Pestilence is the White Rider. Famine is Black.
Pestilence is the White Rider. Famine is Black.
My mistake, fixed.Originally Posted by Zork Knight
Ishii: Holy crap, I'm pretty sure you've just made a Servant Japan will absolutely never touch. Cool idea though. Reminds me a bit of something I thought up once for a Josef Mengele/Angel of Death hybrid...
The horsemen, per Revelations, with my direct translation.
καὶ εἶδον, καὶ ἰδοὺ ἵππος λευκός, καὶ ὁ καθήμενος ἐπ’ αὐτὸν ἔχων τόξον, καὶ ἐδόθη αὐτῷ στέφανος, καὶ ἐξῆλθεν νικῶν καὶ ἵνα νικήσῃ.
And I saw, and - there! - a white horse, and the one riding it held a bow, and he wore a garland, and he went out conquering and for the sake of conquest.
καὶ ἐξῆλθεν ἄλλος ἵππος πυρρός, καὶ τῷ καθημένῳ ἐπ’ αὐτὸν ἐδόθη αὐτῷ λαβεῖν τὴν εἰρήνην ἐκ τῆς γῆς καὶ ἵνα ἀλλήλους σφάξουσιν, καὶ ἐδόθη αὐτῷ μάχαιρα μεγάλη.
And another horse came out, red, and to the one riding it was given the power to overpower the peace in the land - even so that he could turn its people to slaughtering each other - and a great sword was given to him.
καὶ εἶδον, καὶ ἰδοὺ ἵππος μέλας, καὶ ὁ καθήμενος ἐπ’ αὐτὸν ἔχων ζυγὸν ἐν τῇ χειρὶ αὐτοῦ. καὶ ἤκουσα ὡς φωνὴν ἐν μέσῳ τῶν τεσσάρων ζῴων λέγουσαν Χοῖνιξ σίτου δηναρίου, καὶ τρεῖς χοίνικες κριθῶν δηναρίου· καὶ τὸ ἔλαιον καὶ τὸν οἶνον μὴ ἀδικήσῃς.
And I saw, and - there! - a black horse, and the one riding it held a balance in his hand. And I heard a voice among the four living beings saying, "A day's food for a denarius, and three day's barley for a denarius, and do no ill to the oil or the wine!"
καὶ εἶδον, καὶ ἰδοὺ ἵππος χλωρός, καὶ ὁ καθήμενος ἐπάνω αὐτοῦ, ὄνομα αὐτῷ Ὁ Θάνατος, καὶ ὁ Ἅιδης ἠκολούθει μετ’ αὐτοῦ, καὶ ἐδόθη αὐτοῖς ἐξουσία ἐπὶ τὸ τέταρτον τῆς γῆς, ἀποκτεῖναι ἐν ῥομφαίᾳ καὶ ἐν λιμῷ καὶ ἐν θανάτῳ καὶ ὑπὸ τῶν θηρίων τῆς γῆς.
And I saw, and - there! - a pale horse, and the one riding upon it was named "Death", and Haides followed him; and dominance was given to them each over a quarter of the land, to kill by blade and by hunger and by death and by the wild beasts of the land.
Pestilence is notably absent.
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The white horse is generally identified with Pestilence in popular culture, probably because Conquest strikes most people as too similar to War.
Yes, but that is bad.
Also, it's a reasonably ready distinction between πολέμιος and ἐχθρός, or hostis and inimicus. External and internal enemies. The white rider would compel the United States to declare war on Mexico; the red rider would compel the seaboard states to fight the central ones.
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What about Strange Fake’s False Rider? I remember he (it?) being called the Pale Rider sometimes, I think. Sometimes people also refer to it as one of the 4 Horsemen, but I don’t remember if that has any textual support or if it’s just a thing people say.
The pale rider is Death. The white rider is pestilence or conquest depending on the iteration
I have it on good authority that the white rider is Pollution.
Conquest was one of the original Four Horsemen, but at least as far as 1906 in the Jewish Encyclopedia, it is considered Pestilence and in modern culture people are more likely to say Pestilence rather than Conquest being one of the Horsemen, hence why I made another applicable class being a False Rider as Pestilence is in of itself a False Horseman of the Apocalypse while Conquest is a True Horsemen.
Pestilence in of itself was chosen as it fits the best, as neither Ishii or Pestilence really cared on who was infected, just as long as they were infected, just with different reasonings, experimentation and to kill.
If there's one thing we've all learned from Fate, it's that it doesn't matter whether a given myth is true or not, only whether people believe in it. Enough people have identified a horseman of Pestilence for long enough that I don't see any issue with it becoming a Phantom, especially since the considerations to do so are much weaker then for a proper Heroic Spirit.
Besides, there's been tons of different interpretations of the White Horse over the years, from the coming of Christ to the embodiment of evil to a symbol of Rome's prosperity. So it's not exactly cut-and-dry.
Regardless of whether Pestilence was a Rider in the bible, I'd say the fact that most people think it is is enough to qualify it as a Phantom. Edit: Royd beat me to it, and more eloquently at that.
Also, that Moreau/Robespierre sheet makes me even more glad that I didn't do Doctor Moreau/Gregor Samsa. It's miles better than mine.
We knew the forum would not be the same. A few people, a few people
, most people were
. I remembered the line from the Nasu scripture, the Fate/Complete Material... "Now, I am become Death, the derailer of threads."
A Gregor Samsa sheet would be cool though. In before this ends up being his NP.
Giant cockroach monster
Well, the faceclaim I intended to use was this:
Samsa&Moreau
Metamorphosis never calls him a cockroach, just a bug.
They were able to merge because they collectively embodied humanity's fear that the line between man and beast was not as wide as most assume, with Moreau being someone who made beast act like humans while Samsa became and even began to act like an animal. Their natural enemy was Tarzan.
And the above is basically everything that was remotely interesting about the sheet.
We knew the forum would not be the same. A few people
...How do you know all of the things?! Seriously, are you some kind of real-life munchkin who invested all points in Greek and Latin and convinced the GM those skills should cover EVERYTHING that has ever been writen in either language, not just Classics?
Yes, which is why I will die alone and destitute. Don't min-max, kids.
But I also have a principle of looking up the original language where I know it: everyone on this board should be familiar with the notion that translations are very fallible and always a product of compromise. Therefore, thanks to previous debates a couple of years ago over what exactly was happening in SF re: the Rider, I knew where to find this and what was going on. Between that and the painfully dull Biblical Greek, this was a relatively simple exercise.
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Updated 01/01/15
If posts are off-topic, trolling, terrible or offensive, please allow me to do my job. Reporting keeps your forum healthy.
Seika moderates: modly clarifications, explanations, Q&A, and the British conspiracy to de-codify BL's constitution.
Democracy on Beast's Lair
This entire site is filled with min-maxers.
Execute C:\local\lib\toh.exe?
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Dreams of swallow cuts.
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summs up a lot of my ironic weeaboo circles
I think I’m roughly average at most things.
But that’s probably slightly more than just a little off-topic.
That's not true. Some of us just take crippling debuffs for bonus points.
...I want a reroll.
I liked the El Cid idea a lot, that was a neat concept. I debated a Last Ride lich cid once but couldn't come up with a good explanation. That was an interesting take.
Oh, that makes sense.
Ah, spoken like a true scholar!Yes, which is why I will die alone and destitute.
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