Fate/Grand Order Story and Lore (CONTAINS SPOILERS)

[rxrx]

Wonder how they are going to justify destroying a utopia though.

[G-Man]

Their enemies aren't just the Crypters, it's also the ordinary

furries

people

living day to day in their world, having no idea that their existence is based on overwriting another world. Can Chaleda just condemn these people to be nothing more than a what-if?

Except we aren't the ones who are condemning them. It's the pruning phenomena that does that. Ivan even said it. There is no good or bad in that conflict, the nature of the world is to blame.

I mean would you be okay if someone came to your house, say the government has deemed you a waste resource, and is asking you to die so more deserving people can get the resources you were wasting?

Because that‘s what‘s happening to the innocent people living in each of the lostbelt, and the thwme they‘ve been beating into is through the story.

Then they've been doing a shitty job of trying to beat those dead horses. We are told from the get-go that those world's were already doomed, and that they are trying to overwrite our reality to not be doomed. We can't be blamed for self-defense. Nothing personal to the inhabitants of those Lost Belts, but they are unintentionally killing us when they were going to be erased anyway. It's like that ridiculous Secret Wars event in Marvel comics where the separate universes were colliding, but even stupider because these are world's that were already being killed off by something else.

meta

we just erased the first lostbelt from existence

how many innocent lives were there

Except the alien priestess is the one who destroyed the tree (conveniently freeing us from dealing the death blow, much like Moriarty blowing up the corpses back in Shinjuku so we wouldn't dirty our hands), thus dooming in the Lost Belt, and the Pruning phenomena (which we have no control over) is what's doing the erasing. It's like this whole arc is trying way too hard to make us feel bad, but somehow still half-assing it.

I haven't read shit for part 2, I haven't even finished Salem yet.

And the answer is not yes, even if we're being meta about it. Seriously, this is just an extrapolation of the same heroism theme that Nasu brought up with the Emiya family. You're doing "right" by saving people, but can you also still be right in condemning others that have done absolutely nothing to deserve death?

Emiya's thing was always kind of stupid to begin with. It's like it was designed to try and make you feel bad for not being omnipotent when trying to do good, which always struck me as being needlessly edgy for edge's sake. We all know it's impossible to save everyone, so what's the point of revisiting/hammering that issue for seven entire mini-arcs?

Well, the first lostbelt really hammered it down how shitty it was to be alive there. Patxi even encouraged us on in the end when his experience lead him to decide our reality was better.

Considering that there's six more worlds to visit it makes me wonder how many of them are going to try and appeal themselves to the players so that they have second thoughts on it.

Yeah, the sheer crappiness of the 1st Lost Belt only made it harder to care about saving our world at the expense of the place.

Considering worlds that are pruned are usually either too bad or too good, there definitely will be at least one where it‘s a utopia that‘s much better than ours.

I fully expect to finally care once we get to such worlds. It's one thing to try to make me care about a world that is so screwed the universe basically gave up on it, but it's another to say, "Oh, your world has finally earned it's 'Happily Ever After'? You get erased for being too good to be true!" I expect to care then, because the sheer unfairness of such a situation makes me empathize more, but, again, that's the fault of the pruning phenomena, not us. This whole "we are the bad guys" nonsense feels so forced.

I did not reply to the utopia thing tho, just throwing my thought out there lol.

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A world where Greek gods gaveaway free apples for everyone.

Which is weird, given we've had it shown to us time and again that the Greek gods were kind of d*cks, and that the genuinely nice ones are supposed to be "buggy" because gods aren't supposed to "get" humans any more than we can understand them.

[Iceblade44]

While the Greek Gods are dicks, they are still gods. There were reasons why they were worshipped, no matter what Alcides tells you. They both had good tails and bad ones. Artemis for example, very apathetic towards humans, still is in Fate if it wasn't for Orion, but even if she was like that she still rescued Atalanta. In terms of buggy, you could count all the Olympian Gods, they are all like Ishtar is the regards of bipolarness.

[Asunder]

Wonder how they are going to justify destroying a utopia though.

Taking in account nasu tropes, the 'utopia' will be seem superior to the original worldline at first glance, but then it will be revealed that this humanity has lost something vital as a result of their development that will lead to their inevitable defeat.

[Laserman]

I didn't want to, nor did I expect to start a conversation about morality. I just wanted to know what a sentence meant.

[RoydGolden]

Then they've been doing a shitty job of trying to beat those dead horses. We are told from the get-go that those world's were already doomed, and that they are trying to overwrite our reality to not be doomed. We can't be blamed for self-defense. Nothing personal to the inhabitants of those Lost Belts, but they are unintentionally killing us when they were going to be erased anyway. It's like that ridiculous Secret Wars event in Marvel comics where the separate universes were colliding, but even stupider because these are world's that were already being killed off by something else.

True. An analogous situation in RL would be if one country's resources were destroyed by a natural disaster, so it tries to pillage resources from another country that needs them to survive.

[Arashi_Leonhart]

Emiya's thing was always kind of stupid to begin with. It's like it was designed to try and make you feel bad for not being omnipotent when trying to do good, which always struck me as being needlessly edgy for edge's sake. We all know it's impossible to save everyone, so what's the point of revisiting/hammering that issue for seven entire mini-arcs?

I dunno, we revisited/hammered that issue for three visual novel arcs and four light novels, clearly there's a market for this?

[castor212]

We (the protag) were not told those worlds are doomed until like later parts of the chapter.

As far as the protag is concerned, its a pretty living horse.

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And if a guy can just go genocide without batting an eye, no matter the circumstances, i feel like theres something wrong with that guy oh wait

[rxrx]

We (the protag) were not told those worlds are doomed until like later parts of the chapter.

As far as the protag is concerned, its a pretty living horse.

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And if a guy can just go genocide without batting an eye, no matter the circumstances, i feel like theres something wrong with that guy oh wait

You have just summarized most of the politicians in the world. Good job.

[Nikiri]

Except the alien priestess is the one who destroyed the tree (conveniently freeing us from dealing the death blow, much like Moriarty blowing up the corpses back in Shinjuku so we wouldn't dirty our hands), thus dooming in the Lost Belt, and the Pruning phenomena (which we have no control over) is what's doing the erasing. It's like this whole arc is trying way too hard to make us feel bad, but somehow still half-assing it.

I believe that us defeating tsar made the priestess to do it (and not only tsar but Crypter and his servant)

if the Lostbelt doesn't have his king, the ruler of the land, then begone

so we did erase the lostbelt, even if indirectly

i mean, we wanted this to happen

[Laserman]

Wait, we didn't destroy the tree?

[Nikiri]

look, it's hard to chop down the tree if we don't summon Bunyan

[G-Man]

Taking in account nasu tropes, the 'utopia' will be seem superior to the original worldline at first glance, but then it will be revealed that this humanity has lost something vital as a result of their development that will lead to their inevitable defeat.

God, I hope not. They are trying to pound us with this whole "we should feel bad about this" nonsense. The least they could do is actually give us a scenario where we should feel bad.

I dunno, we revisited/hammered that issue for three visual novel arcs and four light novels, clearly there's a market for this?

I'm not saying it isn't popular, I'm just saying I am well and truly tired of it. I get not wanting our heroes to be perfect, but this feels more like trying to tear the heroes down just because...

We (the protag) were not told those worlds are doomed until like later parts of the chapter.

As far as the protag is concerned, its a pretty living horse.

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And if a guy can just go genocide without batting an eye, no matter the circumstances, i feel like theres something wrong with that guy oh wait

I see. I was not aware of that fact. I knew about the pruning phenomena because of Extella, but was not aware that the protagonist was uninformed of the details until later (which is a pretty shitty thing to do to him/her on the part of Da Vinci and Sherlock). That changes things. I'm not so heartless as to feel nothing if someone stuck me in a situation with someone else where we are forced to kill each other to survive with no explanation whatsoever.

I'm going to assume that last line was a generalization and not a cheap shot implying I'm a sociopath just because I'm willing to defend my life, my world and my family's lives with lethal force.

I believe that us defeating tsar made the priestess to do it (and not only tsar but Crypter and his servant)

if the Lostbelt doesn't have his king, the ruler of the land, then begone

so we did erase the lostbelt, even if indirectly

i mean, we wanted this to happen

Agreed, which is why it annoyed me. We're supposed to feel bad about this, so force us to be the ones who drop the executioner's metaphorical axe! It feels like the earlier copout I mentioned back in Shinjuku.

Wait, we didn't destroy the tree?

No, in fact it was stated it's impossible for us to destroy the tree, as we simply don't have that kind of power. Then the alien priestess shows up and destroys the tree with a touch that causes it to break down.

[Arashi_Leonhart]

Yeah and what I'm saying is it's been a central theme to Fate for nearly fifteen years, if you want something different you're probably looking in the wrong place.

[castor212]

I'm going to assume that last line was a generalization and not a cheap shot implying I'm a sociopath just because I'm willing to defend my life, my world and my family's lives with lethal force.

Actualky i was just waiting somebody to say Gilgamesh

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(which is a pretty shitty thing to do to him/her on the part of Da Vinci and Sherlock).

I mean they themselves weren sure either about it until midchapter.

Pruning in-universe is a magic theory. Even for those 2 lostbelt is a pretty uncharted and unprecedented territory. Only after getting enough info does Holmes able to explain to Guda.

[G-Man]

Yeah and what I'm saying is it's been a central theme to Fate for nearly fifteen years, if you want something different you're probably looking in the wrong place.

And I'm saying there is nothing wrong with a man dreaming. I get that particular theme is their bread and butter, but I can still dream of Nasu stepping out of that particular comfort zone and doing something a little different like when he started delving more heavily into sci-fi with the Fate/Extra franchise (even if he still kept to a lot of his old themes in that storyline).

Actualky i was just waiting somebody to say Gilgamesh

Then I apologize for my presumption. The timing made me think it might be a personal attack.

Edit: So nobody on Chaldea's side in-game knew for sure until later. Wow. That's an oversight on my part. That actually explains a lot of the disconnect I was feeling between what was being said in-game and what I knew externally.

[Laserman]

Then I apologize for my presumption. The timing made me think it might be a personal attack.

Edit: So nobody on Chaldea's side in-game knew for sure until later. Wow. That's an oversight on my part. That actually explains a lot of the disconnect I was feeling between what was being said in-game and what I knew externally.

Yeah, I'm at part 11 of the summary and it still hasn't come up.

[Lily Emilio]

I saw a theory the other day in twitter and pixiv about Pepe's Lostbelt, alongside the Divine Year calendar theory there is the Huma Era (HE) calendar theory.
In that one, Pepe's date will convert to the year 1900, which is mention in Twice's 2nd entry in the Extra Mats as the year when humanity entered its next grow stage? Can't remember the exact wording right now, sorry. That theory also has in its favor the Moon Cell and how Nasu likes to use Buddhist beliefs and Hindu myhts in the Extra works (looking at you Saver and Kiara)
Dunno, seems interesting to brough it up while we wait to see which theory is right, but those two seems to be the most populars right now

What if it's...Overcount 1999?
And I also saw a theory that it might be related to the kalpa - the cycle of destruction and recreation of the universe in both Buddhism and Hinduism and the arrival of the future Buddha Maitreya to guide humanity.

Still makes me wonder if Kirsch will mention Velber or Sefar. Also I lowkey feel bad for Beryl. Not only is his Lostbelt "fresh" in the apocalypse, he also has to potentially deal with the KoTR.

The redacted words in the trailer seem to spell out "Morgan Le Fay" so...

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I see. I was not aware of that fact. I knew about the pruning phenomena because of Extella, but was not aware that the protagonist was uninformed of the details until later (which is a pretty shitty thing to do to him/her on the part of Da Vinci and Sherlock). That changes things. I'm not so heartless as to feel nothing if someone stuck me in a situation with someone else where we are forced to kill each other to survive with no explanation whatsoever.

I've been telling ppl the whole time that the FGO MCs already grew apart from what you would call a self insert for the players, but ppl didn't care lol.

[Kelp24]

do you think the time paradoxes caused by Singularity deaths will ever be addressed?

[Lily Emilio]

They addressed those already.