Fortissimo EXA//Akkord:Bsusvier : Discussion and Video Walkthrough

[ItsaRandomUsername]

The moe! It's too much! Sayuki AND Momiji?!

[Erlkonig]

There is never enough moe.

Scene 8 was only the beginning.

[Kratosirving]

Not sure what you mean by Stage 8, but I take it that's a good thing.

[Eveonder]

Bullshit. They are a part of a character, but hardly the most important part of it. Shirou for example is much more defined as a character by his ideal and how he acts rather then UBW. Rin is defined by her Tsun-tsun behaviour and magus/good person dilemma, rather then by the fact that she can shoot Gandrs.

Battle powers are rather small part of a character and the only original fact about Archers fighting style is "2 black and white swords". That is it. You cant even say that Archer was the first to "bring those things together", since a "strategical fighter using swords" is hardly anything original.

If you look just at Archers fighting style (and completely disregard his personality), then he is even more cookie-cutter knockoff.

Are you saying Shirou would be the same character without tracing? Archer without UBW? Rin without her Gandrs and Gemcraft? These are defining characteristics as much as Rin's tsun-tsun or her knee socks. I disagree that battle powers are only a small part.

As for Archer. (You're straying away from the point. It seems we have differing opinions. It doesn't really matter if Archer is original. What matters is that Sayuki rips off Archer. Even if she rips off whoever you think Archer ripped off, she's still ripping off Archer.) Find me another 'strategical fighter using matching black and white weapons which are made of magic and cost efficient for primary weapons, but has stronger attacks that can be charged with magic including a homing attack, there's the strategy part of assessing enemies for weaknesses, hiding capabilities, and creating gaps, oh and boosting their physical abilities with magic'. And I haven't even touched on faker or UBW for this.

I know you can find 'strategy fighter using swords', 'two handed swordsmen', 'magically strengthened body', 'copying enemy abilities', 'exploding weapons', 'magic swords', 'homing attacks', even 'shooting swords from bow', but please find me another character that uses Archer's exact style or something similar enough like Archerko, that I would recognize think Archer immediately.

Conversely, give me those examples of the originals if Archer is a cookie-cutter knock-off. Are they really similar enough to make me think Archer is based off their template for combat? You've been calling Archer unoriginal, but that's your opinion right? If you adhere to the school that states everything is unoriginal because it's based on archetypes located in the collective human subconscious, then nothing is original.

But I've been arguing Sayuki rips off Archer's combat style based on how much this game has ripped and reorganized nasuverse in general and the details of Archer's style. Kratos said something good that I really liked earlier, Sayuki and Archer are like in parallel. If you're going to be that adamant and this doesn't manage to convince you Sayuki is partially based on Archer, then nothing I write will sway you.

He is a "faker", after all.

Nice touch there, IRUn.

How cruel! D=

...

How cute xD Thanks for the update!

[Erlkonig]

Not sure what you mean by Stage 8, but I take it that's a good thing.

Derp, got a bit sleepy there. Scene, not Stage.

[Lotus Saint]

So something about a Faker?
And some of the attacks look like ripoffs of other attacks.

[Mellon]

Are you saying Shirou would be the same character without tracing? Archer without UBW? Rin without her Gandrs and Gemcraft? These are defining characteristics as much as Rin's tsun-tsun or her knee socks. I disagree that battle powers are only a small part.

Yes, yes I would. Rin would lose absolutely nothing if her Magecraft was for instance... say wind manipulation. Her character would not change a single bit. Conversely, Rin = Luvia, right? Cause they totally have identical abilities. Same for UBWend!Shirou and Archer. Completely identical characters right there.

But I've been arguing Sayuki rips off Archer's combat style based on how much this game has ripped and reorganized nasuverse in general and the details of Archer's style. Kratos said something good that I really liked earlier, Sayuki and Archer are like in parallel. If you're going to be that adamant and this doesn't manage to convince you Sayuki is partially based on Archer, then nothing I write will sway you.

Stop trying to backpedal now. You said:

I'm saying character X rips off character Y in most all traits except gender as a base.

No "partially", but that Sayuki is a straight copy of Archer. Which is an absolutely worthless statement from all angles. The fact that her personality is completely different, she uses guns and has superfast dash move, means that Sayuki is already "different" from the "mold" you set out. Also, stop worthlessly padding out your description with aspects which are completely meaningless.

Find me another 'strategical fighter using matching black and white weapons which are made of magic and cost efficient for primary weapons, but has stronger attacks that can be charged with magic including a homing attack, there's the strategy part of assessing enemies for weaknesses, hiding capabilities, and creating gaps, oh and boosting their physical abilities with magic'.

Is basically a "Strategical fighter who uses two magical swords, high physical ability and a homing attack". But that sounds less intimidating I guess. If you start demanding specific strategies, then I can easily talk about how Sayuki has her abilities named in German and Archer has not.

In the same way you can say that "Sayuki is completely copied off Archer", I can say that "Archer is unoriginal".

But enough of this in any case. Lets agree to disagree and not clutter the thread anymore.

[Eveonder]

I didn't back pedal. I mostly talked about their combat template. You're just interpreting out of context. =/

Yes, yes I would. Rin would lose absolutely nothing if her Magecraft was for instance... say wind manipulation. Her character would not change a single bit. Conversely, Rin = Luvia, right? Cause they totally have identical abilities. Same for UBWend!Shirou and Archer. Completely identical characters right there.

Battle powers are important. I was talking about outside the nasuverse. Giving inverse examples is basically cheating isn't it? It's like saying DnD druids resemble each other. But still, if Rin used wind magic, she wouldn't be complaining about the costiness of her gems. And as you said yourself, Rin = Luvia. Part of their rivalry is based on the fact they have the same ability. Also Tohsaka's stole Gandr. If they had different abilities, their dynamics would be different.

No "partially", but that Sayuki is a straight copy of Archer. Which is an absolutely worthless statement from all angles. The fact that her personality is completely different, she uses guns and has superfast dash move, means that Sayuki is already "different" from the "mold" you set out. Also, stop worthlessly padding out your description with aspects which are completely meaningless.

She's ripped off Archer. I conceded that they're two different characters but I refuse to concede that 'Sayuki is not based on Archer'. You seem determined to argue with me for the sake of it though. I'm making a detailed description that demonstrates how Sayuki would be based on Archer, it's just a compilation of similarities.

Is basically a "Strategical fighter who uses two magical swords, high physical ability and a homing attack". But that sounds less intimidating I guess. If you start demanding specific strategies, then I can easily talk about how Sayuki has her abilities named in German and Archer has not.

You're simplifying it down way too much. As for the finest details, well duh, they can't violate copyright. It's like you selectively compare only the most general traits that can be described in less than a sentence or the finest details, which can't be the same due to copyright issues. But that's fine, even with just that, find me examples of this unoriginal "Strategical fighter who uses two magical swords, high physical ability and a homing attack" character. Or perhaps the original since Archer is a knock-off.

In the same way you can say that "Sayuki is completely copied off Archer", I can say that "Archer is unoriginal".

For the first part, that's not what I meant. For the latter, so what?

edit:

But enough of this in any case. Lets agree to disagree and not clutter the thread anymore.

Just saw this. Ya. =__= I feel like we're starting to troll each other. It was interesting though.

Add on:

Here's my review for the lastest bit.

Sayuki is definitely cute. She's apparently not a morning person but makes cute noises when half asleep. I loved some of her expressions. Momiji showing up was expected but that girl can really charge on ahead regardless of contradictions huh? I can see her destroying that everyday life she strives so hard to protect with her own hands. Well, it seems choices in the VN really aren't choices since they end up the same way in the end, unless you end up dead. It's not surprising past the 4th way that Sakura continues to exist outside Eyespace but Momiji's non-reaction to it is interesting. The thing that has me curious is whether or not Da Capo works outside Eyespace.

On another note, I recommend Majikoi as a VN. The manga, Shinken de Watashi ni Koi Shinasai!, should give you some idea of what it is. Set in the same verse as Kimi ga Aruji de Shitsuji ga Ore de (You Are My Noble Masters).

Fortissimo EXA//Akkord:Bsusvier is huge... I need to transfer some stuff onto my portable HD or I'll be down to the red zone.

Question for Kratos and Mellon, do you guys know katagana or hiragana? Or are you getting by with just what Atlas gives you?

[Kratosirving]

Personally, I'm using ATLAS and a couple of other translation programs since not every thing that goes into ATLAS comes out right; cross-checking with other translations helps give a clearer picture, although it's still not perfect. Thus, you'll notice there's some things that seem a little off as you're watching the videos, like some words don't fit at all or whatever. It's the best I can do, however, since I'm not proficient in the language myself.

Also, the reason why Sakura exists outside of Eyespace has technically been answered, since Reiji is the 13th magi involved in this war when there should have only been 12. In other words, he's a wild card and wasn't in the plan, so he's not restricted like the other 12 participants are.

Of course, since the War began right after Reiji moved back, you might be able to argue that doesn't make sense, but than again, Ryuichi also moved back on the same day, which pretty much makes him the original 12th player.

And on that note, because Sakura can exist outside of Eyespace, I'll go ahead and confirm that Da Capo can be used outside of it as well, since it's a logical step to reason.


About Sayuki, she's actually fine with waking up, it's just the fact that she stayed up all night on watch detail that she was exhausted. As for cute noises...well, some people just make sounds you don't expect to hear from them until they make them.

And choices, yeah so far they don't seem to matter too much, but considering I missed some scenes through my primary playthrough when I was attempting to perfect clear it, I have to assume that a combination of certain choices will unlock certain scenes, since I doubled back on every decision to see what the choices held.

[Mellon]

I know katagana and hiragana (learned japanese for 2 years) and it certainly helps in some situations, but the voices in the VN are much more helpful in this case. As for translation programs, I am using an application called Translation Aggerator, which puts the text through ATLAS + 6 web translators. It also has a great plugin, which allows you to force the translators to ignore a certain word (like a name) and insert a fixed meaning to it.

Quite helpful so that name kanjis (character and ability names) dont get translated as different words for example.

Fortissimo system is a bitch though. Had to alt-tab after every single line so I could read the translation.

EDIT: Also, is anyone willing enough to bounce back the RP ideas that I have? I probably wont start anytime soon (in June the earliest), but it would be nice to get feedback on some of the ideas I have.

[Kratosirving]

Oooo, that's an interesting sounding program, I might have to look into that if I start having a lot of trouble. With that being said, here's Scene 25!




Edit: Since it was real short and I don't want to dual post, here's a nice touching Scene 26.





Deus Ex Edit: Again, since Scene 27 was short as well, here it is as well!

[ItsaRandomUsername]

Updates! Nice.

Also, regarding the RP idea, it might be rather fun. I'd support that.

[Kratosirving]

Yeah, I wouldn't be able to do it until after this is all said and done though. XD

Plus, in order to do it effectively, anyone involved would have to have a full understanding of whatever character they wanted to RP (or at least decent understanding, such as character personalities and battle skills)


Also, I think I'm going to be dead from a nosebleed for a while after I finally went through and unlocked a scene that had me blushing and laughing my ass off. What picture you ask? I'll show, along with a line from it.



Momiji: Kya! D-Don't move so suddenly!

[Erlkonig]

But Da Capo is invincible, there is no way to win a war against Fullpower!Reiji.

...Well, that is what the prologue implies.

[ItsaRandomUsername]

Dat ass.

[Mellon]

Well, the RP I have in mind is more "based" on Fortissimo concepts, rather then being an actual RP with Fortissimo characters. Bit of a different story and system there, though there are certainly large similarities. And as I said, nothing will start before sometime June anyway.

Maa, a very basic concept would be something around "Fortissimo Ragnarok, only with actual reincarnated gods (as in the characters themselves possess the memories of a dead god) from Norse, Greek and Egyptian pantheons duking it out".

Add in stuff like "The fighting space changes each time, granting advantages to a certain pantheon" and there is nice potential there.

[ItsaRandomUsername]

I know that I shouldn't participate in another Roleplay, but I'd sign up for that in a heartbeat.

[Kratosirving]

Heheheh.

Oh, and I have a correction to state, now that I'm 100% sure of it. Choices DO matter; at least in following subplots. Still have 5 Scenes missing, and I know I can get two of those if I do certain choices near the start; trying to figure out how to get the other 3 is proving to be a little frustrating though.

Edit: Another Correction. Now I KNOW I'll have all of the Scenes eventually, and basically the choices will affect whether you miss about 5-9 Scenes (I missed 9) after your first playthrough.

[Eveonder]

Ohh... Update. Excellent!

I see...
@Mellon, First, Thanks. I'm taking a look at TA and its plugins and it looks great. It looks at lot more useful than the Japanese learning material I have, which will take years to pay off, lol. I've watched enough anime for voices to be somewhat helpful though I'm worried about the info dump parts. I'll test it out after I DL Fortissimo.
And then, sounds like a great RP. It would require some work on part of the RPers to research Norse mythology but sounds good overall. Perhaps the gods have different sets of memories influenced by modern myth (FSN)?

[Kratosirving]

The voices help a ton, no doubt; but if I'm doing well enough with just 3 programs, I'm sure the additional 3 in TA will help enough.