Why would you not be able to seperate morality from likability in fiction? It's fiction for a reason.
Why would you not be able to seperate morality from likability in fiction? It's fiction for a reason.
He's a well-written character but that doesn't make him like-able
Giving me a reason why you like him would be a start perhaps
I haven't read Lolita couldn't tell you, I'll give you an example using Dr. Jekyll instead.
I like Jekyll as a character because for all that you're told of his goodness, he is essentially explored to be a rich drug addict who can't resist his dose, no matter how many times he swears to god or promises to stop. He's very pitiable in the final chapter because it shows that he's self-aware of his problem and that despite wanting the freedom that comes with being Hyde, he's extremely traumatized by how disgusting a human being he becomes as Hyde, yet he still can't stop, he has to have his dose. He's a drug wreck that falls apart at the seams because he has no more self control than the people living in the Victorian streets that the upper classes looked down on at the time of the novel. I like him because he's a tragic wreck.
And yeah no I'm not spoilering that its a 130 year old book deal with it.
Svidrigailov in CaP is a complete piece of shit, but he's aware of that from the start and lives it, all up to the moment it destroys him completely.
He's staying true to himself and his desires despite it being absolutely disgusting and against every moral imaginable, and I guess that's kinda fascinating, in a weird way.
And I haven't read Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde yet so I can't say anything in-context about that. But in general I agree, of course you can like a character who's committed actions you disagree with.
What?Originally Posted by Lace
You don't have to like an antagonist to like how he contributes to a work of fiction.
The same goes for protagonists though it's done seldom.
Aus Feuer ward der Geist geschaffen,
drum schenkt mir süßes Feuer ein!
Die Lust der Lieder und der Waffen,
die Lust der Liebe schenkt mir ein,
der Trauben süßes Sonnenblut,
das Wunder glaubt und Wunder thut!
Started reading Project ITOH's Genocidal Organ and holy shit wow military thriller with references to Orientalism and Baudrillard and Domino's Pizza SIGN ME UP FOR THAT SHIT
doesn't hurt that the translation quality is noticeably better than that of the MGS4 novelisation
cannot wait for the movie to come out
Oh shit its that good? Ill get on that shit.
Sounds literally like Metal Gear but also fun.
Read Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. It was pretty good. For some reason I expected the story to be told in a different manner, though.
Lolita will probably be next. About halfway through Sputnik Sweetheart, and it's a bit better than it was at the start, though it's still nothing great.
If I had one complaint about Genocidal Organ so far, it's that the protagonist at points is almost too much of a self-aware parody of the badass special-forces operator he is. Also, he really likes Domino's Pizza.
So, yeah, it's somewhat like Metal Gear. You can definitely see why ITOH and Kojima were friends.
Well yeah ITOH was literally Kojima's biggest fan of 10 years.
- - - Updated - - -
Anyway if I liked Guns of the Patriots, should I buy Genocidal Organ?
100% yes. It seems like ITOH's writing really jumps up a notch or two when he doesn't have to hew to a pre-existing storyline.
I guess I'll order it when my student pay comes in.
Today's impulse buy at the book markets: Hemingway's The Garden of Eden.
Another impulse buy, but I couldn't resist.
The Complete Short Stories of Franz Kafka.
"Here's a bangin lil' tune about takin' on The Man!"
(Check out my Super Special Awesome Servant Compendium here)
Finished Sputnik Sweetheart. Wasn't much of a fan. It had some good moments and started to get good near the end (the segment with his gf and her kid was great) but overall it just wasn't anything special.
I feel like that's a common theme of Murakami's books. There's some moments of brilliance here and there, but the overarching plot generally drags on a bit too much. I can also understand some of the criticisms of his books feeling 'same-y'. Classical music, pianos, main characters who have shallow/casual sex with random women to fill a void in their life, characters who suddenly disappear, and sudden endings.
I still like him, though. The themes he deals with are pretty relatable.
All right, I finished ITOH's Genocidal Organ.
This is one of those books which isn't so much a story as it is a collection of really interesting ideas strung together. Unless you're more interested in the concepts ITOH is playing around with than watching the character drama unfold, you probably won't get far. It's somewhat comparable to a more subdued MGS - there's even a blink-and-you'll-miss-it Revolver Ocelot cameo on p.207 - but on the whole I found it to be very much its own thing. The character writing, and voices in particular, felt somewhat weak - MC Shepherd (cue Mass Effect jokes) and his Special Forces associates come across as bizarrely inconsistent or unprofessional at points. Compare it to Generation Kill - there you have the Marine Force Recon guys, who are in 'lol' mode just as often as they're in 'sir yes sir' mode. There's a balance there which ITOH doesn't quite replicate. Or maybe it's a translation artifact. Still, there was a fucking hilarious Monty Python reference during the chapters in India. It's honestly pretty easy to see this as a video game, one with around the same cutscene/gameplay ratio as MGS4. Long periods of WORDS WORDS WORDS punctuated by brief periods of incredible violence. There's even a section in Prague! (Sadly no Raging Raven fight.)
One thing that stuck, though: the antagonist's - John Paul's - motivation for going around the Third World causing genocides (not a spoiler, it's on the back) is weirdly boring, and eerily realistic because of that. The ending chapters seem fairly rushed compared to the rest of the book, but they serve to make very clear that John Paul is very nearly the exact opposite of an MGS villain.
The epilogue of this book is really the only thing worth spoilering
Gotta say, I'm going to be very interested in how the anime movie adaptation works out. Not only because it's an incredibly introspective/dialogue-focused book - if you took out all of Shepherd's ruminations, dream sequences and the massive, massive conversations about evolution and the philosophy of language, you'd have about 50-70 pages, tops - but because there are some very graphic scenes involving child soldiers, the kind any live-action producer would take one look at and go NOPE. Still, gotta have faith in manglobe.
Last edited by Dullahan; September 24th, 2015 at 07:39 AM.
So I should buy it?
Oh, yeah. It's good. Maybe wait for the movie/blu-rays to come out if you're really on the fence.
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