The Grail Works Mission Dossier (Discussion & Ideas)

[Vigilantia]

I used a D&D character in a fanfic and he fit the setting so poorly that he made all the characters behave ooc just because of his presence. I rewrote his scenes with a character from the series itself much later, and it just worked much better. You should stop using this ever-distant utopiOC as an excuse, and just write a fanfic with the characters from the series you want to use. And unless the Grail Works crew is going to Greyhawk, Eberron, the Forgotten Realms, or some other Wizards of the Coast setting, leave D&D as far away as possible.

Unless you're doing a crack piece like Dead in the Water, where I intentionally used Deadpool because he would fit the setting so poorly.

Meh, in theory OCs are okay. Afterall, a well written OC is really just a character. The warning comes with the implementation since OCs can normally be born from SI. Also, OCs generally have a higher trust cliff for readers to scale since they don't know them and can't trust they won't have negative writing traits (i.e. Mary Sues, authors pets, etc.)

Although, I personally dislike trying to put in D&D characters that have to strictly follow D&D's rules since they don't always translate well. (I have this image of Kieran setting up D&D figures and rolling dice to write his story). The problem, as RaM encountered, is simply the fact that a character from D&D has a strict system that quite frankly is narratively expensive to explain and/or keep track of.

Of course, all our characters will kind of be awkward "fish out of water" characters given most of the time they'll be jumping into foreign universes, it just depends on how well you write the characters. Personally, I'd suggest if you wanted to have an OC to have/bring a Fate or Tsuki character to be the main character your OC being a support character you could build on through the story.

As an aside, I just went through Brandon Sanderson's classes on Youtube. Interesting stuff if you guys wanted something to listen to on writing.

[Kieran]

Meh, in theory OCs are okay. Afterall, a well written OC is really just a character. The warning comes with the implementation since OCs can normally be born from SI. Also, OCs generally have a higher trust cliff for readers to scale since they don't know them and can't trust they won't have negative writing traits (i.e. Mary Sues, authors pets, etc.)

Although, I personally dislike trying to put in D&D characters that have to strictly follow D&D's rules since they don't always translate well. (I have this image of Kieran setting up D&D figures and rolling dice to write his story). The problem, as RaM encountered, is simply the fact that a character from D&D has a strict system that quite frankly is narratively expensive to explain and/or keep track of.

I don't, really (though it is an amusing image ) - but I've played enough game systems, over the years, to have a general idea of how to translate characters from one to another, and which systems are appropriate for which settings.

. . . Now, having said that, I'll admit that Final Fantasy did not translate overly well; you'll note I skipped a lot of combat in Crisis of Fayth, and that was why. But in general, I can make it work between d20, the Tri-Stat system and its d20 conversions for anime (since they did Sailor Moon, Slayers, Hellsing, Revolutionary Girl Utena, Tenchi Muyo, etc.), and Palladium for anything involving giant robots.

Of course, all our characters will kind of be awkward "fish out of water" characters given most of the time they'll be jumping into foreign universes, it just depends on how well you write the characters. Personally, I'd suggest if you wanted to have an OC to have/bring a Fate or Tsuki character to be the main character your OC being a support character you could build on through the story.

Good advice.

As an aside, I just went through Brandon Sanderson's classes on Youtube. Interesting stuff if you guys wanted something to listen to on writing.

I avoid him entirely due to association with Robert Jordan, personally.

[Xamusel]

...association with Robert Jordan? What's that supposed to mean, exactly?

[Draconic]

Wouldn't that be a good thing?

[Kieran]

...association with Robert Jordan? What's that supposed to mean, exactly?

He finished off Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time series, after the author died.

Wouldn't that be a good thing?

I gave up on Robert Jordan after the ninth 800-page books that went nowhere, often predicting that he'd die before he finished the series - and I was right.

Given that Sanderson apparently managed to turn a 1600-page "final book" into a trilogy, I see no reason to look at anything else he's done.

[Vigilantia]

He finished off Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time series, after the author died.

I gave up on Robert Jordan after the ninth 800-page books that went nowhere, often predicting that he'd die before he finished the series - and I was right.

Given that Sanderson apparently managed to turn a 1600-page "final book" into a trilogy, I see no reason to look at anything else he's done.

Eh, I've heard varying accounts of that. Quite frankly, I think it'd be like if GRRM died and someone had to pickup after him. No one would like it either way since its not "GRRM".

Also, I recall GRRM turning a trilogy into 7 books... :P

Generally, I've heard Sanderson makes good long books that aren't high brow literature (I'd actually consider that a positive personally) but he's prolific and he interacts with the writing community more than most authors. His lectures (and podcast) are useful for a me, a guy that's taken no formal non-technical writing courses nor has the inclination to pay for classes in my area. At the very least, I think there's a lot of useful information in them for new writers.

[Express]

Mistborn is great if you're in middle school tbh

[Xamusel]

Ugh... okay, I'm starting to get myself back on track with the Grail Works. However, due to the fact that I'm fairly certain that my current idea is something of a bust, I am thinking of reworking my intro to the Grail Works LTD, especially since I've been trying to keep all of my ideas in my head with no way of saving them elsewhere... which absolutely sucks!

Believe me, I need to make sure that I can adjust my idea, even if it means doing a new character idea from scratch. I also have to make sure that my character's first trip is somewhere that I won't be trying to redo over and over again... get the point?

For reference, I'd been keen on using Valkyria Chronicles for my character's first mission for quite some time, which, frankly, is starting to get old for me real fast. I think I'd better get that moved from its current position of first mission to somewhere further back in the line.

Now, to get onto the main order of business I've been pondering, character ideas. I am personally debating a few different options for my character. I'd post the ideas as a list, but I have another method for this, so to speak.

Self Insert Relevance?

d8	Self Insert Relevance
1	No Self Insert Relevance
2	Very Minor Self Insert Relevance
3	Minor Self Insert Relevance
4	Moderate Self Insert Relevance
5	Major Self Insert Relevance
6	Very Major Self Insert Relevance
7	Complete Self Insert Relevance
8	Reroll

Gender of character (if no SI relevance)?

Any die type	Result
Odds	Boy
Evens	Girl

Rule 63'd?

d6	Result (if no SI relevance)
1-2	Yes
3-4	No
5-6	Reroll

Coin Toss	Result (if SI relevance of any sort)
Heads	Author is turned into a girl somewhere down the line
Tails	Author stays the same gender as he normally is

Source Material to gain powers from initially?

d6	Boy Results	Girl Results
1	D&D 3.5e	Ranma 1/2
2	Star Wars Saga Edition d20	Anima: Beyond Fantasy
3	Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha	Puella Magi Madoka Magica
4	13th Age	Pathfinder
5	RWBY	Genesys RPG
6	Naruto	Bleach

Granted, this is all somewhat a work in progress, my list of how to get my character developed properly for this setting. Honestly? I'm just hoping to get something set for me by means of following the instructions for the tables.

...so. Any takers?

[Mattias]

Why would you want your male protag to get powers from Nanoha, the show where only women have plot relevance?

[Xamusel]

I was thinking along the lines of magical powers coming from a Device and a Linker Core, as opposed to the purely (as far as we've seen it) Puella Magi method, which would be really bad for a guy to have.

Still... anyone willing to roll from the list? I'm having trouble deciding what to pick right now.

[Kieran]

I was thinking along the lines of magical powers coming from a Device and a Linker Core, as opposed to the purely (as far as we've seen it) Puella Magi method, which would be really bad for a guy to have.

Still... anyone willing to roll from the list? I'm having trouble deciding what to pick right now.

Well, since I happen to have the appropriate dice literally within arm's reach (an advantage to using Skype for gaming sessions) . . .


. . . Oh, yeah, these are the cursed dice, aren't they? *Clears throat* Congratulations, young miss - according to this, you are a Very Minor SI Reference Rule 63 who gets turned into a girl somewhere down the line (which strikes me as mutually exclusive?), drawing powers from Puella Madoka Magica Magi!

. . . Yeah, sorry - I forgot the dice were cursed. ^_^;

[Xamusel]

Kieran, let me correct you on one thing. The question of "Boy or Girl?" is only applicable for if you rolled a 1 on the first table, which would mean my character is not an SI of any sort. Sorry for the confusion.

- - - Updated - - -

If this idea helps... feel free to re-roll the whole list of tables, keeping in mind that a result of 1 on the first table means no SI relevance, Kieran.

- - - Updated - - -

...actually, if the question before the table says "no SI relevance" and you rolled anything other than a 1, skip it. Skip the SI relevant ones if the inverse is true, too, to be safe.

[Kieran]

Minor Self-Insert Relevance . . . Author stays the same gender (lucky you) . . . And you're drawing on the 13th Age (which I've heard of, but never played). That help?

[Xamusel]

Actually... perhaps I should have listed a guide as to what I was looking for in terms of the last table. I recall I wanted a Martial Artist, a Psychic (if using the Force even counts...), and a Magic User... but what else?

[Kieran]

Arvandor
The Olympian Glades of Arborea, the Outer Planes








The Seldarine gathered, to wield their powers as they had not for dozens of millennia, though they were mere shadows of what they’d once been. They gathered, to heal a world, to lay a foundation for that world’s future . . . And in so doing, save a race of their children that, until recently, had been thought long since lost: the Ssri-Tel’Quessir, the dark elves who had become the drow, redeemed by sacrifice to become dark elves once more.

Unfortunately, that “race” represented a very small fraction of the drow; most of them remained corrupted by the demonic blood that had created them, to say nothing of the influence of their goddess, Lloth the Spider Queen. As such, they were at terrible risk—Lloth had never been one to take challenges to her rule over the drow lightly, and the Ssri-Tel’Quessir had earned her wrath when they had been drow elves, merely by worshipping her daughter, Eilistraee, over herself. That they had now disassociated themselves from the drow—and thus, from her—entirely . . .

No, Lloth would see that as an insult she could never bear. She—and by extension, her followers—would not stop until all traces of the Ssri-Tel’Quessir’s very existence had been utterly eliminated from the face of Aber-Toril. And that was not a fate that Corellon Larethian was prepared to countenance. Not in his role as leader of the Seldarine, the gods of the elven peoples, and not in his role as the Father of All Elves . . . Nor would he tolerate it as Eilistraee’s father, either.

His brilliant, beautiful daughter was gone—a great and terrible loss to a mortal elf, much less an immortal one. All that remained of her were the elves she’d sacrificed herself to save. He would not allow them to fall before Lloth’s evil.

Labelas Enorath knew this, of course. The Lord of the Continuum was, if not omniscient, as close to it as any god could truly claim to be. He had to be: the realms of fate, time and history were his to shepherd. He knew more of the future, and the secret workings behind it, than even Corellon himself—it was why he had allowed the solar to respond to the summons of a mortal, and grant the wish that mortal made. Because he knew what would have been the fate of the dark elves, without that wish . . .

“. . . You’ve gone to a great deal of trouble to arrange this, Labelas,” Corellon remarked. “Are we now to find out why?”

The scholar winced. He had thought he was being rather subtle, actually—he had to be, as he was working in realms normally forbidden even to deities . . . Or at least, deities of his level. It was normally restricted to Lord Ao alone; thus, he’d had to be exceedingly careful in his actions, lest he draw the Overgod’s attention—or worse, alert others to the existence of the path he’d used to reach those places. Only chaos could come from that . . .

“I merely sought to fulfill my duties as a member of the Seldarine, Lord Coronal, and protect a tribe of the mortals we oversee,” Labelas replied lightly. “That they are a tribe previously lost to the memory of any mortal living, and barely recalled even in history, made it a duty I thought required any and all efforts I could exert.”

And because, the god did not add, very soon now, as elves and immortals would reckon such things, the great upheavals that had plagued their world would culminate in a truly mighty cataclysm. And in response to that chaos, Lord Ao, the Overgod, would rewrite the very Tablets of Fate, restoring the Realms to much as they had been before. Dead deities, including Eilistraee, would be restored to life; and the Dark Maiden would take up her work of attempting to redeem the drow once more—because the dark elves which had already been restored would cease to be, in any significant fashion. The drow would be all that remained of them once more.

His task was to ensure that history was neither forgotten, nor altered. Labelas would not have stopped the Overgod from performing the act he would, even if he had possessed the power to do so . . . But neither did he wish for such a momentous event as the restoration of the true dark elves (as opposed to the drow, who were often referred to by that name) to be lost. It was an impossible dilemma, even for a god . . .

And in confronting it, he had discovered the existence of a Door—and what lay beyond it.

The mortals there were not yet prepared to deal with the scale of the problem that lay before him; not in the time which remained. But through them, he might be able to allow someone who was to act. And so, Labelas had sought a cat’s-paw, and made his transgressions—and the result had been everything he could have hoped.

“It is a truly beautiful world,” remarked Deep Sashelas—and as a god of beauty, as well as knowledge, magic, and the sea, he ought to know. “Perhaps the Alu-Tel’Quessir could benefit from it, as well?”

Labelas nodded. The sea elves were, in their way, as isolated from most elves as the dark elves would be, should they be returned to Toril. While they had no love for the drow, they had less history of conflict with them, as well; and as the world of Spira was mostly oceanic, such a world potentially offered them vast new territories, away from their traditional enemies. Likewise, they too would be less affected by the coming cataclysm—though not unscathed—and have less effect on it. Entire tribes of them could disappear, and not be missed in the histories—mostly because they would disappear, anyway.

“. . . Do you truly intend to kill the mortal, Lord Coronal?” inquired a feminine voice, and hearing it drew all male attention towards its source.

Hanali Celanil was the goddess of love and beauty among elves—the counterpart to the humans’ Sune Firehair, and a rival of Aphrodite, on the rare occasions when the Seldarine and the Olympians contested with one another. Her most common features, as now, were those of a sun elf: golden hair and eyes alongside porcelain-delicate features. She paired these with a body built to draw the eye, as her voice drew the ear—though she was not above taking other appearances, where and when she deemed it necessary; or simply for fun. She would hardly be the goddess of desire, otherwise.

Labelas coughed lightly. “He hardly seems your type, Hanali.”

The frown that crossed her features somehow failed to mar them in the slightest as she shot back, “He isn’t . . . Well, that half-elven aspect is kind of attractive, in a rugged sort of way—but there’s a human under it, and he’s not pretty at all.”

“Does he have a lover, then? Or perhaps he possesses some especial talent for artisanship?”

She snorted delicately, her expression answer enough.

Now it was Corellon’s turn to frown, as he understood the point Labelas was making. “Then what is your interest, Hanali? Gentle though you are, it’s unusual for you to be so concerned over the fate of a mortal—and a human, at that.”

“I’m concerned because he does love,” she answered. “That is at the core of this: that he is willing to die because he loved Eilistraee, in his fashion, as he loves all elves.” She shrugged. “It’s not romantic love, really—little more than the wondrous fascination we evoke in humanity. To some extent, that’s also true of Spira itself, and of those people he works for . . . But given the service that he’s performing for us in its name, I would find his death to be a poor repayment of that love.”

“So long as his resolve holds,” Corellon replied, “it should not be necessary; ’twould hardly be a worthy test, otherwise. But the question would then remain, of what to do with him afterwards . . .”

“Toril is no place for him,” Labelas said firmly. Had any of the other gods—even his fellows among the Seldarine—known even half of the sort of knowledge that was in that mortal’s head, or even just known of it . . .

Toril would not survive the ensuing conflicts.

“Nor would consigning him to Spira do our cause any favours,” he forestalled the next obvious choice, not unkindly. “Should the truth of his nature be revealed, it would undo all the groundwork laid for the Ssri-Tel’Quessir . . . And in truth,” he added, doing his best to sound off-handed, “he does not fit well with his compatriots, either. He is no more of their world than ours, and the differences, though often subtle, leave him somewhat adrift.”

Hanali smiled, and it brightened the whole of the glade. “Then perhaps we can change at least that?” She turned to a fellow goddess. “Sehanine, what would you say to the idea of trying to catch his spirit for a little reincarnation . . .?”

The moon goddess raised an eyebrow in response, her expression intrigued.

Labelas very carefully kept his own expression blank. From here, things became very delicate . . . But, handled carefully, it would place the mortal safely away from Toril and its associated planes—for a certain value of safe, at least. Moreover, it would return the mortal to his people and his work, which was best for all concerned.

All that aside, however, he had to admit to some amusement about what was about to happen.

After all, in all their tens of millennia of life, this would be a reincarnation none of the Seldarine had ever seen before . . .








Singularity F/Fuyuki City
January 30, 2004








“Fou!”

The soft sound woke Ritsuka, bringing him from blackness to white—

No. Wait. That was Fou’s fur.

He rose to his feet, not quite steady, and with some alarm once his memory of the last few minutes (?) came back: Chaldea, the explosion, his sister and Mashu—

“Mashu,” he hissed in sudden realisation, before calling out. “Mashu!”

She wouldn’t have gone far without Fou, he thought, before mentally reversing the concept. As hurt as Mashu had been, she was unlikely to be able to go anywhere—but Fou wouldn’t have left her . . . And for that matter, where was—?

“Makoto?” he called. “Makoto . . .?”

“We’re here, Nii-san,” she called back.

“We” was good, Ritsuka thought. Depending on what condition Mashu was in, it wasn’t necessarily great, but at least they were together . . .

“Who’s that?” he blurted, seeing the male shape on the ground.

“My Servant, we think,” Makoto answered, displaying an odd marking on her hand. “Since Mashu-chan is yours, now.”

“Eh?” he started, then shook his head. Worry about it later, he decided, figure out the strange guy now.

“He doesn’t feel quite right,” Mashu noted, her eyebrows furrowed in concentration. “There’s a spiritual concentration to him, and the seal indicates a bond, but—”

She frowned as he stirred suddenly, asking sharply. “Hey—what class are you?” As he mumbled something, she blinked, repeating, “‘Reaver?’”

“River,” he groaned. “HMCS Toronto, River-class frigate, kay-two-three-eight—wait, what?” He sat bolt upright, eyes wide.

“HOW AND WHY AM I A BOAT?!”








Writer's Notes: I've binging Kantai Collection stuff for the last couple of weeks, and this happened.

I don't think I can do much more with this (or should, anyway), but I had to get it out . . . Maybe now I can do something useful.

[Xamusel]

...well. Guess who just got past the gender bending aspect of KanColle?

[Kieran]

*Chuckles* Well, actually, if I went with the destroyer that uses my middle name, I could hand-wave being male by virtue of the fact that its final incarnation was in Russia - ships there are male, unlike just about everywhere else in the world. And really, there are a lot of little things, symbolically, that would link me to that particular ship . . .

Unfortunately, finding information on the class is difficult, because it's so damned old - at least I can find a book on the River-class destroyers (including internal layout), and just scale it down for the frigate.

Also, I thought it'd be amusing to be the Servant, for a change, rather than trying to match my character up with one - and to fall for the harem pro deuteragonist . . . Really, it's even funnier when I consider that one of the comments on their wiki article pointed out that the F/GO protagonist models are basically a gender-swapped Shirou and Rin - i.e., possibly their kids . . .?

[Xamusel]

...yeah, I got nothing to counter that with. Especially regarding Ritsuka, come to think of it.

- - - Updated - - -

On another topic, I'm gonna be going on vacation soon enough, in case I failed to mention that earlier. I'll be headed east to my dad's family farm in New York state... and I'll be sure to work out details for how to work on my character for the Grail Works.

[Vigilantia]

Wait, what did I just read.

[Kieran]

As I said, it was a whim. I'd been reading a number of Kantai Collection fanfic crossovers that were intriguingly written, so I thought it might make for an interesting empowerment; depending on how I did it, it had a number of possibilities. And since I've actually managed to acquire Fate/Grand Order: First Order (by paying $2 a minute ), I thought it might be a decent option for reintegrating with the TYPE-MOONiverse.

. . . Of course, I've recently learned that the company behind Kantai Collection also has a gender-flipped series with sword boys - and a storyline suspiciously similar to F/GO . . .