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Thread: Unpopular TM opinions you have

  1. #5961
    Quote Originally Posted by eddyak View Post
    Yep, that was definitely him stealing the show like he tends to do- it was his chance to show off his path of kingship... and then he later gets spanked by both of the other kings.
    Again, I'm not arguing about an objective assessment of the contents of their arguments, the events of the War, what Alexander's point was or whether Saber's mind was actually changed.

  2. #5962
    not really feeling it tbh Ratman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walnut Sparks View Post
    When a show has one person keep on driving the argument while the other struggles to answer and is near tears,
    That's just, like, your impression, man. Saber doesn't have enough time to actually say anything but one line of dialogue before RM happens. But then the entire aftermath gets handwaved to make Iskandar look cool, too. We don't see exactly how people go their separate ways either.

    - - - Updated - - -

    What I get is mostly Saber being briefly at a loss because it never occurred to her through her life of actually getting shit done, with no time to get educated in matters of philosophy unlike Rider, that ruling is not necessarily a top-down or bottom-up matter, and royal majestate is a social and political issue more intricate than she thought it to be.

  3. #5963
    Not enough time? There's a solid stretch of more than two minutes where she just stands there with her eyes wobbling while he talks down to her before Hassan shows up.

  4. #5964
    not really feeling it tbh Ratman's Avatar
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    That's not really enough time to construct an argument against someone you percieve as refuting your entire way of existence, especially if you have never clashed ideologies with someone before. Saber's statements amount to 'this is what I do' because the way she is summoned in Zero, she doesn't actually know anything else. That's not a character flaw, that's a character trait, maybe a tragic one.

    The thing is that 'the king isn't human' is something she took for all her life as an objective fact, when in fact it is just something Merlin told her in order to sculpt her into what she is: an embodiment of virtue, who would be worthy enough to wield the materialization of virtue that Caliburn is. The concept of personal perfection doesn't really work with the concept of personal choice, and so Merlin figured he'd bring her up so that her ideas of free will are limited.

    All three kings are failures, but summoned as heroic spirits they aren't going to be anything other than what they are anymore. What truly sets Saber apart from the other two is that she chooses to lament her failures with the sense of self she finds in Zero. She is not complete as heroic spirit, she is not at peace with herself. Notice how she doesn't argue with Kiritsugu at first, but after the banquet and the whole bit with Lancer, she starts getting a lot more argumentative, realizing it's something people can do. It's her journey to find herself, which leaves her at the lowest point, where we find her at the start of FSN.

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