https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Jade...dventure_path)Originally Posted by Saiga
just adapt that to whatever system you're using
or be me and create your world from scratch and have it definitely include a multi-island nation that totally isn't in the vague shape of a katana and have the story be about a man assassinating his way through a corrupt government because he was taught a secret sword style that involves battoujutsu
I say from scratch very lightly
Localizationing stuff
Regardless of the game, setting, or tech level, our wolf GM never fails to include a stealthy, edgy, katana-wielding NPC.
We never bother to learn his name, he's just "ninja dude". We also like to pretend that it's always literally the same guy (which being a GM avatar, he pretty much is). It has become a running joke.
don't quote me on this
Hopefully he's a good GM in other areas. Also... "Wolf GM"? Is that some kind of slang?
It's from a much earlier story Aldeayeah shared
from what I remember of it, didn't he get the nickname because that was a bad issue though? It surprises me you're still playing with him.
We mostly play board games these days.
don't quote me on this
Wolves fall, everyone dies.
He never sleeps. He never dies.
Battle doesn't need a purpose; the battle is its own purpose. You don't ask why a plague spreads or a field burns. Don't ask why I fight.
Also, on the Japan-themed campaign setting, the reason I wanted to do it is because of how many things in 5E can actually be adapted to it fairly easily - like Arcane Tricksters fit pretty well as folklorish Ninja and stuff.
On an unrelated note - does anyone know any good resources for reading on the history and inspiration of D&D classes, or for RPG class design in general? I heard some tidbits here and there, and the detail fascinates me because despite all the RPGs I've played, I hadn't really thought about what actually constitutes a 'class' and how specific/general they should be. I guess it's because D&D has had so many different approaches to it that it's made me start wondering more about it.
There's two aspects to this - the inspiration behind the existing classes, and ideas on what a class based system should be. Any recommended readings on either of these?
> looks at entire RPG bookshelf
Where to start...
Well, an easy place to look for now would be the D&D Beyond Youtube videos that talk about the Xanathar's subclasses they are including. Each one goes into their thinking behind it.
I like their take on things.
He never sleeps. He never dies.
Battle doesn't need a purpose; the battle is its own purpose. You don't ask why a plague spreads or a field burns. Don't ask why I fight.
Huh, cool videos. Thanks for sharing, mAc!
<NEW FIC!> Revolution #9: Somewhere out there, there's a universe in which your mistakes and failures never happened, and all you wished for is true. How hard would you fight to make that real?
[11:20:46 AM] GlowStiks: lucina is supes attractive
[12:40] Lace: lucina is amazing
[12:40] Neir: lucina is pretty much flawless
They make me excited for the subclasses and I'm not even a player.
I like the way they go into the concepts about them. Also it shows me that they think of the concept first and then make mechanics after.
He never sleeps. He never dies.
Battle doesn't need a purpose; the battle is its own purpose. You don't ask why a plague spreads or a field burns. Don't ask why I fight.
Most obviously, an extract from the introduction to the very first D&D book:
These rules are strictly fantasy. Those wargamers who lack imagination, those who don’t care for Burroughs’ Martian adventures where John Carter is groping through black pits, who feel no thrill upon reading Howard’s Conan saga, who do not enjoy the de Camp & Pratt fantasies or Fritz Leiber’s Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser pitting their swords against evil sorceries will not be likely to find DUNGEONS & DRAGONS to their taste. But those whose imaginations know no bounds will find that these rules are the answer to their prayers.
With this last bit of advice we invite you to read on and enjoy a “world” where the fantastic is fact and magic really works!
E. Gary Gygax,
Tactical Studies Rules Editor
Lake Geneva, Wisconsin
1 November 1973
In more detail, Appendix N from the 1e DMG:
Inspirational Reading:
Anderson, Poul. THREE HEARTS AND THREE LIONS; THE HIGH CRUSADE; THE BROKEN SWORD
Bellairs, John. THE FACE IN THE FROST
Brackett, Leigh.
Brown, Fredric.
Burroughs, Edgar Rice. "Pellucidar" Series; Mars Series; Venus Series
Carter, Lin. "World's End'' Series
de Camp, L. Sprague. LEST DARKNESS FALL; FALLIBLE FIEND; et al.
de Camp & Pratt. "Harold Shea" Series; CARNELIAN CUBE
Derleth, August.
Dunsany, Lord.
Farmer, P. J. "The World of the Tiers" Series; et al.
Fox, Gardner. "Kothar" Series; "Kyrik" Series; et al.
Howard, R. E. "Conan" Series
Lanier, Sterling. HIEROS JOURNEY
Leiber, Fritz. "Fafhrd & Gray Mouser" Series; et al.
Lovecraft, H. P.
Merritt, A. CREEP, SHADOW, CREEP; MOON POOL; DWELLERS IN THE MIRAGE; et al.
Moorcock, Michael. STORMBRINGER; STEALER OF SOULS; "Hawkmoon" Series (esp. the first three books)
Norton, Andre.
Offutt, Andrew J., editor SWORDS AGAINST DARKNESS III.
Pratt, Fletcher, BLUE STAR; et al.
Saberhagen, Fred. CHANGELING EARTH; et al.
St. Clair, Margaret. THE SHADOW PEOPLE; SIGN OF THE LABRYS
Tolkien, J. R. R. THE HOBBIT; "Ring Trilogy"
Vance, Jack. THE EYES OF THE OVERWORLD; THE DYING EARTH; et al.
Weinbaum, Stanley.
Wellman, Manly Wade.
Williamson, Jack.
Zelazny, Roger. JACK OF SHADOWS; "Amber" Series; et al
The most immediate influences upon AD&D were probably de Camp & Pratt, REH, Fritz Leiber, Jack Vance, HPL, and A. Merritt; but all of the above authors, as well as many not listed, certainly helped to shape the form of the game. For this reason, and for the hours of reading enjoyment, I heartily recommend the works of these fine authors to you.
For specifics I can comment on, the magic system of the Dying Earth series is always cited as the inspiration for how casting has generally been done in D&D, to the extent that it's traditionally called Vancian magic.
Both Thieves (as they originally were, in reference to particularly Conan characters including Conan himself) and Fighters were strongly influenced by letting you play a lot of these pulp heroes, particularly ones from lower-magic worlds. Where sorcery tended to always be a villainous characteristic, or even where it was totally absent.
Lots of the early D&D products really directly reference this stuff, like I don't think you'd believe. OD&D Supplement 4, Gods, Demi-Gods, and Heroes, outright gave you the rules for running creatures and people from Moorcock and Howard, alongside the usual mythology translations. White Plume Mountain gave rise to Blackrazor, one of the most famous D&D artifacts today, and widely acknowledged to be a total rip-off of Stormsinger, eponymous sword in one of the books cited above. Deities and Demigods notoriously had to be redone without Cthulhu because they were in copyright trouble for including him in the first edition. (This was not an uncommon TSR issue in the early days: Tolkein's estate went after them too, resulting in hobbits to halflings, balrogs to balors, and so forth).
Speaking of Tolkein, the ranger class, while a Drizzt rip-off ever since 3e, was of course an Aragon rip-off in the beginning.
Druids appeared thanks to hippie influence and environment concerns, because Gygax was definitely familiar with both those movements. (Plus, I suspect, the occasionally questionable "historical" influences of Robert Graves' reconstructed paganism and Frasier's Golden Bough).
Wiki has a short article which can elaborate on some other things that I'm not in the know about.
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Rogues/Fighters based off heroes and Wizards being based off villains/plot device characters is something I'd heard of before, in reference to how they ended up with such a huge disparity in power/utility. I also heard about the Dying Earth influence on the magic system.
I've seen a similar list in the 5E DMG, but since I'm not familiar with many of the works listed I wanted more detail on why they pulled out what they did. The Druid example was actually one I was trying to find out about, because I'd learned they had little to do with their namesake (and it's been pointed out that environmentalism is kind of out of place in a medieval world). That's pretty funny.
Part of this inspiration was reading up on Monks, how they were inspired by the Destroyer novels and didn't always have Eastern elements to them. So in general, the D&D classes were designed from emulating/biting off contemporary fiction rather than the myths/history that influenced those characters. That explains how a lot of classes drift really far from the concepts I thought they were based on.
@Mac I saw a couple of those videos (Shadow sorceror for one) but they didn't really specify where a lot of the inspiration came from for these. May look at some of the others.
I'm also really interested in things like the history of the Ranger going from a subclass to a fullclass. I'm guessing the distinction of 'what gets to be a full class' is based more on feedback/popularity or mechanical design than any kind of standard.
I've often wondered whether Gygax was also directly or indirectly influenced by Classical sources on druids performing human sacrifices and acting as an autonomous authority body, at least for the antagonistic Druids.
yet another reiu PC continues their descent into becoming a doujin victim
He never sleeps. He never dies.
Battle doesn't need a purpose; the battle is its own purpose. You don't ask why a plague spreads or a field burns. Don't ask why I fight.
:gun:
Honestly the Movie "Midnight Run" almost sounds like the premise of a fun DND quest.
What a fucking classic.
A lot of movies can feel like D&D games, likes Guardians of the Galaxy.
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I thought I had dodged the responsibility of running a PF campaign IRL by working the weekends but now it seems like it's actually happening.
Since I am out of small-scale ideas and IRL gettogethers happen less often than R20 ones I thought I might as well just rip off Made in Abyss which no one of my players has seen
genius
[04:55] Lianru: i3uster is actuallly quite cute
Nine foot tall spooky domme NPCs, got it.
<NEW FIC!> Revolution #9: Somewhere out there, there's a universe in which your mistakes and failures never happened, and all you wished for is true. How hard would you fight to make that real?
[11:20:46 AM] GlowStiks: lucina is supes attractive
[12:40] Lace: lucina is amazing
[12:40] Neir: lucina is pretty much flawless
dont call grandma spooky she just doesnt want her grandkids to do stupid things
[04:55] Lianru: i3uster is actuallly quite cute
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