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Thread: Heaven's Feel Movies - Third Coming Spring 2020

  1. #9061
    咲き誇るは薔薇の皇帝 Levani's Avatar
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    That is a ... huge topic lol.

    I also don't like how you painted Japanese culture with backward mentality even though sexism regarding female virginity is a prominent factor all over the world, including the 'progressive' EU and USA.

  2. #9062
    ちちうえ~❤ AmADo VII's Avatar
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    it's old otaku culture, non-virgin females were not appreciated in eroge back then.

    Sakura was really hated just because she wasn't a virgin.
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  3. #9063
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six asterism42's Avatar
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    Also why Saber was 'I've never been with a man before', or whatever she said

    - - - Updated - - -

    I think it's just a matter of possessiveness. Like, "she's only ever had sex with
    ME
    Shirou
    , that means
    our
    their
    relationship is SPESHUL. Also it means that even if
    I
    he
    , as a loser virgin nerd, is super bad at sex, she'll never find out."

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also double standards. Like, when has any culture ever not considered female virginity as a precious commodity that must be protected?
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandstorm77 View Post
    He's just putting the bone of his sword into other people until it explodes and lets out parts of him inside them.
    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerEmiya View Post
    Genderswaps are terrible, but I think I and other people would hate them less if Fate didn't keep ignoring actual heroines throughout history and folklore. Like, why bother turning Francis Drake into a woman when Ching Shih and Grace O'Malley exist?
    Quote Originally Posted by Five_X View Post
    Fate Zero is just Fate Stay Night for people who think Shirou is too girly

  4. #9064
    咲き誇るは薔薇の皇帝 Levani's Avatar
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    I remember Saber saying she knows how to please a man? shittyoldnasuhentai

  5. #9065
    Horseman War of Apocalypse Knight of Rebellion13's Avatar
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    She secretly watch lancelot too much

    Bad... bad Arthuria
    Spoiler:

    War bring nothing but loss for both sides

  6. #9066
    日輪よ、死に随え GundamFSN's Avatar
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    “To otaku, virginity is an ideal.”

    It's prob based on the concept of eternal love that if you relinquish your virginity then you're bound to live your life forever with the partner you offered your virginity to. That is also why you often see girls in animu/mango saying "i can't get married anymore" when they're sexually harassed. It's kinda like the objectification of girls I suppose.

    Iirc, even the producer of AKB48 says that each idol belongs to the fans or something so yeah, otaku problem.


    Something
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    I see how it is Nasu, changing waifus like underwear, right?

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  7. #9067
    ちちうえ~❤ AmADo VII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knight of Rebellion13 View Post
    She secretly watch lancelot too much

    Bad... bad Arthuria
    fyi Merlin is half Incubus.
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    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six forumghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knight of Rebellion13 View Post
    She secretly watch lancelot too much

    Bad... bad Arthuria
    My headcanon is that Round Table meetings frequently devolved into Lancelot and the other Knights boasting to each other about their Amazing Sexual Exploits (with Mordred constantly trying to include herself in the talks with ridiculous and anatomically impossible stories that made it obvious she had no idea) all while Saber is just sitting there with her most stoic and Kingly expression on her face.

  9. #9069
    Deadpan Dead People LegalLoliLover's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmADo VII View Post
    it's old otaku culture, non-virgin females were not appreciated in eroge back then.

    Sakura was really hated just because she wasn't a virgin.
    When was Dies Irae made? Main universe Rusalka (AKA not red Anna) is clearly not... Oh, wait, no route. Never mind.
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    Spoiler:

  10. #9070
    Horseman War of Apocalypse Knight of Rebellion13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    My headcanon is that Round Table meetings frequently devolved into Lancelot and the other Knights boasting to each other about their Amazing Sexual Exploits (with Mordred constantly trying to include herself in the talks with ridiculous and anatomically impossible stories that made it obvious she had no idea) all while Saber is just sitting there with her most stoic and Kingly expression on her face.
    lmaooo I want that fanfic seriously XDXD
    But isn't Gawain a married knight?
    Spoiler:

    War bring nothing but loss for both sides

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    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six Trubo's Avatar
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    Was a married knight. He takes "until death do us part" quite literally.
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    It's like if someone told me "make me a milkshake" and i was blind and they gave me the ingredients and I made a milkshake because milkshakes are good, but it turns out that milkshake was a bomb.

  12. #9072
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six asterism42's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knight of Rebellion13 View Post
    But isn't Gawain a married knight?
    Married people can have Amazing Sexual Exploits too. Maybe even moreso than the bachelors, since they're not trying to make a good impression anymore.

    and fyi tristan and gareth were married too

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also while he may have married eventually, he still definitely fucked the Green Knight's wife.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandstorm77 View Post
    He's just putting the bone of his sword into other people until it explodes and lets out parts of him inside them.
    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerEmiya View Post
    Genderswaps are terrible, but I think I and other people would hate them less if Fate didn't keep ignoring actual heroines throughout history and folklore. Like, why bother turning Francis Drake into a woman when Ching Shih and Grace O'Malley exist?
    Quote Originally Posted by Five_X View Post
    Fate Zero is just Fate Stay Night for people who think Shirou is too girly

  13. #9073
    Taiga's knight Tobias's Avatar
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    it came up later that saber’s “I know how to please a man” line came from her having some beginner level experience in the matter. Considering the life she lead I think it’s pretty likely she had actually gotten a blow job from guinivere some point and really liked it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bird of Hermes View Post
    The moment the opportunity arises for a pun, the one known as 'Taiga's Knight' will be there to deliver whether you like it or not.

  14. #9074

  15. #9075
    死徒 Dead Apostle ballinamon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by purple_teardrops View Post
    This has probably been mentioned a few many times to the locals, but still...

    Am i the only who's feeling somewhat shocked over the fact that the main female character is actually mentioning that her virginity is no more, with a seriously concerned face? That whole "i'm not longer a shoujo" (you will fear my elite jap skills) line of conversation...

    Also, i recall that back when i was playing F/SN, one of the things that i mostly appreciated about the heaven's feel route was that finally one of the girls wasn't looking like as though she was getting raped during the erotic scenes. I couldn't truly read them, i can't say i was interested in the erotic side of those visual novels, but still it felt somewhat enjoyable to see a girl actually enjoying sex in the game... The way Tohsaka and Saber behaved during those scenes were a true turn off.

    Once that's said, is this something of a hint of how backwards japanese culture is? I mean, given the amount of erotic material produced in that country (which is shocking by itself), it would make sense that they are that backward...

    Could someone give me an overview of the way the japanese view female virginity and overall sexual activity?
    This didn't originate of a VN where the twist was the one of the heroines was NTR the MC and that actually caused a massive shitstorm with burned disk, threats of death and a lot more?

  16. #9076
    吸血鬼 Vampire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knight of Rebellion13 View Post
    But isn't Gawain a married knight?
    Quote Originally Posted by asterism42 View Post
    Also while he may have married eventually, he still definitely fucked the Green Knight's wife.
    Welcome to the "wonderful" concept of courtly love

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Courtly_love

    Courtly love (Occitan: Fin'amor French: Amour Courtois) was a medieval European literary conception of love that emphasized nobility and chivalry. Medieval literature is filled with examples of knights setting out on adventures and performing various deeds or services for ladies because of their "courtly love". This kind of love is originally a literary fiction created for the entertainment of the nobility, but as time passed, these ideas about love changed and attracted a larger audience. In the high Middle Ages, a "game of love" developed around these ideas as a set of social practices. "Loving nobly" was considered to be an enriching and improving practice.
    I do recall this was claimed to be the basis for the popularity of later practices such as wife swapping in European high society (and a favorite justification of Edward VII for his their affairs, said justification being later on used by his male subjects for their sexual wife sharing rings) but I don't remember the exact book where the claim was made.

    Courtly love is also why there are stories about Guinevere and Lancelot's affair being seen in a more sympathetic approuch and the two actually being in love being good (because Arthur is a neglectful/bad/abusive husband and Guinevere is trapped in a loveless marriage and Lancelot needs to save her cause he is a knight and all that) while other stories paint them in a more damning light (because Guinevere actually loves Arthur and he's a good husband, but this pretty boy Lancelot is bad news and is a homewrecker who's trying to come between the two and is also breaking his vows). Also why Gawain could make a move on the Green Knight's wife while also being true to his own wife. Although that one depends on the story and also the extent of the move he was making on her due to the situation.


    Quote Originally Posted by AmADo VII View Post
    it's old otaku culture, non-virgin females were not appreciated in eroge back then.

    Sakura was really hated just because she wasn't a virgin.
    Quote Originally Posted by GundamFSN View Post
    Iirc, even the producer of AKB48 says that each idol belongs to the fans or something so yeah, otaku problem.
    Yeah, like the whole topic about sexism in Japan is just as complex as it is in other countries/cultures (or just as simple in some cases) but in the anime/manga/VN/LN space at least, it all goes back into the otaku mentality and idol culture that the heroine or idol should only be "prue" (a virgin) and that anything less that that makes her used goods. It's pretty awful, but that was the way that many stories catered to otaku were written. I forget the extent to how badly this went, but I think even a main heroine having an older boyfriend or potentially having once had a crush on another character was enough "justification" for them being disliked.

    The idol industry as is is pretty awful in that regard because of how they give that illusion of how the idols are pure and belong to the fans, VNs and eroge in general had this problem as well because the stories are (usually) written from the perspective of the players themselves, and the goal is for the player to bond and then sleep with the heroine they are targeting, so an otaku would feel "cheated" the thing they were aiming for, even in the case of Sakura despite it being absurd since she was caught in this abusive web where she was abused, raped and sexually assaulted because Zouken had his twisted plans and Shinji was Shinji. People still hated that she wasn't a virgin regardless.

    There was a lot of things to not like about how HF approached this subject, but none of them had to do with Sakura not being a virgin. Or at least it shouldn't have been.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aozaki-desu View Post
    Guinevere in fgo when with interlude about her sexual relations with the king WHEN
    Maybe that's why Merlin gave Saber a dick

    I forget if Mordred actually mentioned this when after she rebelled and did the mock-proposal to Guinevere in Apo, but wasn't the implication was that the marriage wasn't actually consummated?
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  17. #9077
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six SpoonyViking's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by asterism42 View Post
    Also while he may have married eventually, he still definitely fucked the Green Knight's wife.
    Is that a Nasuverse addition? In the poem, they just kissed.
    My fanfics:
    The Gift (a Fate/Stay Night one-shot)
    - A duel between Cú Chulainn and Scáthach.
    Passion Acknowledged (a Fate/Stay Night one-shot) (Lemon) - Shirou and Shinji finally acknowledge their feelings.
    He Was a Good King (a Fate/Stay Night one-shot) - A short exploration of Beowulf's character as a hero and a king.
    A Fairy Tale of Love and Death (a Fate/Stay Night one-shot) - A meeting between Scáthach and King Hassan in the distant past.

  18. #9078
    Ever Cry.Never Life Inuhanyou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmADo VII View Post
    it's old otaku culture, non-virgin females were not appreciated in eroge back then.

    Sakura was really hated just because she wasn't a virgin.
    I think for the basement shut in's that's definately the case. but i think boiling down the controversial nature of HF and the Shirou Sakura relationship down to just that would be ill sighted. Goodness knows that's not one of the issues i've seen highlighted

    At the same time however, it would also be naive to think Japanese culture isnt backwards in certain ways. The whole "if your above 20 years old your old and undesirable as a woman" trope is not common, and its frankly just as stupid as the "i'll never be able to get married because of such and such", that's also very common in all Japanese media.
    Last edited by Inuhanyou; April 15th, 2019 at 05:46 PM.




  19. #9079
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six
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    Quote Originally Posted by purple_teardrops View Post
    Also, i recall that back when i was playing F/SN, one of the things that i mostly appreciated about the heaven's feel route was that finally one of the girls wasn't looking like as though she was getting raped during the erotic scenes. I couldn't truly read them, i can't say i was interested in the erotic side of those visual novels, but still it felt somewhat enjoyable to see a girl actually enjoying sex in the game... The way Tohsaka and Saber behaved during those scenes were a true turn off.
    Did you like miss every last bit of the entire 2nd sex scene in the Fate route that was done out of love and not "we need to save ourselves through sex" plot sex like the first scene was?

    Because that had no Rin shoving Shirou all the way into Saber because she felt he was going too slow.
    Last edited by warellis; April 15th, 2019 at 07:04 PM.

  20. #9080
    Ever Cry.Never Life Inuhanyou's Avatar
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    Nasu's sex scenes were pretty cringe though. all of them. the completely unnecessary nature of the ones regarding the threesome and Rin in UBW just stand out become of how pointless they are




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