I see. Thanks, eddyak!
Basically, I'm wondering if Rhongomyniad wouldn't have some kind of conceptual advantage against Ivan.
I see. Thanks, eddyak!
Basically, I'm wondering if Rhongomyniad wouldn't have some kind of conceptual advantage against Ivan.
Probably not, it's sort of the thing keeping the fae and the gods and dragons and so on from leaking back into our world.
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doesnt that mean that she was a Prime One all along?Originally Posted by Mizukume
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the Beast, 4D version, i mean
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also, in myth, Greek gods do have "true forms". given what Atalante said, cant she have meant those instead of the Prime Ones, since those 2 are probably different things?
also, is there any statement saying any Prime One is above a divine spirit, just because they are prime ones?
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also, didnt you say that Musashi's NP severs destiny? is his lightning buff so broken that it can negate that level of hax?
did she keep the Muramasa sword btw?
actually, if you go by what Caenis said, Zeus is probably around Prime One level
I see a lot of confusion here.
So what mizu means by Prime One is actually what are called Kamigami in Extella.
Humans are the current Prime Ones. Kamigami were the previous Prime Ones.
As an aside Prime One is actually a pun, because in japanese the characters for it are the characters for Primate, which humans are.
Divine spirits are the shadows of these Kamigami, former Prime Ones.
In Extella, Nero, using Photon Ray and some other stuff hacks into the level of reality these Kamigami are now on and obtains the power of Venus, or rather the Goddess of Love. And fights the Ark of the Stars.
Without a doubt Kamigami > Divine Spirits.
Avicebron noted that Ivan was on the level of the previous Prime Ones.
Regression is the ability of certain things to perform mysteries dating back to Age of Gods. Princess Arc is someone with regression.
It's full name is Regression to the Age of Gods.
Basically the Tiamat you fought was not a Kamigami until she regressed back to that state. That's why it's called regression.
On the topic of Greek Gods true forms. It might be possible they too are able to regress back to their Kamigami models temporarily.
Murasama's sword that cuts fate was never used by Musashi.
Musashi has the Heavenly Eyes. This has to do with her ability and how she reached Rei.
As you can see her natural ability which is exemplified by her NP, is sever all destinies other than the result she wantsHeavenly Eye is regarded as “the power to accomplish an objective”.
Once she has decided to do something, she will devote her body and soul to its fulfillment and achieve it without fail. You might say that this is something that she places her entire existence on her gaze and projects it onto her objective.
In Musashi’s case, her Heavenly Eye is pointed only at the deed of “cutting a certain place”.
For example, once she has decided to “cut the opponent’s right arm”, she will server said right arm by taking all and every measures.
As a result, her attack becomes the optimal answer for a slash - “a sword stroke without anything pointless, which makes even time and space yield”.
A power to take all the “measures for the sake of achieving an objective” and “narrowing them down to one”.
You might as well say that this is an extremely unique set of mystic eyes, which confines the naturally infinite futures into “just a single” result.
Like Lamda-delta from Umineko
Last edited by You; June 12th, 2018 at 07:27 PM.
Though abandoned, forgotten, and scorned as out-of-date dolls, they continue to carry out their mission, unchanged from the time they were designed.
Machines do not lose their worth when a newer model appears.
Their worth (life) ends when humans can no longer bear that purity.
ok, so her Np doest cut through Fate and is just a sword beam?
did Mizu lie to me?
Hmm... so, given that it's a type of Destiny/Fate/whatever-altering attack, like Gae Bolg, wouldn't that mean you might be able to defeat it with LCK too?
As per the quote above you can see it does indeed cut through destiny
Though abandoned, forgotten, and scorned as out-of-date dolls, they continue to carry out their mission, unchanged from the time they were designed.
Machines do not lose their worth when a newer model appears.
Their worth (life) ends when humans can no longer bear that purity.
She was given a fate cutting sword by Muramasa. But if anything the only thing I remember hearing that sword doing was being able to kill the zombie/Servant's that was in EoR3
"Only in my company, will you not be a monster"
anywhere than here
it's equal and opposite to tsubame geashi so probably not
it's the fact that Gae Bolg is a curse that you can escape it with luck
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p sure the sword murasama gave her cut through the supernatural, not fate.
Because Murasama's goal is to forge a sword that cuts through fate. And the sword he gave her was explicitly not a sword that could do that.
So yeah.
Though abandoned, forgotten, and scorned as out-of-date dolls, they continue to carry out their mission, unchanged from the time they were designed.
Machines do not lose their worth when a newer model appears.
Their worth (life) ends when humans can no longer bear that purity.
Maybe it's something in the new mats, but that's not how OG F/SN described Gae Bolg. Specifically:
It really is.
An evil thorn that breaks through all defenses.
A lance that pierces the heart every time it's used, a weapon that determines your fate just by its use.
How can anyone block such a ridiculous attack?
However the enemy tries to dodge it, the lance will pierce their heart without fail.
----That's why this move is fatal.
A cursed lance that always pierces the opponent with one thrust.
Either she had incredible luck or enough divine protection to nullify the curse of the lance.
Either way, she avoided a fatal blow and sullied the lance's name.
Localizationing stuff
Oh. Didn't know Divine Protection also works. But wait if that was the case then why did Jeanne still get stomped by Cu in Extella. By how he described it it seemed he used the lance on her
"Only in my company, will you not be a monster"
anywhere than here
This description mentions both fate and the fact that the lance is cursed. Inconclusive, your Honor.It really is.
An evil thorn that breaks through all defenses.
A lance that pierces the heart every time it's used, a weapon that determines your fate just by its use.
How can anyone block such a ridiculous attack?
However the enemy tries to dodge it, the lance will pierce their heart without fail.
----That's why this move is fatal.
A cursed lance that always pierces the opponent with one thrust.
Either she had incredible luck or enough divine protection to nullify the curse of the lance.
Either way, she avoided a fatal blow and sullied the lance's name.
EDIT: Are there any other curses that are explicitly LCK-based/LCK-avoided? That would tip the scales quite handily, imo.
Last edited by Deathhappens; June 12th, 2018 at 10:50 PM.
Can't think of any examples offhand, but Le Morte Espoir's description distinguishes "resistance to curses" from "the ability to defy fate", so presumably those are two separate things.
No one's doubting that. The debate is whether the reason LCK is needed to dodge Gae Bolg is because it's a Destiny Interference Phantasm (aka screws with probability and such) or because it's a cursed item.
IMO, the "Cursed" part only refers to the fact that wounds it causes can't be healed, since we know that's an innate ability of the spear even when Scathach holds it, while the causality overwriting effect is Cu's own technique.
But I could be wrong. It's happened before. Rarely.
Due to the way curses work in Type Moon, the only way to dispel them is to overturn destiny, which is what the LCK stat represents. Mysteriously, the only place this is explained is in a commented out author’s note in the Mahoyo script files.
Its specifically said that LCK can negate the curse
It has to do with how curses work to begin with in Nasuverse.In order to evade Gae Bolg, one would require Noble Phantasms that automatically resurrected the target after death like that of Berserker's, or a high degree of Luck sufficient to negate the curse of the spear.
I haz a patreon please support onegai:
clickable fancy banner link
Currently (like, actually) finishing Apocrypha 3
No, as in, curses are a case of fate. The curse alters destiny, but you can luck out of curses.
Musashi isn't cursing anything.
aaaaa sniped
Localizationing stuff
Wait wait wait. Isn't even relatively simple stuff like Gandr referred to as a disease curse? You mean magic resistance plays no factor in resisting that?
Or is this a case of different characters being used?
EDIT:
Had to run'em through Google TL, but it does appear they both just use "noroi". What gives, then?Gandr:
ガンド 【魔術】
北欧に伝わる呪い。
呪いたい相手を人差し指で指す事により、体調を崩れさせるというもの。
対象を視界に納めて狙うため、ガンド撃ち.とも呼ばれる。
人を指差すのは失礼だ、というのはこの呪いに由来する。とか。
強力なものを“フィンの一撃"と呼び、こちらは直接的なダメージを与える。
凛のガンドはもはや暴力なので、フィンの一撃レベ ルのもの。つーかフィンのガトリング。
Gay Bulge:
ゲイˇボルク使用者：ランサー
ランサーが使用する魔槍。禍々しいデザインになっており、呪いを内包している。敵の心臓を確 実に貫くこと も、一投で数十人を殲滅することもできる。
伝説では、ケルト神話に登場する半神クーˇフーリンが持つ魔槍。投擲用だがとても巨大で、力 強く鍛えられ たクーˇフーリン以外には扱えない武器だった。一説には威力を増すために足を使って投げていた と言われてい て、その投擲法の名前が“ゲイˇボルク”であるとも言われている。
また、投げると無数の矢じりを撒き散らし、一撃で多くの敵を倒したと言われている。ここから “ga bool'ga（ぎざぎざの投擲武器）”という、稲妻を示した名前が付けられたとされる。
Last edited by Deathhappens; June 12th, 2018 at 11:41 PM.
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