roleplaying general discussion

[Mellon]

What, as opposed to "cheap tricks" like fiddling the plot to fit them in...?

You are fiddling with the plot one way or the other.

In actuality, I am relatively liberal as a GM, tbh. I have even GM-ed completely "liberal" impro RPs, the plot of which was completely based on PC action. Ended up in a complete mess (even with 2 GMs), but still kinda fun, I guess.

[Mike1984]

But that's impossible to avoid, because only in real life is there true freedom. You see, the RP cannot function without laws, without somebody to manage all the things that happen. That is why the GM exists, he acts as a mediator, some would say as a God, and they might not be wrong- For a GM is never wholly impartial.

I'd reckon you wouldn't be an impartial GM either Mike.

Well, of course it's not always possible to avoid GM fiddling, but the actions of the players should actually matter. If you think up a clever way to kill the Big Bad in chapter 1, you should be allowed to gain a benefit from it, rather than the GM fiddling it to make sure it fails just because you out-smarted him and thought up an idea he didn't.

[Erlkonig]

True, that's just being a dick.

I would totally do that, btw.

[lantzblades]

Well, of course it's not always possible to avoid GM fiddling, but the actions of the players should actually matter. If you think up a clever way to kill the Big Bad in chapter 1, you should be allowed to gain a benefit from it, rather than the GM fiddling it to make sure it fails just because you out-smarted him and thought up an idea he didn't.

I agree about giving them a benefit for their ingenuity but if that character is the big bad having them survive is fair enough. just have him come back in a proper fashion later.

[Mike1984]

I agree about giving them a benefit for their ingenuity but if that character is the big bad having them survive is fair enough. just have him come back in a proper fashion later.

Well, of course. Having the players kill the Big Bad in chapter 1 would somewhat ruin the game. But, you have to make sure that their actions actually matter, and they are rewarded for doing something clever.

[Mellon]

Well, of course it's not always possible to avoid GM fiddling, but the actions of the players should actually matter. If you think up a clever way to kill the Big Bad in chapter 1, you should be allowed to gain a benefit from it, rather than the GM fiddling it to make sure it fails just because you out-smarted him and thought up an idea he didn't.

So in this case you would like the GM to say - "Yeah, good. Big bad is dead, lets pack our things and the game is over.", right?

You are thinking too blatantly. No GM would make it so obvious. In this case, I would either:

A - Let you wound the boss, bla-bla-bla, later your character is "considered a threat" and is more intimately "drawn" into the plot later on.
B - Let you kill the boss, play it down as he was not the "real enemy" in the first place or have their "second-in-command" take over, etc.

Point is that a good GM will always find a way to make it believable. Sure you can act as you like within the confines of your character. But the real result of your actions is decided by the GM. You do get a benefit, but if you think that you can somehow miraculously "win" the RP before the GM decides it or derail the entire RP plot, then that is pretty out there.

[SeiKeo]

I agree about giving them a benefit for their ingenuity but if that character is the big bad having them survive is fair enough. just have him come back in a proper fashion later.

Huh. If this happened to me, I'd say that the best idea is to just roll with the punch and revise the plan. Does he have a right-hand man? Was he also holding off someone else? Like Mellon said, you work with the PCs's actions.

EDIT: Yep, ninja'd by the man himself, and in a better fashion, too.

[Mike1984]

Huh. If this happened to me, I'd say that the best idea is to just roll with the punch and revise the plan. Does he have a right-hand man? Was he also holding off someone else? Like Mellon said, you work with the PCs's actions.

Well, that is sensible, although I think it's rather unfair to make things worse for them as a result of their actions, because then it becomes a game of "guess what the GM wants us to do here".

[Neir]

I think it's worse to have a GM that does NOTHING except make rulings. For a good game, having an involved GM is kind of vital.

[Mike1984]

I think it's worse to have a GM that does NOTHING except make rulings. For a good game, having an involved GM is kind of vital.

Having a GM who gets involved is good. Having a GM who railroads you into following their plot regardless of what you might do is not. The whole point of an RP is that the GM decides the setting and plays the NPCs, and then the players determine the progression of the story. If all you're doing is acting out the GMs newest story for him, what is the point of having RP players?

[lantzblades]

that's true the rp is a vehicle for entertainment of all sides thus the players ought to have the write to drive the plot's pace if not the exact events.

[Mellon]

Having a GM who gets involved is good. Having a GM who railroads you into following their plot regardless of what you might do is not. The whole point of an RP is that the GM decides the setting and plays the NPCs, and then the players determine the progression of the story. If all you're doing is acting out the GMs newest story for him, what is the point of having RP players?

Because it is fun? Because it brings a degree of human interaction into a story?

What you are saying right now is that any RP with an actual plot (plot not completely 100% controlled by the player action) is better "written as a story"?

You are going to be railroaded anyway. What matters is how much the GM adapts your actions into the plot (which is the choice of the GM). If you think that any even remotely competent GM would let you completely derail the greater plot of the RP, then you are delusional.

The GM is the world and he decides the results of your actions. Sure there will be leeway in your actions, but just like any decent GM wont let you create a character that can stomp everybody (game balance), there will not be "total freedom" in the storyline (but the players can definitely influence it to quite a large degree).

A Web-RP is akin to an interactive story. But it is still a story told by the GM.​