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Thread: Fate/Apocrypha: Free Range Spoiler Thread

  1. #11561
    A Spicy Soul Tikigod784's Avatar
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    Archer was probably handwaived into the Moon Cell.
    This is how you smalltext
    [ RUBY=small text] Normal text [/RUBY]

  2. #11562
    Italy's most casual Type Moon fan ~Freedom's Avatar
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    But just how do you make a contract with the Moon Cell?

    You just go "Hey, can I become a Heroci Spirit? Pretty please????"

    BTW, does anyone know how the translation of volume 3 is going?
    Last edited by ~Freedom; February 1st, 2015 at 06:49 AM.

  3. #11563
    Bitchin' Arashi_Leonhart's Avatar
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    It's probably the same way you make a contract with the World.

    1) Have some form of circumstance that would place you in the position of a heroic spirit if you had the power
    2) Have the knowledge of the contract system
    3) ????
    4) Profit

  4. #11564
    アルテミット・ワン Ultimate One Kat's Avatar
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    ^^As I checked last night Canonrap has not updated his page with vol. 3 translations yet.

  5. #11565
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    So anyone who reads moon, did we actually get some descriptions of how radical real Dragons are when Fafnir popped up?
    Last edited by Christemo; February 11th, 2015 at 06:25 AM.

  6. #11566
    other side of Red Garden AmADo VII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christemo View Post
    So anyone who reads moon, did we actually get some descriptions of how radical real Dragons are when Fafnir popped up?
    I don't get your question sorry.

  7. #11567
    アルテミット・ワン Ultimate One Kat's Avatar
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    How badass and powerful they are, he likely means.

  8. #11568
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmADo VII View Post
    I don't get your question sorry.
    Fafnir shows up, and he's big and spooky, but do we actually get a description on him? Like how Medusa's Pegasus gets described as being super tough and basically generates hurricane force with just floating.

  9. #11569
    other side of Red Garden AmADo VII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christemo View Post
    Fafnir shows up, and he's big and spooky, but do we actually get a description on him? Like how Medusa's Pegasus gets described as being super tough and basically generates hurricane force with just floating.
    no description related to power, (from Leticia's POV) it's just a huge dragon holding the grail in his mouth then gone to other side of the world.

  10. #11570
    アルテミット・ワン Ultimate One Kat's Avatar
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    How disappointing.

  11. #11571
    夜魔 Nightmare Shockwaver99's Avatar
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    That was fast. Guess I don't need to explain all by myself then. Is anyone still want to know Higashide, Ototsugu and especially Semiramis? If you're familiar with Shinichameleon from Tumblr, this person will explain everything about F/A. I'll post it if anyone curious to know what is he trying to say. Oh it's really long post, so I'll add spoiler tag just for avoid wall of text.

  12. #11572
    MEoDP are awesome, unless they're looking at you. beautyandnotthebeast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shockwaver99 View Post
    That was fast. Guess I don't need to explain all by myself then. Is anyone still want to know Higashide, Ototsugu and especially Semiramis? If you're familiar with Shinichameleon from Tumblr, this person will explain everything about F/A. I'll post it if anyone curious to know what is he trying to say. Oh it's really long post, so I'll add spoiler tag just for avoid wall of text.
    I've never heard of this guy until your mentioned him in your post above.
    If the question is Tsukihime vs Fate, what is the answer.

  13. #11573
    アルテミット・ワン Ultimate One Kat's Avatar
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    I don't trust him to be completely reliable given that guy had some slips, as I heard.

  14. #11574
    MEoDP are awesome, unless they're looking at you. beautyandnotthebeast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kat View Post
    I don't trust him to be completely reliable given that guy had some slips, as I heard.
    So is it worth asking for what he's got to say.
    If the question is Tsukihime vs Fate, what is the answer.

  15. #11575
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors
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    Shinichameleon is responsible for convincing half the internet that ufotable was working on an anime original route, for one thing.

  16. #11576
    アルテミット・ワン Ultimate One Kat's Avatar
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    Yup, that's why I'm not willing to take anything he says as a truth.

  17. #11577
    夜魔 Nightmare Shockwaver99's Avatar
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    lol. Anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shini
    I’m sorry if my English writing is kinda terrible, I know, I know. I try my best as far as I could, just to make sure everyone understand where is this going, okay? Good. Right now I want to explain what’s going on, why we suddenly focus on these topics again, and sounds like we’re not done yet with F/A.


    Oh by the way, if you want to link this post, I suggest don’t do it. Reminder this is my privacy blog, I mean you can’t link it without any password. However I allow anyone copy this post and paste it anywhere if you want to, also don’t forget to credit my name. Supposedly I was planning to submit this post in my main blog but for some reason I feel unconfindence and not ready to post it in public yet.


    Warning: This post has spoiler content, you have been warned. Alright then, click “keep reading”.

    Spoiler:


    Yuichirou Higahshide is a writer of Propeller company. Most known of his works.....Ehmmm....Bullet Battlers, Evolimit, Princess Waltz, Ayakashibito, and most everyone knows what his latest work, it’s Fate/Apocrypha, under the direction by Kinoko Nasu. This is second times that Nasu supervised his work, after he had done collaborated with Gen Urobuchi, who were written Fate/Zero. Higashide was one of Nasu’s friend since during his college life until he joins Propeller and then TYPE MOON. Hanageya Jin, Gen Urobuchi, Sakurai Hikaru, Ryogo Narita, Kinoko Nasu and himself were knew each other before TYPE MOON becomes well known company.

    Okay I’m not good at explain his background history and I’m trying to be honest here, when I hearing his name, doesn’t ring a bell to me for some reason. Not only just me, I’m surprise that same goes for everyone especially Japanese fans because Higashide is very obscure author you’ve ever heard. When you think when hear famous name like Urobuchi, Narita and name any famous authors, you thinking “Hey, it’s that an author who writes *Insert well-known title name*!”. Higashide has no work has become famous that everyone else knows about it until Fate/Apocrypha, supposedly it were originally Nasu’s main project. I’m not saying this because Higashide sucks or anything else negative comments about him, it’s just he is too obscure that makes everyone can’t describe what he was about, or any works from him. Just name any of his works that can guarantee everyone knows, anything but Fate/Apocrypha.

    Thankfully I have gathered several information about him thanks to Japanese fans especially Merem Blog (Except JBBS troll users, unless there is an exception if something caught my attention), Twitter and pretty much Pixiv, the only website I can communicate with Japanese fans easily. Also honorable mentioned for Beast’s Lair and Weibo.

    I’m no quality writing expert, I never read his previous works, so I can’t tell how development his writing skill is. I don’t care about quality writing. All I want to know is focus what’s going on, how did that happen, why this has to do or whatever. So don’t you ever dare stop me if I say something negative about him and his works. Unless you have support argument, like third party evidence such as his popularity news or something like that.

    According from majority fans, Higashide writes his own cliche traits (Just like Urobuchi’s how to kill your character and writes a downer ending), everyone knows each of his works had always included two or more characters use firearm rather than sword, shield, lance or etc. What the most beyond is that Higashide includes 8-11 cliche traits in each one of his works but this time, F/A has six cliche traits only. I guess there is good reason why Nasu involves the project and becomes supervisor.

    So at least we can focus five traits first, while the last six trait, that I will add it in conclusion, not in this post by the way, the other post. Because the sixth cliche trait is probably “berserk button” for non-Japanese fans out there including myself and especially Japanese fans who likes their favorite character. Let just say it’s not very cool, at all. Here we go:

    Spoiler:

    1. Guns. Why guns? Because he loves it so much, with passion. Remember Nasu said he still fetishing his hobby? My first reaction when I heard he saying like that, I was like “Nasu, you must be drunked” and then someone from Beast’s Lair proves this:

    http://i.imgur.com/is5cvkw.jpg


    Damn, I guess Higashide really loves guns afterall. Now when it comes to guns, it’s obviously Kairi Shishigou, the master of Saber of Red aka Mordred. Come on, he uses fancy and cool looking gun he got there. I have been recalled that Kairi is Higashide’s favorite character, so that is debatable. AND THEN WE HAVE A PROBLEM: Reika Rikudou, the master of Assassin of Black aka Jack The Ripper, uses guns too.


    What’s main problem of this cliche trait according from fans who had known his previous works and stated Higashide wanking his fetish than character themselves. Basically more guns, less character development. This answers Higashide being fanboy everytime when he always talking about firearms. This is kinda worries me when I suddenly remember Kairi is being one of them and hopefully Higashide don’t focus too much on it. Suprisingly, Kairi less use his gun since last time we’ve heard he fought Fiore Forvedge in Vol.2. So what happen there? Maybe Nasu gives him a helpful advice?


    Whatever I think Higashide loves gun, I always think he is crazy assassin dude from Assassination Classroom.


    2. Higashide loves horror genre. Just list it anything related to horror genre like monster, vampire, supernatural and any some sort of bizarre black magic he interests it. Especially ghoul by the way, because that is another Higashide’s cliche trait. I’m not talking about cool, flashy looking, awesomeness and badass ghoul like Tokyo Ghoul or any ghoul type anime/manga/novel/game out there. Actually what we’re looking for is generic, man-flesh eating, horrifying (and weird) design, and has ability to possess individual or group and mind breaks.




    When I heard he likes ghoul, I had thought it was Spartacus supposed to be token ghoul because his Noble Phantasm transforms him into some-wriggly-creepy-tentacle but he’s not. I guess it was Vlad? Nope, and he’s not a vampire, until he actives his trump card but he is not ghoul we’re looking for. Believe it or not, Spartacus and Vlad are both designed by Gen Urobuchi, known as Urobutcher. Both have ability to transforms into monstrous form due to Noble Phantasm activation and both died in volume 2 at the same time.


    After volume 2 and 3, I was like “I guess there’s no ghoul anywhere in F/A from what I’ve heard so far”. Until that is volume 4 reveals it was JACK THE RIPPER, has this trait. She explodes herself into hundred ghost children, traumatizes Sieg and Atalanta. After Jack has been exorcised by Jeanne, the corrupt spirit escapes then possesses Atalanta.


    Do you want to know what’s weird about this trait? Higashide designs too many ridiculous monsters/villains that questioning everyone’s curiosity, like this one for example:





    3. “Name any character has may a lot of potential but butchered too fast by Higashide for no reason”. I think this is everyone’s least favourite of Higashide’s cliche trait. Before anyone ask, yes he had butchered so many characters from his previous works including F/A. Which is the reason why everyone called him “Urobuchi’s partner in crime” but unlike Urobuchi, Higashide does it immediately without put as much effort as he could for his three or more characters. You could say that he doesn’t care his character so much at all. How many F/A characters has this trait? Darnic Prestone, Celenike Icecolle, Rouche Frain, Reika Rikudou and so on. Just list it how many characters from F/A who weren’t designed and written by Kinoko Nasu.


    There are four symptoms of this trait:


    - When a character actives trump card, there’s a chance that character will be killed ASAP even though reveals the true power or true form once. Sometimes Higashide kills the character if never reveal the true power despite who has potential, like Celenike for example.

    - When a character is going to die, there’s a chance that Higashide writes humiliate, agony, being idiot ball or “what the hell” moment for him/her. No sad moment or whatsover. He absolutely shows no mercy for good guys too, like Rouche Frain. HOW?!?!

    - Oh, the character will be killed for real immediately, maybe at least in one chapter, one volume or one-three pages. Depend on how much character got screen times you can spot him/her.

    - Lastly, fate worse than death, if Higashide decides not to kill his character anyway.


    I swear to god that Higashide is your typically sadism author, maybe worse than Urobuchi or Tomino but not as cool as both Urobuchi and Tomino if you ask me. Speaking about sadism, oh boy....Do I have to do it?


    4. Charisma break, heel-face turn, humiliation conga and butt monkey. If you’re familiar with Touhou Project, then you know what charimsa break is, if not, google it and you will find your answer there. When I mentioned these four tropes, your answer obviously must be “Gordes”, “IT’S GORDES!”, “Are we talking about Gordes?”, “Gordo-san?”, “That can’t be anyone but him”.


    Yup, you’re absolutely... half correct.


    Gordes is your token F/A butt monkey. He becomes good guy, but being Gordes is REALLY suffering. However, all these four tropes are not Higashide’s common cliche trait, it’s more like he is very fond of these tropes for some reason and both are very weak. Keep in mind, I never read any Higashide’s previous works, so I can’t find any character has these traits as same as Gordes. Even my friend who knew a few Higashide’s works stated it was hard to find a butt monkey character somewhere in his previous works. Thankfully, at least my friends confirmed that there was an another character who had suffered just like Gordes. They showed me these pictures. I look at it...



    Hey, not bad. I don’t see what’s so bad about this character. What could be possibly go wro-

    SWEETMOTHEROFMERCYWHATTHEHELLAMILOOKINGATMYEYESARE BURNING!!!! Okay, I.. add the link here, so you can see the image.

    http://i.imgur.com/xHZde2Q.jpg?1

    Because it is nsfw, mAYbE?!?! I DOn’T KnOW?!?! PlEAse doN’T tELL ME thERE’s MOre?!?!


    This is where’s Higashide being sadism kicks in. He teases his characters so much no matter what, even they’re being good guy or just they’re really official butt monkey. Only problem is, a bad guy who never heel-face turn were also has this trait too. Mostly focus on charisma break and/or sometimes maybe Higashide’s trait number 3 for the aforementioned purpose. You notice “Yup, you’re absolutely... half correct” sentence, because you forgot there is one more character, which means Gordes is not only one who were being suffering. Who is another character has this trait? Well honestly I do want reveal the character’s name but I rather everyone take a guess and find their own answer, just for amusement. Yeah I testing how smart you are if you can figure it out who the heck another butt monkey is, and no, it’s not Astolfo. I will reveal it in somewhere new post one day. Good luck with that.


    5. “A hero/heroine dies and a hero/heroine disappears”. I remember and learn this from Beast’s Lair when someone mentioning a character disappears into light before Vol.5 make it happen. Yes, it’s Kairi Shishigou and Mordred were victims of this cliche trait. I think it’s not bad cliche actually, because that’s how servant disappears when master dies, well depend on servant has Independent Action skill or not. I think it fits for them. Although there was another version of this trait. The story goes like this:


    A hero dies, disappears, or comatose while a heroine disappears (Or sometimes dies). Then narration tells us the story alternates the universe, reset the timeline or reincarnation, both characters were safe. You think it’s actually happy ending right? Sadly no, we’re follow Higashide’s way. When both were reincarnated or still same person, a hero/heroine doesn’t remember who his lover is while a hero/heroine still remember but ignore it and pretend nothing happen despite reset/alternated/reincarnated the universe.


    It’s sounds like bitter-sweet ending but again, It’s Higashide we’re talking about, it’s up to you whether you believe he doesn’t care his character or trolls his fans. The bad news is......this cliche happens in F/A, after Vol.5. Oh wow, after Vol.5? Now I wonder how did that happen?


    The reason why this cliche happened after Vol.5, because Ruler servant. For those who remember what would happen if you summon same person but they don’t remember who you are anymore? Every new Heroic Spirit will have no memories of their previous summoning or of everything that happened after their previous copy death. Unlike Saber from Fate/Zero and Fate/Stay Night, is only an exception due to she made a contract with the world in exchange of the Holy Grail and able to retains her memories in every new summoning. Ruler servants on the other hand, are also can retaining their memories too except its different than Saber. Correct me if I was wrong, I’m not sure if this is might correct answer or not.


    Well obviously Amakusa Shirou and Semiramis were victims of this trait. Semiramis is a normal servant while Amakusa is special servant who can retains his memories of each repeating game. Which means if Amakusa and Semiramis were summoned again, Amakusa still remember previous war while Semiramis DOESN’T remember anything at all including her relationship with him after her previous copy.

    This screams...fandom rejoiced. Why I call it fandom rejoiced, I will explain this later in post of conclusion. Now I wonder what happen if Amakusa and Jeanne were summoned as normal servant? Can they both retain their memories even they’re not Ruler anymore? I’m remember how hot topic is this whenever Merem Blog have brought into question about Heroic Spirits.





    Next topic, let’s about who were designed these characters. If you don’t remember who designs Achilles, Mordred, Avicebron, Chiron and others. Don’t worry, I list it here:

    Sieg, Jeanne d’Arc, Karna, Chiron, Achilles, Avicebron and Mordred, were designed and written by Kinoko Nasu.

    7 black faction masters, Jack The Ripper and Kairi Shishigou were designed by Yuichirou Higashide.


    Siegfried, Vlad III, Astolfo, Frankenstein’s monster, Atalanta, Spartacus, Shakespare and Semiramis were designed by various designers.

    Amakusa Shirou, thanks to Higashide’s “drunk buddy” aka Ryogo Narita, Nasu approves it an idea because “We need an antagonist” and yes, Shirou were designed by two (or three) designers. I suggest go read Fate/Strange Fake prototype light novel, Rider chapter. You’ll see where this idea comes from.


    I have several questions. Is anyone can please tell me why Nasu designs servant characters (Including Sieg) while Higashide, designs human characters and one servant? This is has to be probably the weirdest or uniqueness of planning design if I had ever seen it. Incase if you think this is first time Nasu had done something like this, well Fate/Extra and CCC material book tells us everyting about planning design there.

    Guess what. Master characters were designed by Wada Arco while servant characters were designed by Takeuchi Takashi. However both all characters were written by Nasu himself. Except......Nursery Rhyme wasn’t designed by Takeuchi because she is, in fact simple copy of her master who was designed by Wada Arco, except she is simply Alice in black outfit. While Kiara Sessyoin is the only one human character who was designed by Takeuchi and Nasu while Wada Arco has nothing to do with Kiara until final design.



    The reason why Kiara is only one human character were designed by Nasu and Takeuchi because she has connection with before Fate/Extra and CCC and relationship with Twice Pieceman. Basically she has more complex than other casts in Fate/Extra CCC.

    FUN FACT: Spoiler Alert!

    Kiara's background

    According from Kinoko Nasu & Takeuchi Takashi in EXTRA Material, Kiara Sessyoin is not her real name.


    Her real name is Inoriara Sessyoin and her actual age is late twenties. She was born as the daughter of true mantra of Tachikawa yo Tennaga, but she was bedridden and didn’t existed until at the age of 14 because she was sickly by birth. She was caught in commandments, that for their own “pitiable” appearance of the surrounding people who didn’t know it saves by saying, a pure human’s image that existed in the story vanished too.


    At the age of 14, the believer was told by a doctrine of spirit hacking, her sickness recovers in a moment completely unknown to the outside. However, it accompanies along missing people and the dead increased suddenly, and she was completely denied in the presence level to the father who became aware of the accident, the reason “Though she is a woman, I am seeking to become one with that woman”, he denied to realize it, then expelled on suspicions of violating two taboos of the Tachikawa Style. To that morrow, she takes away the father’s skull principal image, states “the master is deprived of technique tools” the last taboo was broken with this, the killer match of the believer, it left from all religious organizations that had become the dead, excluding her.


    Afterwards, though she has saved the believers’ belief of the Tachikawa Style, the believe who became loved dearly was said to committed suicide one after another for her. In addition, she was put on the wanted list by the Western Europe plutocracy for the exploitation of code cast of the electronic brain, the maximum taboo in history.


    Also she can fights and take down an average human nor a weak servant by her own potential without her final boss form. Just look at this video and count how many skills she got (Spoiler alert). And she is the first person who awakes ORT from eternal slumber....according from Koha Ace. Are you for real Keikenchi?



    Sorry for being random there. I just add fun fact info there just for share knowledge with you.


    And the rest I’ll explain in conclusion later. Save it for the best.


    That’s it for today. There’s more after this and we’re going to focus on Konoe Ototsugu next time. So I see you guys next week and take good care of yourselves.


    While I’m probably going to crazy and feel agony right now. Shockwaver99, Hovepany, Amily, GARSA Droid and Zetta, I’m blaming all of you for this
    .



  18. #11578
    アルテミット・ワン Ultimate One Kat's Avatar
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    Which means if Amakusa and Semiramis were summoned again, Amakusa still remember previous war while Semiramis DOESN’T remember anything at all including her relationship with him after her previous copy.
    I'm sure that only Arthuria is exception, so that dude is fanoning hard again (Let's disregard that Jeanne snucks out from Throne trainwreck ending).

  19. #11579
    分かろうとするな、感じれ Mcjon01's Avatar
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    That feels very inaccurate. Like, I couldn't tell you what is and isn't true, but my first instinct is to totally disregard everything and assume that all of the soft "opinion" parts are based on misinformation and misunderstandings, just from the writing style.

  20. #11580
    Tranquilo, Japones, Tranquilo JetKinen's Avatar
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    So hey.

    The "Charisma Broke'd" character is from Full Metal Daemon: Muramasa

    Which i think its not made by Higashide at all

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