Questions, questions and more questions (READ THE OP FOR ANSWERS)

[LJ3]

Lancelot I believe was specifically noted in TM to adapt his combat against Gawain to be extremely defensive so he could outlast the sun buff.

So you either need someone who can play defense very well and/or have the raw power to compete

So someone like Lancer Cu can survive Gawain if not score a win while Cu Alter could probably beat him fair and square.

[AAM1232]

I dunno, seems like a Badass VS topic more than anything else.

[Ronove]

Again, this isn't stated anywhere in UBW. He says explicitly he can try for an approximation, something never used to describe any other projections, as the real deal is beyond him. K&B, Rho Aias, Caladbolg or Hrunting aren't said anywhere to be approximations like an Excalibur copy, even though as "perfect" copies they're ranked down. CM3 just goes into more detail and clears things up.

None of archer's NPs were ever perfect copies, that's why they are ranked down. They are always imitations close to the original, thus approximations, by the literal definition of the word.
Shirou can trace Excalibur, traced Excalibur. Nothing in the VN said he couldn't. Everyone believed he could.

With an effort, I gather together the shards of my consciousness.
What did Saber just say?
Did she ask me why I won't project her sword?

I can't waste my energy like that.
It takes too long to project such a powerful Noble Phantasm, and I can't handle that holy blade in any case.
I should be able to imitate it if my enemy's not moving, but I won't have time to use the sword's true name against her

Angra Manyu can't move as long as it's in the black fire.
I'll cleave it in two before he can emerge.
If there's anything capable of such a feat, it's


The greatest Noble Phantasm I know of.

[Leftovers]

None of archer's NPs were ever perfect copies, that's why they are ranked down. They are always imitations close to the original, thus approximations, by the literal definition of the word.

The point behind projection by "judging the concept of creation, hypothesizing the basic structure, duplicating the composition material, imitating the skill of its making, sympathizing with the experience of its growth, reproducing the accumulated years, excelling every manufacturing process" is to "bind the illusion and make it a sword", the illusion being the noble phantasm. The rankdown is not attributed to a lack of accuracy in the reproduction; if they weren't perfect copies they wouldn't be noble phantasms at all.

[AAM1232]

None of archer's NPs were ever perfect copies, that's why they are ranked down. They are always imitations close to the original, thus approximations, by the literal definition of the word.
Shirou can trace Excalibur, traced Excalibur. Nothing in the VN said he couldn't. Everyone believed he could.

Archer says otherwise, and even then the supposed Excalibur Morgan isn't stated to be a real copy like Caladbolg or Hrunting. Archer says, Shirou demonstrates and Nasu clarifies that absolutely shit copies that are similar to the real DCs are possible, but not actual projections like Caladbolg or Hrunting.

Like Leftovers said, rank downs of UBW's other projections aren't really relevant here. And you still haven't given more than word definitions for where approximations or the relevant JP text is used to describe other projections.

[All fictions]

If she was a genius like her older sister―――――she might’ve been able to deal with him―――――but if she was her older sister, she could’ve used territory magic which was like almostall of the magics, on top of configuring and connecting in that moment where she had a type of magical foundation which was independently put together by powerful mages and old family lineages, as well as a released magical foundation, like black magic and rune magic, spiritual sorcery, gem magic and elemental conversion magic.

Source

What is "released magical foundation"?

[You]

Source

What is "released magical foundation"?

Well this is bad.
Anyway are you ready for some supreme Manaka wank?

A genius like her sister wasn't limited to only disclosed magecraft foundations like black magic, rune, necromancy, jewel magecraft, and elemental conversion. Her sister could instantly set up and connect to the numerous proprietary magical foundations that powerful magi and ancient lineages constructed and use magecraft that was almost magic. If it was her sister, she might have been able to deal with this situation.

Sakurai: lol you thought making a special family foundation for your OC magus made them special? WELL MY MANAKA CAN INSTANTLY USE ALL YOUR OC'S MAGECRAFT, FRIEND. GG

[Dullahan]

Why is this allowed?

[forumghost]

Because Sakurai is a hack and Nasu and Takeuchi don't give enough of a fuck about anything that isn't playing vidya gaems and drawing Saber in new outfits respectively to actually check their shit before green-lighting it I suspect.

[AmADo VII]

Manaka will be defeated by Ayaka and her harem, so who gets the most wank?

also don't understand why ppl are alright with Kiara wank.

[Urameshi Yūsuke]

Manaka will be defeated by Ayaka and her harem, so who gets the most wank?

also don't understand why ppl are alright with Kiara wank.

Well theres your problem.

Of course Kiara has these people under her control, its her whole gimmick :V

[Zurvan]

also don't understand why ppl are alright with Kiara wank.

I mean, surely you can see it too

[Comun]

Manaka was a central element of the Fate/ Nasy wrote in high school, so Sakurai's wank was probably mandated. Well, at least the powerlevel wank. I still blame Sakurai alone for the whole cast flocking around Manaka in Fragments.

[AmADo VII]

anyone remember Fate/Prototype teaser anime? it was back in 2011.

also Prototype drama CD (not fragments) after that.

wonder those 2 works had Sakurai involved.

[madarra]

The way i see it, Manaka was supposed to be the Gilgamesh of proto, nigh omnipotent and all that. The problem is that we didnt get proto first, we got fragments,
So instead of seeing nigh omnipotent Manaka first, then reading about all her op powers that she didnt get to use in a databook, we got Fragments and Labyrinth and trying to shove 'by the way' naration of Manaka's capabilities. And to fit all that, the stories started revolving entirely about her.

[SpoonyViking]

Eh. The main antagonist displaying over-the-top, cheat-level abilities (which may not even be context-appropriate) seems par for the course in a number of genres, particularly shounen action stories.

[Reign]

Isn't that about the same thing as Amakusa's arms or am I misunderstanding what his arms do?

Also I agree with madarra's assessment about the order we got Proto stuff probably affecting the portrayal of Manaka.

[Rafflesiac]

Amakusa is a Servant.

[Reign]

oh yeah I'm not saying it's not bullshit she can do that, just making sure I understand right that it's the same thing he can do

[Menwearpink]

Amakusa also just isn't nearly as talented or cheaty as Manaka by miles.