Nasuverse eschatology discussion [SPOILERS]

[Seika]

Yet again, keeping the Japanese has proven to be the correct choice.

That radically alters the entire context I'd had that bit in for my headcanon though. Something very different has to happen if we're to end up with Notes within the timeframe we guess at it having, because I don't think anyone says it's millions of years in the future.

[mewarmo990]

Something very different has to happen

Aylesbury, possibly.

[Seika]

Aylesbury being used as this place of doom and gloom by Nasu always weirds me out. It's very close by, just one county over to the East; I've visited a couple of times, and it's as sleepy as you can get. The most famous thing about it around here is its breed of duck, and that only counts as in any way notable because river-dwelling country people like myself tend to learn a lot about our ducks.

[Mcjon01]

Perhaps the ducks are key to the whole shebang.

[Tobias]

ducks are delicious. anyplace known mostly for its ducks cant be all bad.

More likely, its the ducks that have kept the world safe up until this point and its some catastrophe that clears the ducks out, that sets in motion the end times.

[Seika]

Perhaps the ducks are key to the whole shebang.

Unless White Wing actually turns into a white duck, I doubt it.

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Haha, there's actually a wiki page on Aylesbury ducks.

How farming-centric. Noooo, today the breed is only being raised by one person! Except all of them that have buggered off into the wild and are now merrily floating around our waterways.

[Mcjon01]

Now that you bring it up I wonder if the Aylesbury Ducks actually are where Nasu got the idea for the "White Wing".

[aldeayeah]

let's throw some speculation into this

The Aylesbury Ritual could be that one same idea that according to Arc "someone had already tried a long time ago" and that Dust of Osiris was trying to pull off: a Reality Marble-Outer World permanent switcheroo (effectively rewriting the rules of the world).

If that were the case, what Reality Marble was intended to be switched (i.e., what did the involved DAAs want), and what ended up being switched (i.e., why did the world die)?

[I3uster]

If the end goal is the revival of the Dark Six and making vampires the top of the food chain...

Idk, a Gaia that sees humans as aberrations and it ended up killing the planet's energy instead? Eternal night that fucked up the ecosystem?

[aldeayeah]

my current nonserious pet theory is that Sacchin barged into the ritual at some point, resulting in a planet-wide Depletion Garden

my more serious theory is that the world was overwritten by some sort of dead moon world Crimson Moon thing

[Leftovers]

I want to believe that placing the lynchpin that holds the current World in place over the Other Side of the World in ol' England explains why a small unremarkable village in the countryside is where the ritual takes place. That is to say, that either the dark six will regenerate with the fuckton of mana on the other side, or if we consider the RM/world egg idea, that there will be a switcheroo of modern world and phantasmal world, plunging everyone back into the AoG.

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"someone had already tried a long time ago"

Well, the dark six is 'currently regenerating', so that's one point towards that.

[aldeayeah]

that sounds a lot like Berserk doesn't it?

An attempt to tap into the UNLIMITED POWERRRR in the backside of the world gone awry, that's a simple explanation indeed. Ah, that sounds more like FF6.

[I3uster]

I want to believe that placing the lynchpin that holds the current World in place over the Other Side of the World in ol' England explains why a small unremarkable village in the countryside is where the ritual takes place. That is to say, that either the dark six will regenerate with the fuckton of mana on the other side, or if we consider the RM/world egg idea, that there will be a switcheroo of modern world and phantasmal world, plunging everyone back into the AoG.

I like this a lot. If we consider the reason for the existence of vampires (control mechanism for humans), geographical stuff and the fact that the backside is pretty much full of Gaia's superweapons it can no longer use due to the age of man any fuckery with the backside makes a lot of sense.

That said I'm not 100% that it'll actually be the ol' RM shuffle.

[aldeayeah]

not 100%

speculation

that makes two of us

[I3uster]

its a nicer way of saying "i dont think thats whats happening at all"

[Ratman]

How does the Fourth come into this? I mean, it's pretty obvious at this point that the Fourth deals with the concept of mystery, and it emerging with Merlin is responsible for the Age of Gods ending, and magecraft becoming necessary.

Also, I'm surprised nobody is going with the idea that the humans of Notes are called Liners, then that is the same word used for magecraft users in other works. This pretty much establishes(if you go with the assumption of course), that what's going on in the Notes is humanity becoming completely separate and dependent on Alaya, kind of like a cosmic cancer. Quoting a great man, don't get me started on why A-Rays are caled A-Ray.
But I've always seen it assumed that CCC is between Aylesbury and Notes (mostly because of the Overcount note in CCC), but this doesn't really make sense. It does in the ideological sense: CCC humanity is assholes, which Gil likes, which seems to lead into Notes.

But the mana drain is making it much more difficult to place past a successful Aylesbury, and before Notes, because the problem in CCC is that humanity can't even draw from Alaya anymore. Since CCC doesn't seem to have the Dark Six (there would definitely be a mention of that if it was the case), it seems more like a third failure, in which the ritual is interrupted in such a spectacular way that mana drain occurs but the Dark Six is not reborn.


The Tsuki no Sango future, on the other hand, has people clearly closer to the earth. There's no magic in Tsuki no Sango, either, aside of the moon girl being kind of dreamy. It seems that preserving magic is bad, and losing it is bad too.

What causes the mana drain could be the sixth magic as well, rather than Aylesbury. The problem with that is: the Dark Six is described as Dead Apostle. The Dead Apostles are humans as far as the setting is ideologically concerned, and in this way it could be the sixth magic, which ends the world somehow, at the same time.
This would require the Dark Six to be a fundamentally human (an Alayan) thing. Like all the other true sorcerers are.
Except the Crimson Moon's goons are trying to summon it. This is why I think that they can't be the same.

Also, what exactly is the Crimson Moon at 3000 AD? What happens during this event? Everything suggests that, along of the planar alignment, the lunar Type revives, but Arc's stuff in Kagetsu Tohya suggests that it could happen much sooner, if Arcueid allows it. What does CM coming back mean for humanity, if not the end?
Interestingly, the nature of luna and it's beings is draining.


I'd say most of the eschatology should deal with why does either variant occur, which this thread does have, but if Nasu says that both are "failures", then what is the third option?

[You]

Solomon.

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tsuki no sango has some magecraft left

[peanuts]

tldr (yet) but then I saw this

Quoting a great man, don't get me started on why A-Rays are caled A-Ray.

There's this talk about レイシフト in FGO and I was wondering what the Ray was supposed to be. Then I saw a random level 1 shielder in the support slot list who didn't have the myname username surprisingly, but Rayshift or something.
So maybe there's some connection there with A-rays about light and lenses and future observation and something.

[Dartz]

It does in the ideological sense: CCC humanity is assholes, which Gil likes, which seems to lead into Notes.

I don't think humans ending up with the Land of Steel is what Gil was thinking about. If you can even call them human, since they are a completely different breed of humanity, separated from Gil entirely. Moreover, Notes is a bad end scenario, Liners are definitely losing there.

The Tsuki no Sango future, on the other hand, has people clearly closer to the earth. There's no magic in Tsuki no Sango, either, aside of the moon girl being kind of dreamy. It seems that preserving magic is bad, and losing it is bad too.

What causes the mana drain could be the sixth magic as well, rather than Aylesbury.

Actually, it was a pole shift. And unsurprisingly, in Tsuki no Sango a pole shift was also stated to be the reason the world ended up in that state.

Also, what exactly is the Crimson Moon at 3000 AD?

I don't think that was event signified anything special other than the end for Zepia as a phenomenon. It wasn't Crimson Moon (the person) coming back, just the natural phenomenon of the moon turning red, which happens from time to time.

[Mcjon01]

I thought Rayshift was just technobabble for "initiate time travel plot device" just like Klein Coffin is technobabble for "why would you ever get into something called a Klein Coffin you morons?"