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Thread: Questions, questions and more questions (READ THE OP FOR ANSWERS)

  1. #135741
    鬼 Ogre-like You's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reign View Post
    Yeah that made me do a doubletake when Lostbelt came out, I thought the World could summon HSs without the limitations of a class.
    makes you think because the 7 Grands that the World summons are indeed bound by class
    so maybe it was always bound by classes

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by 8000 View Post
    I thought it was the grails responding or some jargon.

    Neither explanation would really make sense though, if they're summoned by Gaia or Alaya they shouldn't have classes and should be much more powerful, and the art graphs summoning them doesn't make sense because Goetia made those.
    Quote Originally Posted by pinetree View Post
    They're summoned by the World in Lostbelt but are still in class containers.

    Though I don't think it was the world was summoning them in the singularities.
    There are multiple reasons for summoning for each singularity.
    Some are unknown

    2004 = Already there
    Orleans = Artgraph Counterforce?
    Septum = Never explained
    Okeanos = Medea Lily
    London = the Makiri is randomly summoning Servants
    America = ???
    Camelot = That crusader and then Lion King and ???
    Babylon = Gilgamesh
    Quote Originally Posted by Canon View Post
    On You's tombstone it will read
    Quote Originally Posted by You View Post
    That's exaggerating my point.

  2. #135742
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six pinetree's Avatar
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    I just assumed all the ones not explained were randomly summoned.

  3. #135743
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six SirGauoftheSquareTable's Avatar
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    Related to my question about whether Servants retain memories of past summonings, do the Heroic Spirits in the Throne get transmitted memories of what they did while summoned as Servants? Also, in regards to the Einzbern clan, at what point were there no longer any human members, and the entire clan became populated by golems and homunculi?

  4. #135744
    Bitchin' Arashi_Leonhart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirGauoftheSquareTable View Post
    Related to my question about whether Servants retain memories of past summonings, do the Heroic Spirits in the Throne get transmitted memories of what they did while summoned as Servants?
    It's just like a book.
    Every time a heroic spirit is summoned, the book with its story is sent to its home.
    The heroic spirit itself remains in the house, reading those books.
    The trouble is that the one at the house does not know when those books arrived.

    Past or future do not matter.
    All the "books" are already in his room.
    His only way of measuring time is to read the records of his "cleaning" that he will accomplish.

    It makes no difference if it's eternal or instantaneous.
    Eternity is instantaneous, and an instant is eternal.
    Therefore, he does not know how rare this miracle is.
    He does not know if this is the first time or the thousandth time since he obtained this hope.
    …All he has is unordered knowledge.
    Past, present, and future are meaningless for heroic spirits.

  5. #135745
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six SirGauoftheSquareTable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arashi_Leonhart View Post
    It's just like a book.
    Every time a heroic spirit is summoned, the book with its story is sent to its home.
    The heroic spirit itself remains in the house, reading those books.
    The trouble is that the one at the house does not know when those books arrived.

    Past or future do not matter.
    All the "books" are already in his room.
    His only way of measuring time is to read the records of his "cleaning" that he will accomplish.

    It makes no difference if it's eternal or instantaneous.
    Eternity is instantaneous, and an instant is eternal.
    Therefore, he does not know how rare this miracle is.
    He does not know if this is the first time or the thousandth time since he obtained this hope.
    …All he has is unordered knowledge.
    Past, present, and future are meaningless for heroic spirits.
    Thank you.

  6. #135746
    まおーさまのカワイイツンデレ睡魔 Mizukume's Avatar
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    Or if you go by the kanjis for Ghost Liners, HS are like filmstrips


    どんな姿は魔王様の好きですか?
    ロリリィ? ツンリィ? バリィ?


  7. #135747
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors fire_mountain_30's Avatar
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    question.

    do true ancestors also have the ability to reject human history like dead apostoles?

    at first i didnt think so, but then i remembered that what Arcueid initially jumped to with shiki was that he had a conceptual weapon on him.

    and also, werent they created in part to counterbalance humanity and are supposed to have an ability that is a sort of reset button for the world? if they do, then their existence rejecting human history would make more sense to me
    Quote Originally Posted by Arashi_Leonhart View Post
    It does mean that, but not literally.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Literally none of this addresses my complaint. What we see in the story IS all there is of him. A footnote in a side material book saying "oh btw that's totally not his real self" is irrelevant to the way he's presented in the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by SirGauoftheSquareTable View Post
    With Grail Mud, I got rid of all my extraneous divinity, two feet of height, and a burning desire to get revenge on the Gods! Try Grail Mud today!

  8. #135748
    鬼 Ogre-like You's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fire_mountain_30 View Post
    question.

    do true ancestors also have the ability to reject human history like dead apostoles?

    at first i didnt think so, but then i remembered that what Arcueid initially jumped to with shiki was that he had a conceptual weapon on him.

    and also, werent they created in part to counterbalance humanity and are supposed to have an ability that is a sort of reset button for the world? if they do, then their existence rejecting human history would make more sense to me
    yea probably
    the world makes stuff like the Nemean Lion and that babylonian thing that rejects human history
    And if DA's reject human history and they were made by the TAs then makes sense the TAs do too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Canon View Post
    On You's tombstone it will read
    Quote Originally Posted by You View Post
    That's exaggerating my point.

  9. #135749
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors fire_mountain_30's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by You View Post
    yea probably
    the world makes stuff like the Nemean Lion and that babylonian thing that rejects human history
    And if DA's reject human history and they were made by the TAs then makes sense the TAs do too.
    oh, you know where this is going

    does that prove that since Gae Bolg can kill Arc that it is a conceptual weapon? (yes i like to discuss the nitpicky details, sue me)
    Quote Originally Posted by Arashi_Leonhart View Post
    It does mean that, but not literally.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Literally none of this addresses my complaint. What we see in the story IS all there is of him. A footnote in a side material book saying "oh btw that's totally not his real self" is irrelevant to the way he's presented in the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by SirGauoftheSquareTable View Post
    With Grail Mud, I got rid of all my extraneous divinity, two feet of height, and a burning desire to get revenge on the Gods! Try Grail Mud today!

  10. #135750
    鬼 Ogre-like You's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fire_mountain_30 View Post
    oh, you know where this is going

    does that prove that since Gae Bolg can kill Arc that it is a conceptual weapon? (yes i like to discuss the nitpicky details, sue me)
    The human history denial thing of DA's does not work on NPs that are being used by Heroic Spirits since they exemplify human history. So it'd probably be the same with TAs.

    The only real person the DA's NO NPZ rules affect is Shirou, maybe Bazett, maybe Gray, probably not Asura!Kiritsugu
    Last edited by You; July 11th, 2018 at 07:36 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Canon View Post
    On You's tombstone it will read
    Quote Originally Posted by You View Post
    That's exaggerating my point.

  11. #135751
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors fire_mountain_30's Avatar
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    Arent TA`s just way stronger than DA`s though?

    Would comparing them to the nemean pelt level of power be closer to the mark? Since that like you mentioned, they are produced directly by the world, like the lion, unlike dead apostoles?
    Quote Originally Posted by Arashi_Leonhart View Post
    It does mean that, but not literally.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Literally none of this addresses my complaint. What we see in the story IS all there is of him. A footnote in a side material book saying "oh btw that's totally not his real self" is irrelevant to the way he's presented in the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by SirGauoftheSquareTable View Post
    With Grail Mud, I got rid of all my extraneous divinity, two feet of height, and a burning desire to get revenge on the Gods! Try Grail Mud today!

  12. #135752

  13. #135753
    全力後輩 - Zenryoku Kohai Altima of the Gates's Avatar
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    Altrouge?

    Do half-breeds count? Speaking of which, did we ever get some lore on how that came about?

  14. #135754
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors fire_mountain_30's Avatar
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    it was probably sex
    Quote Originally Posted by Arashi_Leonhart View Post
    It does mean that, but not literally.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Literally none of this addresses my complaint. What we see in the story IS all there is of him. A footnote in a side material book saying "oh btw that's totally not his real self" is irrelevant to the way he's presented in the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by SirGauoftheSquareTable View Post
    With Grail Mud, I got rid of all my extraneous divinity, two feet of height, and a burning desire to get revenge on the Gods! Try Grail Mud today!

  15. #135755
    鬼 Ogre-like You's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fire_mountain_30 View Post
    Arent TA`s just way stronger than DA`s though?

    Would comparing them to the nemean pelt level of power be closer to the mark? Since that like you mentioned, they are produced directly by the world, like the lion, unlike dead apostoles?
    Well those creatures are mentioned to be living singularities
    "Occasionally a creature of that sort appears — a singularity that rejects human civilization itself. At the very least, no tool created by humans will pierce that skin."
    The set of Gilgamesh's lips softened slightly.
    "What is it, Your Majesty?"
    I don't think TA's have ever been called that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Canon View Post
    On You's tombstone it will read
    Quote Originally Posted by You View Post
    That's exaggerating my point.

  16. #135756
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors fire_mountain_30's Avatar
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    The tsuki collab will vindicate me.


    In 2057
    Quote Originally Posted by Arashi_Leonhart View Post
    It does mean that, but not literally.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Literally none of this addresses my complaint. What we see in the story IS all there is of him. A footnote in a side material book saying "oh btw that's totally not his real self" is irrelevant to the way he's presented in the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by SirGauoftheSquareTable View Post
    With Grail Mud, I got rid of all my extraneous divinity, two feet of height, and a burning desire to get revenge on the Gods! Try Grail Mud today!

  17. #135757
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six
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    Demon Lords?

  18. #135758
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six Trubo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by You View Post
    The human history denial thing of DA's does not work on NPs that are being used by Heroic Spirits since they exemplify human history. So it'd probably be the same with TAs.

    The only real person the DA's NO NPZ rules affect is Shirou, maybe Bazett, maybe Gray, probably not Asura!Kiritsugu
    Wasn't there something about how living Richard the Lionheart and Saladin or something faced a Dead Apostle and nearly died while alive?
    Quote Originally Posted by Arashi_Leonhart View Post
    Then I will ask that you pay closer attention
    Quote Originally Posted by Mcjon01 View Post
    So if I'm reading this right DP is saying that the feature almost everybody hates that is bad and makes the forum objectively worse will never go away because that would negatively impact another feature that nobody has ever used and most likely never will use just in case someday, someone wants to use it. Is that right?
    Quote Originally Posted by You View Post
    It's like if someone told me "make me a milkshake" and i was blind and they gave me the ingredients and I made a milkshake because milkshakes are good, but it turns out that milkshake was a bomb.

  19. #135759
    Knight of 'Sumanai' Iceblade44's Avatar
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    Nothing on whether if was hard or not, but yes Richard, Saladin, and a Hassan faced a DA and killed it. How? Don't know, if I would to guess I give it to the Hassan
    "Only in my company, will you not be a monster"


    anywhere than here

  20. #135760
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six SirGauoftheSquareTable's Avatar
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    Could a Ruler class Servant be summoned under the corrupted Fuyuki Greater Grail, and could a Great Grail War type scenario take place with said Grail if it were in the right layline?

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