I just remember something important. How the Wolkenritter react when they know Archer is their master's future self and what he'll face in the future.
Oh, how about making Archer come from Fate/Night Sky route. It's must be delicious irony. Even if he has a family's support, he still drown in despair.
I like the idea. Fund this.
I'd just rather not imagine just how powerful this Shirou will become by the end of the story (He already has some hax skill naturally, but he will get a massive power boost upon the completion of the Book of Darkness). And he would have the Wolkenritter with him (maybe with Reinforce).
And about the Wolkenritter? When will they appear? Hayate had had the book for a few years when they appeared to her, and here the BoD seems to be careful to escape its notice, so it may take longer (on the other hand, Shirou is (will be soon) a magus while Hayate was not until the book's completion, so maybe it will compensate... My estimation give me about the time of Kiritsugu's death... I think that's a really good timing personally.
But if the Wolkenritter are there for the HGW, maybe you may want to change things a little to give the others a chance. Maybe having others MGLN's mages as masters (I would avoid replacing the know masters without reasons though) would be nice (Not necessarly Nanoha or Fate. Chrono, or, depending what he did during all this time, Yuuno, could be interesting choice... Yes, let's do a Yuuno x Caster...)
I second Yuuno x Caster
Rather than Kozuki's martial arts, Yuuno can just bind them for Caster to rulebreak, and he's nice enough for Caster to love, right?
Code:[07:55:59] <Spinach> Take off your clothes Kirby [07:56:07] <Kirby> I'm in class [20:37:34] <Lian|phone> there is a such thing as lingerie for guys? [20:37:54] <Kyokushi> yea [20:37:57] <Kyokushi> they're called jockstraps [20:38:02] <Lian|phone> :o [20:38:07] * Lian|phone googles [20:38:10] <Kyokushi> NO [20:38:11] <Kyokushi> DON'T [20:40:07] <Lian|phone> okay [20:40:16] <Lian|phone> I don't think I should have googled that [12:59:30] <Spinach> call me onii-chan, bitch [13:00:12] <kroyo> imma fuck ur shit up onii-fam
I like this idea. Shirou having a fun family life with the Wolkenritter sounds amazing, and I especially want to partake of the amusement of how they'll react to Saber once she gets there.
^Assuming BoD is capable of going 'full drain' under the current circumstances.Originally Posted by Kyokushi
That and Word of God already said Shirou isn't affected by it, much.
Edit:BoD!Shirou and Archer's abilities would be too different to associate one with the other. Unless this Archer is radically changed in skill set, I don't see it happening.Oh, how about making Archer come from Fate/Night Sky route. It's must be delicious irony. Even if he has a family's support, he still drown in despair.
thanks for all the responses so far.
first a couple of things:
The wolkenritter are strong, but they are no match for an heroic spirit. It's not that they are weak, but that Heroic Spirits are just that awesome. We are talking about manifestations of the worlds finest hero's here, powers by the faith harvested trough the legends that they carved into history, wielding weapons with powers close to sorcery itself.
Shirou's body will be around the same as the original timeline in physical strength, but he will have an history of sick days when the book influence grows, before avalon can adapt to counteract the negative effects.
Mentally is another problem. Unlike Nanoha-verse mages, who use devices to control and calculate magic, Shirou uses Nasuverse magic, which involves self-hypnotism.........One might think using such a skill when in possession of a lost logia inside of you might cause a few problems.
lets just say that his ' talent' at structural analysis was more then just a side ffect of his true nature and repeated training in this verse. He wont become a beamspammer though, as his talent at such magics suck, as he only knows what he has taught himself after his father died.
Also, although the Nanoha cast will show up it won't be until after the HGW starts, and I don't know who will show up. I got another idea for Hayate, which could work with the adaption I've planned for the Nanoha timeline to adapt for the lack of A's.
besides, we still have the Einzberg, Zouken, and Kotominei on the sidelines. Those innocent " talk to us, or we beat the crap out of you" mages will have to learn quickly, before they are swallowed into the madness of the Heaven's feel.
I've refrained from thinking about romance in this state of development, so no pairings just yet.....
Except for Taiga x Zafira. He's the only one who can call her tiger, and the one time she spotted him with ears and a tail she thought it was a cosplay joke set up by Ayako, or so she claims. In reality she knows better then to dig to deep into the life of the Emiya family, as she fears it might destroy the happy life Shirou has build with them.
They normally act all ignorant around others, but Vita has started complaining to Shirou that they get all "doki-doki' when nobody's watching them.
.......That actually doesn't sound as cracky as I thought. ...........
Illya is best servant
I am so shipping Shirou with Reinforce Ein.
Then you better hope I don't kill them both in the end........... ( well, you could ship them together in death i think >_>) I can go any way at this point :P
Plot first, Pairings second people!
Illya is best servant
I think Vita or Signum could do a fairly good job against a servant, depending on its strength. Especially since they can fly. But when you take the Noble phantasm into account, they will need to be in a really favorable circumstance to win. At least, they could avoid being killed because of greater mobility...
Why would Shirou need to become a beamspammer? If the book ever got completed (and he survives it) he would get so much power he could probably beat gil in a swordspamming contest.
For not having MGLN cast before the HGW... It would be hard to explain why they would come before (Yuuno could work though). If Shirou is not in danger of death, then the Wolkenritter won't go finish the book if he don't order them (which he won't). So the TSAB is unlikely to find them. Even if Gil Graham know about him, I think he would more likely let things happen. About how the cast would react. About Nanoha and Fate, remember that it is just one year before when StrikerS would have been, so maybe they would be reluctant to kill, but they are trained and experienced soldiers by now. They are idealist, but when you have magic that can be set to stun while still being able to destroy everything in sight, you can afford it.
Chrono... Well the timeline make it difficult to explain why he would go there, as he no longer is a field agent. For Yuuno, depending how the timeline went (without the Wolkenritter and (maybe) Hayate, I think he may choose to join the TSAB to assist Nanoha and Fate. Especially after Nanoha's near death experience.), he could be more skilled (as in "knowing how to cast other thing that heal, barrier and shields". Because he is already top-notch in those areas). But even if he is the same as in canon, he still would be able to survive most of his encounter. And his profession can make it easy to explain why he is there in the first place.
Edit : I would also like seeing Reinforce surviving. I wouldn't mind if she ended with Shirou (but maybe Signum would suit him better?). But, yes, it's hard to find a way (without copying what has already be done in the canon under different circumstance) to save both.
Last edited by Bki; September 7th, 2011 at 04:53 PM.
About Nanoha's injury: How would that have gone down without the Knights?
I mean, could Nanoha have fared off even WORSE if the Knights were never there to assist her? Or maybe her body was in better shape at the time (since A's didn't happen) and she never got the injury in the first place?
(Then again... No A's means no cartridge system for Nanoha and Fate, probably... ugh, this is confusing.)
Here is a post I put together, based on all of the scraps that I could gather up regarding Yuuno's background and the Scyra Clan.
There will be more later, but this one focuses on the days before the Jewel Seeds.
http://forums.animesuki.com/showthre...19#post3758319
As a teaser: My first observation is that I probably misunderstood the ambiguity between "tribe" and "clan/band/family". That is to say, the Scrya CLAN is a lot smaller and less important than I assumed the Scyra TRIBE was.
There probably isn't a Tribe, just a large, extended family.
I think it probably happened later (because no A's) and under different circumstance. But it definitely happened (this is Nanoha we're talking about).
And yes, no cartridge system. And I think that's a good think. I was always disappointed by how they took the quick power-up option and it allowed to match the Wolkenritter... Well, the downsize of not having cartridge is that it is really cool...
Or they somehow decided to use them at some point (possible, but considering having cartridge with intelligent device was almost a first in A's, it's probable that they did'nt want to risk it) . But I would like to see Nanoha and Fate (because even if we introduce some other from the MGLN's cast as a master (or not) before, those two will probably appear) shine without cartridge. They are probably experienced enough for it to be an option.
No actually I think Nanoha would never have been injured since it was specifically overuse of the cartridge system that led to her body getting into such bad shape that she got hurt at all, and the only reason they got the cartridge system was because of the Wolkenritter.
I'm interested at how the Holy Grail War will play out. While the Wolkenritter can't beat a Servant, they can certainly help a lot and with Saber around to handle the frontline they should do well. Also, Rin's reaction should be gold.
The more I think of it, the more I like this scenario. Hey fraggle, do you mind if I write some snippets for this sometime?
Not to mention, No Book of Darkness means Fate doesn't get over her mommy issues as fast without the 'false world' thing that happens to her.
Life at best is Bittersweet
-Jack Kirby
Ding dong!!!!!!!!
Bki, Stop reading my mind please. Indeed, the lack of the cartridge system has rapidly altered the time line, as it was quite possible the upgrade which led to Nanoha's accident. Her normal training was already to much, but the forced output of an device equipped with cartridges? They did say they were bloody dangerous in the beginning of A's, before they trew the warning out of the window and gave them to every kid on the block -_-.
In this timeline Nanoha did almost burn out during her teens, but she was forced to reflect on her training methods when it showed that it takes a grave price.
This message was strongly enforced by her kohai Yayami Hayate, who was recruited around a year later after her after a small incident let to nanoha encountering her in a barrier cast by a small fugutive who tried to escape TSAB law.. In Hayate's admiration of Nanoha she quickly joined the TSAB and strived to become just as good as her, nearly burning herself out in the process, athough serious injuries were prevented and she recovered completely after 6 weeks. It did force Nanoha to reflect on her own ways, as apparently she had inspired Hayate to do the same training as she had done and after her medical checkup they warn her that it could have been her instead of Hayate on forced leave for recovery. After this event Nanoha swore to become the best magic instructor to prevent anyone else getting hurt because of her own reckless training methods.
several years pass
After completing her last examination Nanoha invites her friends over to earth to celebrate. A great time is had by all, until the wolkenritter preform a party crash as they attack in their desperation to find more linker cores before it is to late.
True, she probably still has those feelings deep inside of her. The parralels and contrast between her and Shirou are interesting though, as they are both 'fakes'.
Illya is best servant
I don't think Nanoha would have even been sent on that mission where she got injured since she wouldn't be as famous and wouldn't have Hayate and the Wolkenritter to support her on the mission.
Code:[07:55:59] <Spinach> Take off your clothes Kirby [07:56:07] <Kirby> I'm in class [20:37:34] <Lian|phone> there is a such thing as lingerie for guys? [20:37:54] <Kyokushi> yea [20:37:57] <Kyokushi> they're called jockstraps [20:38:02] <Lian|phone> :o [20:38:07] * Lian|phone googles [20:38:10] <Kyokushi> NO [20:38:11] <Kyokushi> DON'T [20:40:07] <Lian|phone> okay [20:40:16] <Lian|phone> I don't think I should have googled that [12:59:30] <Spinach> call me onii-chan, bitch [13:00:12] <kroyo> imma fuck ur shit up onii-fam
The cartridge system had a role, but the reason is the INSANE training she did, starting during the time between the first season and A's (that and the overuse of Starlight Breaker). And I think Nanoha would have continued like that until something convinced her that it was a really bad idea, ie, the injuries. Without the event of A's, it would have happened later (a couple of years I think), and she would have been in a better state, but I think it would have happened anyway.
(edit : Well, I'm satisfied with fraggle's response on this subject (but curious about the party crash by the Wolkenritter... dammit) )
...
On "Wolkenritter vs Servant"... Let's not forget one of their strength : there are four of them. With Vita and Signum attacking at close range, Shamal supporting them along with Zafira (who can also protect Shamal against attack directed against her), I think they stand a decent chance. Especially if it's possible to drain Servant like they can drain linker core (I don't see why not). Then, Portal-steal-linker core attack when the Servant is distracted by the two heavy hitter... (won't work on Saber because of her instinct. Don't know if her magic resistance would protect her against this attack.)
...
edit 2 : @Kyokushi
She was not really famous when she was injured. Even without the A's event, the TSAB will use a AAA's mage if she decides to join them.
already posted my take on nahoha's training, and Hayate's role in it.
Remember that Wolkenritter can be seen as super-powered humans, but that their powers are mostly D-rank.
They will probably face an servant like Lancer first, and will probably be forced into defense.
Then they meet Berserker........
CG Emiya himself has proven that even with weaker stats you can still triumph with skill, but even if the Wolkenritter have loads of experience, they can' t compensate for the difference in pure capacity between a Wolkenritter and a Servant. Remember that they share a strong sense of pride an chivalry, so they will try to fight in the frontline. although servant do have a 'core' that possesses their power it isn't easy to grab, and a servant might just break free out of any bindings on strength alone.
Besides, the servants themselves aren't the only enemies here.......
Illya is best servant
Between Jason and Kuzuki, I'm not sure that Caster goes for "nice guys".
Yuuno also wouldn't be nearly as accepting of Caster's energy-gathering tactics.
Yuuno might make a good match with Rider, though. Magical fields and chains galore? And they both love reading.
More seriously, Yuuno and Rin might make a good match, being young geniuses dedicated to magic and academic pursuits. Rin is more the magic and Yuuno is more he academics, but they have enough common ground.
Yuuno could possibly seal the functions of the Crest Worm inside Sakura, and/or teleport it straight out of her body, all within a field that cuts Zouken off from communicating with or controlling the worms. If anything could win Sakura's gratitude...
You know what would be ugly? If Shirou discovers that the Wolkenritter have been draining Linker Cores from him, and he attributes Caster's actions to them. Or, for that matter, Caster throwing the Wolkenritter's actions in Shirou's face.
Caster: No Shirou. Your family are the monsters.
Shirou: No.....no! They would do that to innocent people!
Caster: But they did. And they did it all for you. All so that you could live.
You know, because Shirou's survivor's guilt isn't enough. Now people really would still be alive and well if he had just died in the Fuyuki fire. In a very real way, the world would be a better place without him in it.
Mwa. Ha. Ha.
