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Thread: Could Sola-Ui have loved/fallen in love with Kayneth if the dude was less of an asshole from the start?

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    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors
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    Could Sola-Ui have loved/fallen in love with Kayneth if the dude was less of an asshole from the start?

    Hey guys, I just was struck by a random question. If Kayneth had displayed more open affection towards Sola-Ui before or during Zero, and had he put her above his career and standing as a magus, like he did till the very end, could their marital/relationship problems have been avoided? I know I could ask this on one of the larger threads, but based on how much discussion other random question threads have generated in the past month, I felt it would be okay to make a separate thread.​

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    吸血鬼 Vampire Bugs's Avatar
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    I thought it was already established your hatred for Kayneth is an irrational gut-reaction based on emotions.
    Like, mages don't marry for love, dude. And Kayneth cared about Sola more than would be expected from a snobby aristocrat.
    Maybe, in fact, it's Sola who was a bitch from the beginning.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bugs View Post
    I thought it was already established your hatred for Kayneth is an irrational gut-reaction based on emotions.
    Like, mages don't marry for love, dude. And Kayneth cared about Sola more than would be expected from a snobby aristocrat.
    Maybe, in fact, it's Sola who was a bitch from the beginning.
    This isn't about my hatred for Kayneth. This is actually just curiosity based on his own last musings. While I admit Sola was definitely a bitch from the beginning, I was just wondering if they would have at least been friendly if Kayneth had tried a little harder to treat her with some respect. That's all.

    You seem determined to misunderstand me, in any case. I stated I KNOW that he cared, but he prioritized his standing, something he himself reflected on as he died. Also, I know mages don't marry for love, but they could make the best out of this arrangement and be cordial.
    Last edited by SirGauoftheSquareTable; September 12th, 2018 at 12:50 AM.

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    I'd say that Kayneth did try to make the best of it.

    I mean he actually liked the girl.

    Sola's just a bith.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Menwearpink View Post
    I'd say that Kayneth did try to make the best of it.

    I mean he actually liked the girl.

    Sola's just a bith.
    I think he could have done a little better. If I remember right, part of Sola's beef was that she felt she wasn't being respected as a magus in her own right and she was forced to abandon her work and become a bargaining chip for her family. However, I could be wrong. Besides, most of their interactions was him bragging about his awesomeness to her towards the beginning, before the love spot wreaked its havok.

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    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six forumghost's Avatar
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    Kayneth was a asshole, but he genuinely cared about Sola, and it showed in his behavior.

    Sola's problem is that she's a) A bitch and b) never experienced much emotion at all before her exposure to Deermud's magic mole, which caused her to go crazy for the feeling (which is not something KFC can exactly do much about)

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    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    Kayneth was a asshole, but he genuinely cared about Sola, and it showed in his behavior.

    Sola's problem is that she's a) A bitch and b) never experienced much emotion at all before her exposure to Deermud's magic mole, which caused her to go crazy for the feeling (which is not something KFC can exactly do much about)
    Oh, I wasn't aware about the not-much emotion at all thing. Is this in the LN? I gotta read that then, or is it in the character materials? In any case, I just assumed she was raised as a typical magus, but after some undefined power struggle or something involving Bram going missing, the Sophia-Ri married her off to Kayneth without her consent, so she was super bitter. I will agree that she turned out to be just as much an idiot as KayFry, even if she tried to play the logical one at the beginning. That, and she is kind of a bitch. I just thought maybe if Kayfry ate the humble pie a bit earlier and Sola was less of a frosty bitch, maybe the love spot wouldn't have been as much of a problem.

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    Across This New Borderline RoydGolden's Avatar
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    I think it's too easy to blame the situation on just Sola being a bitch.

    She was stuck in an arranged marriage with a guy she didn't love, after all. Sure you could say it was her fault for not giving him a chance or whatever, but love isn't something that can be forced. Obviously she shouldn't have gone full yandere, but it was an understandable decision of someone in her circumstances to make IMO. Just a crappy situation all-around, made even more tragic by the fact Kayneth did genuinely love her in his own way.

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    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six forumghost's Avatar
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    It's a thing from Zero Materials:

    Sola-Ui, on the other hand, was no longer of any use to her family, and her very existence was disavowed. She became a mere tool to be given away in a political marriage, where her excellent physical capacity for sorcery and childhood training would allow her to serve as an assistant for some first-rate magus.
    However, Sola-Ui did not harbor any resentment toward this treatment. To be perfectly frank, she didn't even understand what "likes" and "dislikes" were in the first place. While it's certainly true that she always selfishly toyed with those around her, that was simply because it was ingrained in her from a very young age that acting in a way that would preserve her value as a noble was the secret to success in life. Sola-Ui herself had never truly wanted or hoped for something even once since being born.
    Consequently, she didn't care one bit whether the attraction caused by Diarmuid's mystic face was real love or not. For her, the simple sensation of passion boiling up from the depths of her heart was her greatest treasure, and she had she had no intention of giving it up after she had finally obtained it. Because, passion is the very thing that gives life value.
    So yeah, she was a bitch that never knew passion until she saw Lancer's curse spot, which caused her to feel feelings for the first time snd go cray-cray for it.

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    Drunk Anime Is The True Path. Mattias's Avatar
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    I don't know if I'd go so far as to call pre-Deermud Sola a bitch, she acted as someone who was sold into a political marriage probably would, cold and uncaring to the stranger she was told she'd be marrying.
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    It's Magikewl~ Magikewl's Avatar
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    I guess Sola is an evil whore bitch for acting frumpy after being molded from birth to be My Future Husbandís Little Helper

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    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    It's a thing from Zero Materials:



    So yeah, she was a bitch that never knew passion until she saw Lancer's curse spot, which caused her to feel feelings for the first time snd go cray-cray for it.
    That honestly reminds me of the description of the protag of Yandere Simulator. That doesn't reflect well on Sola at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magikewl View Post
    I guess Sola is a evil whore bitch for acting frumpy after being molded from birth to be My Future Husband’s Little Helper
    Well if you put it that way...

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    Across This New Borderline RoydGolden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    It's a thing from Zero Materials:
    Yeah, that part you quoted perfectly encapsulates the tragedy of Sola's predicament.

    It's easy to see from afar that Sola's actions were wrong, but it's perfectly natural for someone in her situation to cling to the first strong emotion she's felt in basically her entire life. And the fact that Kayneth apparently didn't notice or care that his wife of several years had no emotions or desires to speak of, even if he did supposedly "love" her, says very little of his merit as a husband.

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    分かろうとするな、感じれ Mcjon01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magikewl View Post
    I guess Sola is a evil whore bitch for acting frumpy after being molded from birth to be My Future Husband’s Little Helper
    She was raised as the emergency next heir just in case then switched to the broodmare course halfway through, but also didn’t care because she’s a hollow person and if you think any of these characters are just surface level broken you don’t know Urobuchi

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    Quote Originally Posted by RoydGolden View Post
    Yeah, that part you quoted perfectly encapsulates the tragedy of Sola's predicament.

    It's easy to see that Sola's actions were wrong, but it's perfectly natural for someone in her situation to cling to the first strong emotion she's felt in basically her entire life. And the fact that Kayneth apparently didn't notice or care that his wife of several years had no emotions or desires to speak of, even if he did supposedly "love" her, says very little of his merit as a husband.
    They were engaged, not quite yet married, and I think it's implied/stated that prior to their engagement they were total strangers. Also, love doesn't prevent Kayneth from being as emotionally tone-deaf as he was.

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    分かろうとするな、感じれ Mcjon01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoydGolden View Post
    Yeah, that part you quoted perfectly encapsulates the tragedy of Sola's predicament.

    It's easy to see from afar that Sola's actions were wrong, but it's perfectly natural for someone in her situation to cling to the first strong emotion she's felt in basically her entire life. And the fact that Kayneth apparently didn't notice or care that his wife of several years had no emotions or desires to speak of, even if he did supposedly "love" her, says very little of his merit as a husband.
    Nobody noticed Kotomine was a fucking psychopath either, that’s just how these things work in anime.

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    Across This New Borderline RoydGolden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirGauoftheSquareTable View Post
    Also, love doesn't prevent Kayneth from being as emotionally tone-deaf as he was.
    Clearly not. Let's just say I imagine Kayneth as the "wham bam thank you m'am" kind of person.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mcjon01 View Post
    She was raised as the emergency next heir just in case then switched to the broodmare course halfway through, but also didn’t care because she’s a hollow person and if you think any of these characters are just surface level broken you don’t know Urobuchi
    Oh yeah, I didn't think of that.

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    Across This New Borderline RoydGolden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mcjon01 View Post
    Nobody noticed Kotomine was a fucking psychopath either, that’s just how these things work in anime.
    He at least tried to conceal it. Did it say anywhere in the novel that Sola acted like she had normal emotions around Kayneth before finally snapping?

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    Quote Originally Posted by RoydGolden View Post
    Clearly not. Let's just say I imagine Kayneth as the "wham bam thank you m'am" kind of person.
    That, and his expressions of love were basically a little boy showing off his train set because it's so cool. Also, do we know whether Sola was at first unwillingly ensnared by the Love Spot, or did she purposely fall under the enchantment?

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    Quote Originally Posted by RoydGolden View Post
    He at least tried to conceal it. Did it say anywhere in the novel that Sola acted like she had normal emotions around Kayneth before finally snapping?
    Considering her actions aren't too out of place in the magus community, why would anyone inquire? Also, Kirei wasn't 100% aware/was in denial until Gil forced him to acknowledge it.

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