks, for those of you who may remember, I started a grail war over on discord. That war is now reaching its conclusion and the final fight between the remaining teams of Rider, Lancer, and Archer is nearing its end. It has been a wild ride and I am severely impressed that we even made it to the end in the first place. However now that this war is ending me and You (the guy with the name you) are getting ready for the second edition of the war.

If you are interested in joining I will have a rulebook posted by tomorrow while the signups for the war itself will be on Wednesday. I just wanted to give you all some heads up so you can think about it and have time to join when the time is right.

Here are some of the highlights of the previous war:

Teams (Master/Servant)
Rin Tohsaka/Saber Lily
Illyasviel/Karna
Ciel/Kogil
Bazett/Medea
Tine/Sasaki Kojiro
Fujimaru Ritsuka/Perseus
Irisviel/Cu Chulainn Alter

The initial confrontation between rin and Illya where they made an alliance after saving npc Shirou.

Medea discovering the alliance and bombing the Tohsaka residence into oblivion, this caused her to retreat to the Einzbern Castle

Medea brainwashing npc Kuzuki and raiding the Einzbern Castle. By sacrificing Kuzuki she was able to kill Cu with a rain of light.

Karna's raid on the Ryuudou Temple which destroyed Medea's workshop and forced her to work with Tine.

Sasaki and Tine's defense of their workshop, the casino, agaisnt Karna.

Kogil going to school.

Fujimaru giving Shinji control of her Servant for most of the war, also the date between the two. He then proceeds to charge Rin and Saber Lily and wins.

The final raid against the outlier Servant Toyotomi Hideyoshi where Rider, Lancer, and Archer form a temporary alliance.

Karna vs Sanada, Perseus vs Motonari, and Kogil vs a brainwashed Shirou Muramasa

All three of the above vs Hideyoshi himself.

If you want to watch the final battle conclude I will link the discord you can join. Additionally this will be the same discord the next war will use and you can use it to sign up when the time comes on Wednesday.

https://discord.gg/Qt3NvzZ

Draconic
February 5th, 2018, 07:28 PM
Any plans for another one that doesn't force players into the roles of preexisting characters?

Milbunk
February 5th, 2018, 09:42 PM
Yes, after this one there will be a war in which players can enter whatever they want including OOC's.

Draconic
February 6th, 2018, 11:58 AM
Okay, I'm getting in on that.

Milbunk
February 7th, 2018, 01:36 AM
Congratulations on Bramlor's victory in the war! With his team of Fujmaru and Perseus he managed to come out on top and won the war! If you are interested in reading the final fight you can find it in the chat.

The signups for the new war will begin at the end of this timer. https://www.tickcounter.com/countdown/466149/signup-start-time

Please either join the chat or be ready to message me when they begin. Slots will be first come first served so you'll have to be quick as there are only 14 slots available!

The phrases that are going to be used for the selection are listed in this sheet. Take some time to think them over so you can consider which one you want to use.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1LmT7rVpUurGnZjJrTv7Vyq_T5i4FhIynWuCqJCYHMJU/edit#gid=0

mAc Chaos
February 7th, 2018, 01:51 AM
What are the phrases for? How does it work?

Milbunk
February 7th, 2018, 03:02 AM
Since it's on Discord the RP itself will take place there in this chat: https://discord.gg/Qt3NvzZ

Then, when signups open you choose one of the phrases and when all teams have been filled it will be revealed what team you got. The teams themselves are based on the phrases so they are like clues to what the team is. After you have gotten a team you can then veto one of the two that you got to something that you would prefer. There is already a good number of people who have already joined the chat, so if you are interested I can answer more specific questions that you may have.



(https://discord.gg/Qt3NvzZ)