Questions, questions and more questions (READ THE OP FOR ANSWERS)

[Iceblade44]

Also creepy Perseus.

[Nobody]

Fragments is basically all we have of Proto besides the OVA and the one or two chapters of Fragments that flash forward to Ayaka getting NTR'd by a racist with terrible fashion sense.

And haircut.

- - - Updated - - -

Also creepy Perseus.

That scene was made way more creepy than it needed to be due to Ayaka being a bad conversationalist.

[Altaris]

Tbf to Apo i actually enjoyed a lot of moments in it. It just that it run out of steam and after that it's just a train wreck waiting to happen.

Higashide is shit at handling a big cast, he doesn't do well when there are so many characters, yet he keeps trying to make it work. America is the same for me, he tried to include all these big names only to off them after like 2 scenes and in some of the most idiotic fashion, and yet he keep making random characters appear in random place because he think it's cool that way.

Some of the stuffs he write and some of the character development he write are cool, which is why it's a shame to see he keep doing this shit.

[castor212]

.
the fragments translation is the opposite of the Kara no Kyoukai translation.

i got whooshed, explain plx

- - - Updated - - -

i actually think higa wrote cool battle scene better than sakurai, so apo has that going over fragment. apo is easier to put your head around too
fragment was, how do i put this, kinda too literature-y to read. not that its a bad thing in itself but it really made it hard to read

but then again i had massive headache and totaly drained reading what was untranslated of apo raws

[Kotonoha]

KnK's problem as I understand it is that the translation is pretty much OC donut steel so I assume the opposite means "painfully literal"

[Canon]

The best part about using "Knk translation" as a comparison is that there were both a painfully literal one and a OC rewrite so the comparison means anything you want it to mean

[Mazyrian]

Labyrinth is just plainly bad

I don't dislike neither Apo nor Fragments. I think they are decent enough, but no more than that
They do have some (different) large problems imho
Apo is too plain and the descriptions are too long
If you make a list of everything that happens it sounds like it should be awesome or at least ridiculously fun but it just... isn't
On the other hand I like Fragments writing style, but couldn't really connect but any of the characters or anything at all actually

[Mcjon01]

The best part about using "Knk translation" as a comparison is that there were both a painfully literal one and a OC rewrite so the comparison means anything you want it to mean

For instance, it could also mean the translator got about a quarter of the way through then quit, forever.

[Trubo]

Going back to the Knight of Owner/Knight of Honor discussions we've had before, I came across this response in favor of Knight of Honor. Would anyone more familiar with whatever sources go into detail about Lancelot and this ability mind pointing out whatever flaws it might have? I want to say that what he has described is Lancelot's ability to fight well with any weapon he can get his hands on, as if it were his own, thus Knight of Owner.

The direct origin of the NP is likely Lancelot's representation in Chapter 3 of Malory's Le Morte de Arthur, specifically the tale of Lancelot fighting Phelot with a tree branch. There's no element of ownership. The tree branch is the only thing that was near (Lancelot having been conned into climbing a tree so he wouldn't have his sword before being ambushed) and it's never mentioned again. In the same chapter, Lancelot fights a small army of knights, losing his own lance in the process, and picks up another at random from the battlefield to keep murdering people. He's doing this because he owes a debt to the daughter of King Bagedemagus, repaying a debt of honor and, in return, winning glory when the sotry's eventually recounted. He doesn't 'steal' or take ownership of the lance, he just grabs whatever's around so he can keep murdering people (and keep almost murdering King Arthur's knights who are in the same tournament on another side). No 'ownership' involved. He basically just keeps breaking his shit (spears rather than swords usually) and grabbing anything around to keep fighting people.

In contrast, the entire section is basically Lancelot being a badass and winning glory (or, you might say, winning honor) before returning to King Arthur's court. The concluding line, depending on translation, literally calls him "the most honoured of all men" (quoted from JTK, 1862).

So the NP drawn from the myth of becoming the most honored man in the kingdom totally makes sense as Knight of Honor and doesn't as the rather painfully phrased Knight of Owner (actually owning your own weapons and taking care of your gear is a big deal, but the repeating throughout the section is Lancelot losing or breaking the weapons he actually owns and being forced to improvise, to the point that he's a bit surprised when he manages to get through a series of fights without breaking his spear. Treating weapons as disposable has little sense of ownership, and even stealing someone else's shit to fight as he does with Gil in Zero is basically the exact opposite of owning things)

[Laserman]

*paging castor*

[Arashi_Leonhart]

A response in the favor of Owner: Japan says so.

Also in favor: While the Malory things are true, that's only half the tale. The other half is in-universe, where the given reason emphasizes that its all about "granting the attribute of 'your personal noble phantasm' to the weapon in hand."

Like yeah, there's no element of ownership in the original story. But there's no element of "original hero" to Gil's actual story, or of "wrecking fortresses with light beam" to Arthur either.

[castor212]

tell him thats real life lore

[Trubo]

A response in the favor of Owner: Japan says so.

Also in favor: While the Malory things are true, that's only half the tale. The other half is in-universe, where the given reason emphasizes that its all about "granting the attribute of 'your personal noble phantasm' to the weapon in hand."

Like yeah, there's no element of ownership in the original story. But there's no element of "original hero" to Gil's actual story, or of "wrecking fortresses with light beam" to Arthur either.

Is that what's explained in Zero, the Zero Mats entry on this, or the in-game text for it in GO? Just asking so I know where to actually direct this person to look at.

- - - Updated - - -

Cause if it's Zero, I don't have the original JP text on hand, and not sure if the english translation was ever much improved over what cokesato mostly put out. I know that there's an official translation of it, but I've never read it.

[Canon]

You don't have to trust mcjon, but you should trust ubisoft

.

- - - Updated - - -

Cause if it's Zero

what cokesato mostly put out

Wot

[castor212]

Is that what's explained in Zero, the Zero Mats entry on this, or the in-game text for it in GO? Just asking so I know where to actually direct this person to look at.

- - - Updated - - -

Cause if it's Zero, I don't have the original JP text on hand, and not sure if the english translation was ever much improved over what cokesato mostly put out. I know that there's an official translation of it, but I've never read it.

wait zero wasnt translated by cakesakto

anways maybe this could help

ナイト・オブ・オーナー
騎士は徒手にて死せずランク：A++
種別：対人宝具
レンジ：1
最大捕捉：30人
————手にした武器に自らの宝具としての属性を与え、駆使する。
どんな武器、兵器であろうともランスロットが手にした時点でＤランク相当の宝具となり、元からそれ以上のラ ンクに位置する宝具であれば、従来のランクのままランスロットの支配下に置かれる。
フェロットの策に鎮められて丸腰のまま戦う羽目になったとき、楡の木の枝でフェロットを倒したエピソードの 具現。

bolded part is what arashi said

[Arashi_Leonhart]

all three?

This was a replay of the miracle of the first attack. Berserker just took the first halberd that came at him with his left hand, then swung left and right the sword in his right hand, repelling every single one of the following Noble Phantasms away.

Such a technique was subtle and flawless. There was grandeur in it. Even with a Noble Phantasm snatched from Archer, the handling wasn't poor by a bit. He was swinging them around freely, like extensions of his arms; it simply looked like a demonstration of his polished skills with the favourite weapons he had specialized in for years.

...


Lancer and Rider, watching closely, reached the same conclusion.

"... So that's it. When Blacky takes something, it becomes his Noble Phantasm."

Rider growled in admiration. The Noble Phantasm of a Heroic Spirit doesn't need to manifest through a characteristic object. Sometime, it can be a type of Noble Phantasm that manifests through a "unique ability" retained by the Servant's very body. This is exactly the case for Berserker.

————手にした武器に自らの宝具としての属性を与え、駆使する。

手にしたものに「自分の宝具」として属性を与え扱う宝具能力。どんな武器、どのような兵器であろうともＤラ ンク相当の擬似宝具となる。

"A Noble Phantasm ability that bestows the property 'one's own Noble Phantasm' to anything he holds."

[Trubo]

.
Wot

Sorry, mixing that up with the KnK translation discussion from before. Wonder if I have a scanned copy of the official release then, as nothing immediately is saying Translated by [Insert Name Here].

[Kotonoha]

There's also the fact that it's not called ナイト・オブ・オナー

- - - Updated - - -

Sorry, mixing that up with the KnK translation discussion from before. Wonder if I have a scanned copy of the official release then, as nothing immediately is saying Translated by [Insert Name Here].

Pretty sure FZ didn't have an official translation.

[castor212]

KnK have official translation?

- - - Updated - - -

oh wait

lol

[Trubo]

all three?

Thank you.

- - - Updated - - -

There's also the fact that it's not called ナイト・オブ・オナー

That was one of the few things I mentioned.

Pretty sure FZ didn't have an official translation.

Ah, my mistake. Think I confused the cover I saw for one of the LN covers, but Barnes and Noble has it listed as a manga.

https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/fat...i/1122683360#/