Oh , and any sane person can agree that Accelerator was jobbing against Touma like always. Really, Accel has more than enough ways to kill Touma immediately yet he sometimes turns too stupid to effectively use his powers.
Oh , and any sane person can agree that Accelerator was jobbing against Touma like always. Really, Accel has more than enough ways to kill Touma immediately yet he sometimes turns too stupid to effectively use his powers.
But their first encounter was on neutral grounds. Touma actually managed to corner him because he figured out that Accel would probably be weak phiscally due to always using his power in battle.
But a good amount of the time, he fights people who really can't take a punch. I have no holy hell idea where he is getting all these other abilities besides a simple DEM (because a bit of battle experience should not give you precognition of that level). His strategy is plain rational thinking, stupid mages/espers who get caught in his flow, and then he punches bitches.Originally Posted by Keyne
If an opponent isn't squishy (and are you really going to say that Shirou is squishy, Keyne?) and can take a punch, then he. So I think Shirou, who didn't faint or die from shock from Berserker gutting him with that axe-sword (even if you say it was Avalon, we have seen where Avalon has failed to help him and he died anyway from injuries)...I think he can take more than a few punches. So eddyak's estimation is about right, but Touma would have a LOT of punching to do.
apparantly, he actually has a subconcious ability to read magic/esp before its actually used, which is why he can aways get his hand in the way, or something like that
Actually, Altima, Accel had to take a few punches to drop, too. And no, Shirou is not squishy.
Guh...did they really give the guy, who has the ultimate dispel magic (that is supposedly getting stronger) something like Glam Sight?
*facepalm*
Actually, that was just adaptation decay. He didn't use anything so weak as that. He redirected the Earth's rotational force at the building. That's more force than the entire world's nuclear stockpile put together, btw.
He can negate attacks that have lightning speed. He has to have something that aids him with the timing.
Ah, I remember reading about it this morning on tvtropes. Power overwhelming.Actually, that was just adaptation decay. He didn't use anything so weak as that. He redirected the Earth's rotational force at the building. That's more force than the entire world's nuclear stockpile put together, btw.
I still reckon it isn't precog, but rather more like Eye of the Mind. He can tell roughly where the attack's coming from, from their stance, or their weapons, or foreknowledge of their abilities. Notice how he couldn't predict Kanzaki or Acqua's attacks.Guh...did they really give the guy, who has the ultimate dispel magic (that is supposedly getting stronger) something like Glam Sight?
*facepalm*
Even if he'd stuck out a metal rod, the lightning would've still hit that instead. Lightning hits the nearest/highest target.
Not so much power, as the ability to manipulate power. If you stuck hm in a gravityless vaccuum, he'd be powerless. Dead, but powerless.Ah, I remember reading about it this morning on tvtropes. Power overwhelming.
I meant the speed, though he negates Mikoto's bolts as well, and they are directed.Even if he'd stuck out a metal rod, the lightning would've still hit that instead. Lightning hits the nearest/highest target.
Pretty sure he got his hand up before she launched, but I dunno.
I haven't read the first to seventh novels. ;_;
Using simple math (and it probably doesn't work this way honestly) and considering Lancer's Circuit is 900 and that Nasu said Lancer would be able to use Gae Bolg (stabbing) 7 times without refueling Shirou might be able to pull it off twice.A: UBW Shirou does not have reserves "equal" to that of Sabers weakened form. At max, Shirou has 230 units after expanding UBW (and that is based on the quite ridiculous notion that he has access to every shred of Rins prana reserves that is 500 units). Discounting the talk about Rins reserves being even smaller then that, going around here.
Gae Bolg is fucking hax.Next, if we assume that 1200 to 1300 is a general indicator of amount available or at least current full capacity (not a very good indicator, imo)
Black Saber (A++) - approx 4500.
Rin Saber - approx 1500.
Lancer - approx 900.
Archer - approx 1200.
Rider - approx 1200.
Caster - approx 3000 (but, like Rin, also has access to external Prana/sources).
Assassin - approx 300. (LOW for a Servant)
Berserker - approx 1500.
Gilgamesh - approx 1200.
True Assassin - approx 1200.
Cost of using Excalibur is estimated at 700-800.
One light bolt from Caster - 70-200.
Rain of light from Caster - 700-2000.
Tracing cost - 5.
Reinforcement cost - 2.
Shirou UBW (initial) expansion cost - No more than 270.
(Stabbing) Gae Bolg - Can be used 7 times without refueling. Which would make each use no more than around 120, although it's likely that the cost is less than this. I'm kind of curious what a full Lancer could have down if he was summoned in Ireland and had a better supply source.
HF Shirou at least has.B: Shirou does not have Eye of the Mind (True). Archer has it, And it is a strategical ability gained through rigorous training and experience. Things that Shirou does not have (and even if he does, UBW!Shirous personality is completely incompatible with "Archers strategical mindset" and he never uses his "super-planning skills" in his fight against Gil).
Eye of the Mind (True) - Perception/judgment ability gained through training.
B: Calm analysis of battle situation and conclusion of action during a tight spot through "theory of battle". As long as there is a 1% chance of turning the tables on the opponent, can execute a strategy to reel in that chance. (Archer)
Example 1: The reason why Archer was able to adapt well enough to a serious Lancer; using experience from the previous fight and applying it with Eye of the Mind to predict his attacks.
Example 2: The kind of skill that anybody can reach after countless time spent on training. Not so much the skill of a genius, but the skill of the hopelessly average person.
Example 3: Shirou calming himself and digesting all the information gained from Archer's arm in just a few seconds and then applying it.What Touma did: Accelerator has his wings split into 100 separate into mini wings which fuck up all matter to attack him from all directions. Touma grabs one and pulls it. Accelerator trips leaving a small opening in the attack. Goes on to explain that it should still have been impossible to dodge the attack anyway.But meh, supernatural abilities aside, Touma wins. With powers, Shirou has the advantage. IIRC, according to spoilers, Touma could wipe out a mass spam attack by Accelerator by the time of their rematch, so swordspam won't do Shirou much. Attacking with weapons will lead to the same result, Touma should be able to just wipe them out.
TL;DR: We don't know what the fuck happened. Most likely IB extended to the rest of the body. Precognition thing happened just before when Accelerator launched a tsunami of Earth at Touma.
He puts his hand out as a lightning rod and the electricity goes right to it. And I'm pretty sure that Touma can't catch the Railgun (from what I remember he only does that in well, the Railgun side story). But wait for giorono or CanonRap on that one.He can negate attacks that have lightning speed. He has to have something that aids him with the timing.
Last edited by Cruor; March 20th, 2011 at 11:43 AM.
The Hall of Selected Cruor Praise
Actually Touma did catch the Railgun the same manner as the lightning bolts. Animesuki has at least 5 pages of worth discussion why the heck could IB negate that.
The general conclusion: It can and get over it
There's no freakin' way it can stop the momentum even if it negates the electricity but it does. The author did not do the research correctly. It's excusable though as he was a highschooler back then.
As for Touma vs Accel #2:
The point of Darkwing Accel's wings that they cannot be negated entirely by Touma. He could only redirect them. The novel didn't depict how the heck he did it but I have an idea. He just pushed one of the antimatter wings away and let that collide with the rest in a domino fashion.
I was more impressed with Touma surviving the avalanche Accel generated. I guess he saw an opening and found the safest spot by dumb luck/ Mind's Eye.
But really. All Accelerator had to do just pull out his old plasma trick or deprive Touma of oxigen. Hell, the new Accel could manipulate vectors from range. He just had to reverse the blood flow in Touma's veins. It was a good example of PIS.
The author just wanted to preserve the rock-paper-scissor nature of his three protagonists:
- Touma beats Accel
- Shiage Hazamura beats Touma (a guy without ANY powers)
- Accelerator beats Shiage (and about damn well anyone, actually even Touma if he wouldn't be hindered with PIS)
Touma often possess a Jobber Aura by the way. His fight with Vento was yet another example. Although he partially won due to the AIM field overwhelming the Saint. Hell, he should've been dead against Oriana. I can bring up a number of fights where Touma won out of luck, special conditions, abusing CIS and the opponent being dumbed down with PIS. To such extend that I can barely name any fights he won fair and square.
Vento isn't a Saint, is she?
Except Lessar clearly states that he twists the wing to make Accelerator lose his footing causing a small opening in the attack that came from all directions. She goes on to say that even if the opening exists it is impossible to make use of.The point of Darkwing Accel's wings that they cannot be negated entirely by Touma. He could only redirect them. The novel didn't depict how the heck he did it but I have an idea. He just pushed one of the antimatter wings away and let that collide with the rest in a domino fashion.
Uhh... While Shiage was winning early on in their fight Touma still won.The author just wanted to preserve the rock-paper-scissor nature of his three protagonists:
- Touma beats Accel
- Shiage Hazamura beats Touma (a guy without ANY powers)
- Accelerator beats Shiage (and about damn well anyone, actually even Touma if he wouldn't be hindered with PIS)
The Hall of Selected Cruor Praise
Yes, and when Shirou traces an NP, he becomes the "owner" of that NP....
Well, by the same logic there isn't anything but generic nameless swords in UBW....
I mean, we never saw Caliburn in there either, so does that mean that Fate Shirou wouldn't have it there?
Yes, he did. He used Excalibur to destroy the Grail. Even if you're claiming it wasn't the "real" Excalibur (only a degraded Excalibur-like sword), he still used the NP power of it, which shouldn't be any more possible with a "copy" than with the real thing, by your logic.Shirou never used an ability of a NP besides Avalon. Overedge and NLBW were techniques. Rho Aias is excluded.
And, the fact that he can do that is what makes Shirou's ability so amazing. If all he could do was trace a sword, but he couldn't use it, then UBW wouldn't be all that wonderful, because all he'd have is a bunch of swords to spam. The fact that they're perfect replicas of Noble Phantasms wouldn't matter because he couldn't use them as such.
Oh, and what about Nine Lives? That's a Noble Phantasm (and, yes, it is, it's listed as one), and he used that.
He's seen it, and given that he can trace shields, it's absurd to claim that a spear is beyond him. It might be a bit more expensive, but there's no way he can't trace it.
How else did he produce a bright white light and then destroy the Grail?Also, Shirou would be seriously godly if he pulled off an Excaliblast with that imperfect copy when his body was literally dead, his mind inches from flickering away and his mana reserves far below critical.
A normal sword-slash isn't going to work....
Doesn't matter, it's still an Excaliblast, and the fact that he can do that means that he could theoretically do a more powerful one (if he had the prana, and doing so wouldn't just kill him).
Again, Archer's expertise isn't important, because Keyne is arguing that there is a fundamental limitation on what Shirou can do (that being that he can't activate NPs he's traced), and if that is true than Archer would no more be able to get past that limitation than Shirou.I think Shirou could use stabby Gae Bolg. He pulled off NLBW and K&B Overedge; though those might not count, since he was using Archer's full training and expertise.
It's adjustable, yes, but only to a certain extent. I don't think she can do mini-Excaliblasts, unless she simply lacks the prana to do a full one.
It's pretty hard to beat someone up when you're tied to a chair....But Rin tied to that chair couldn't. *laughs maniacally*
Vento Of The Front vs Dark Sakura
Divine Punishment puts Sakura into a coma. Vento turns her into a red puddle.
Darkwing Duck vs. Rin
Duck Tales WOO HOO vs. This Illusion.
Hope Rides With His Godly Ronin/Cowboy Brother In Law
AM protects her even when she's unconscious. To a better degree even.
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