Common TM Fanon and Misconceptions

[fumei]

The World is a RM

I see this one so much, and based on the last time it came up elsewhere, it seems like part of the reason people think this is apparently due to Ea's description of "showing the truth of the world" and I guess coupled with the fact that it's anti-world and how it destroys IH = Ea crushes reality marbles and thus the world is an RM. Idk, it's just such a stretch, but it's so widespread at this point.

- Similarly, "Gilgamesh throws galaxies" from CCC (I guess just based on the art?)
- KH can give out concepts of death willy-nilly because he gave Tiamat one (probably stems from people not reading the chapter, and then also not getting fed the information that came from interviews/mats later on so they think it's just an inherent ability he has).
- That anyone who was ever in a leadership position automatically fits as Ruler.
- One I've seen from certain discord servers is that people genuinely believe that Shirou becomes Archer after UBW. Like, believing this despite having read the side material and WoG that says otherwise, which leads into the next one...
- It's not really a misconception or fanon per se, but people have this idiotic mindset that interviews and side materials directly from Nasu can't be trusted because "Nasu always contradicts himself anyway". This one actually kills me inside.

[SpoonyViking]

I don't know how widespread it is, but I've seen it stated that all attempts of trying to extend one's lifespan (as opposed to Roa's reincarnation method) irrevocably lead to the person becoming a Dead Apostle of some sort. I remember the Zero anime being cited as an example.

[Laserman]

mana is magical energy from the world.

prana is a general term for magical energy.

od is magical energy inside humans.

And I still need confirmation from a knowledgeable BL user since they knew everything from the get go.

I mixed those terms up the first time I encountered them. -.-

All that is right. Except the use of prana like that isn't official. It's a fan made term so it could be easier for translation

Okay, I wondering about the difference.

What?

[SpoonyViking]

"Prana" is, if I understand it correctly, basically life energy, only it's produced by and permeates everything, not only living beings (or is Hinduism an animistic religion? Sorry, I don't really know). It's often been associated with tantric sexual practices.

[hayate]

Right...

You should give this to Nasu instead for research purposes.

So that in the Tsukihime re - release, it won't be as awkward as any other VN of the 2000's.

[fumei]

Grand Gil is another one I guess. Since "grand casters have high level clairvoyance" obviously includes Gil, even though he's not even a proper Caster and he said himself he's not a Grand.And not that widespread but I feel like in VS scenarios people gravely overestimate the buff Nobu gets against mystery/divine, equating it to an automatic win against anyone with divinity or lots of mystery (like Solomon and Gil).

[pinetree]

"A Grand is the greatest Heroic Spirit of their age, so there's only two Grand candidates of each class. For Grand Caster, Merlin is the one for the age of man and Solomon for the age of Gods."

That one was pretty common on reddit a while ago, I don't see anyone else talking about it nowadays though, so maybe it was debunked.

[Spartacus]

I feel like in VS scenarios people gravely overestimate the buff Nobu gets against mystery/divine, equating it to an automatic win against anyone with divinity or lots of mystery (like Solomon and Gil).

How much feats that Nobu anti-Mystery abilities have shown exactly?

[Winter]

If I'm not mistaken, the common fact that Ilya dies 1 year following the Fate route ending is somewhat of a misconception, no?

Not only does the last Taiga Dojo never confirm this, but neither does supplementary material (interviews with Nasu, character mats, the old Fuyuki archive website which is somewhat dubious) as far as I can find at least.

It's known via Zouken's dialogue in Heaven's Feel that she only has a lifespan of up to one more year, but isn't it also hinted that she had a way around this?

Not to mention that from all the research I've done I've only been able to trace these facts to the old rumours and misconceptions of Archer's past that connect him with her (that he's Fate route Shirou and she died in his timeline, or even that he's from the Ilya route of all things) and since then most of these have been debunked. Doesn't this call into question this fact then?

And above all Ilya still directly states in the Taiga Dojo that in the Fate route "He won't become Archer because she'll be by his side."

So I have to wonder why we're still taking this as a canon thing that absolutely will happen? Do we even still take it as something that absolutely will happen? It's a topic that's rarely brought up here considering how old it is, so I'm not sure if it even is still taken as canon or if we have acknowledged that information we have contradicts this. But I definitely do see it thrown around elsewhere like it's canon, and have seriously come to question if it's a misconception due to info we've gotten since then.

I'm definitely open to being wrong, I'm just seriously confused at this point because nothing I've found has pointed to this being a canon fact to the Fate route.

[Mcjon01]

I don't see why she'd live any longer in the route where she was the only Grail around sucking up Servants
(If you recall, this is unhealthy)

[Winter]

Of course it's not healthy, it's one of the reasons she does have such a short lifespan. But that's not confirmation that she didn't survive somehow. The details don't even really matter, honestly. (I mean they sure didn't in the VN) Because nothing still outright states that she dies within that timespan, so why is it considered a canon fact when the VN (and everything else) seemingly doesn't?

[pinetree]

So you think that, because they didn't outright state SHE DIES, that means she found some unknown, unmentioned method to prevent her death, despite us knowing that by all means she should die regularly?

Sounds like you're in denial to me.

[Winter]

That is entirely uncalled for. I said I'm open to being wrong, didn't I?

It doesn't even matter if she dies or not, but the VN still leaves that fact ambiguous. And what I can find on the subject that confirms whether or not she does traces back to misinformation as a source. So I'm questioning whether we've considered a possibility to be canon when it hasn't been stated. That isn't at all important?

[Tobias]

I’m more inclined to think Ilya probably does die. Matter of fact I once really thought that the whole “he won’t become archer cause he will have me!” Was actually a tongue in cheek reference to the fact that he would become archer because he wouldn’t have her. (Found out later this was incorrect on my part of course.)

having said that fan tendency to go from “this and this probably happened” to “this and this definitely happened” is highly problematic and should be fought against wherever possible. Especially since fans in many cases will ignore things directly stated in the VN in order to assume previously established rules were inviolate.

[SirGauoftheSquareTable]

"Prana" is, if I understand it correctly, basically life energy, only it's produced by and permeates everything, not only living beings (or is Hinduism an animistic religion? Sorry, I don't really know). It's often been associated with tantric sexual practices.

Hinduism ISN'T an animistic religion, that I can say, but it's okay.

- - - Updated - - -

Also, the World is a "fabric" stretched over the planet, right?

[Bobin]

Gaia hating humanity and actively conspiring against it as if it were Skynet.

[SirGauoftheSquareTable]

Can Gaia even actively conspire? I don't think so.

[Bobin]

Shirou having no memories of his life prior the fire. That’s a common one.

[SirGauoftheSquareTable]

Shirou having no memories of his life prior the fire. That’s a common one.

Really? Didn't realize that was a misconception. I thought his first memories were of the fire and everyone dying in it.

[Winter]

Shirou denies his memories of his old life after Kiritsugu rescued him, but there are moments in the VN where he does think back to his life before the fire.

I’m more inclined to think Ilya probably does die. Matter of fact I once really thought that the whole “he won’t become archer cause he will have me!” Was actually a tongue in cheek reference to the fact that he would become archer because he wouldn’t have her. (Found out later this was incorrect on my part of course.)

having said that fan tendency to go from “this and this probably happened” to “this and this definitely happened” is highly problematic and should be fought against wherever possible. Especially since fans in many cases will ignore things directly stated in the VN in order to assume previously established rules were inviolate.

Oh certainly the possibility is there, and it can still definitely be read as pretty tongue in cheek, though not in that way regarding Archer that's certainly true, lol.

But that's exactly it! We're free to interpret what happens however we want, because the VN gives us this freedom by keeping things open. But it's still interpretation and assumption that certain events actually will happen, and that's what I've been questioning. (Especially regarding these assumptions linking back to misinformation and rumors, which is why this is relevant.)