Technically I'm not sure about that Element one. It sounds absolute as well but most magi have crests with stored spells from other generations with other elements.
Technically I'm not sure about that Element one. It sounds absolute as well but most magi have crests with stored spells from other generations with other elements.
Araya, what do you seek?
「アラヤ、何を求める」
------True wisdom.「――――真の叡智を」
Araya, where do you seek it?「アラヤ、何処に求める」
Only within myself.「――――ただ、己が内にのみ」
Araya, what is your favorite color?「アラヤ、好きな色は？」
Blue. No, ora-- Auuuuuuuugh!「青、いや、オレンジイイイイイアアアっ！」
Don't think the attribute thing is quite right. Families build up an overarching attribute that all the members are skilled at by filling up the crest over generations, but they can use other attributes, too. Rin can use reinforcement, for example, and probably other stuff.
But isn't her Reinforcement just another application of Flow and Transfer?
[04:55] Lianru: i3uster is actuallly quite cute
No, reinforcement is an attribute so that's impossible and silly.
Here, I’ll go over examples of attributes of magic such as reinforcement, projection, and conversion. Types of magic in which attributes are used have high versatility and have a wide range of applications, so what I will be introducing here are not representative of magic in which attributes are used; these are simply a few examples. Among these, there are also types of magic which have a high degree of freedom compared to even magic of the same attribute and have no set form of execution, just like reinforcement.
Generally, a magus line has an attribute they are specialized in. This is dependent on what kind of research they had been doing for generations and what kind of mysteries they left in their crests, and such, these attributes cannot be changed in a short time.
However, just as Tohsaka Rin can use the attribute of “reinforcement” in addition to the “conversion” that the Tohsaka family is strong at, a first rate magus is going to have multiple attributes. Also, unlike attributes, an “alignment” can only be used for magic that has same type of alignment as the magus. For a magus to use magic of a different alignment, the alignment will have to be changed, just like in the case of Matou Sakura.
The addition of meaning through attributes will change the usage of elemental magic. The reinforcement ability of Shirou, who has no elemental alignment, will fall in a special category.
An Average One can use five types of magic with one attribute. Rin, who is an Average One and is strong at conversion, which has a wide range of applications, is extremely versatile.
Last edited by Mcjon01; June 25th, 2012 at 03:16 PM.
It's a torrent of malignant information.Originally Posted by ChiakiKakumei
As to what that means... mmm, maybe it gives you cancer?
LOGIC CANCER!
*ba-dum tish*
Araya, what do you seek?
「アラヤ、何を求める」
------True wisdom.「――――真の叡智を」
Araya, where do you seek it?「アラヤ、何処に求める」
Only within myself.「――――ただ、己が内にのみ」
Araya, what is your favorite color?「アラヤ、好きな色は？」
Blue. No, ora-- Auuuuuuuugh!「青、いや、オレンジイイイイイアアアっ！」
But Book of False Attendant is not a command, it is an item forged from the Command Spell.
You are comparing apples and oranges there, if you compare a Mystic Code and the effect of an already executed Command Spell.
She dies anyways because she dired to threaten the King's property.
Caster dies either way in that situation, because she is in the way. Death by just being there.
Last edited by food; June 25th, 2012 at 03:31 PM.
Also, from here you can see the Book of False Attendant also transfers Contract ("lose your right as a Master"). With all this mess, it is not hard to see why the Book would burn if you use your last Command Spell to make it.Rider became Shinji's Servant with that, and you lost your right as a Master at the same time, becoming an ordinary magus. …So when I first had you show me your arm, you'd already given your Command Spell to Shinji."
"…………"
Sakura doesn't answer and bites her lips.
Then.
From here, you can see the Book will burn because during the process of making a Book with the last Command Spell, there is a period where Rider has no Master, and that screws up the transferring of rights."It's useless, Shinji. It's almost impossible to entrust a Servant to a human, and someone that's not a magus at that. The transfer using the Command Spell made it possible."
"Y-Yeah. There's one more Command Spell.
Sakura won't disobey me, so…"
"That's why this is it. Sakura only has one more Command Spell. If you use it, you'll have no way to control Rider.
Rider would be freed. You can't bind a Servant with a fake right made with a Command Spell. It'll just burn your book like earlier even if you order Rider."
The Book alone cannot bind a Servant.
Last edited by food; June 25th, 2012 at 03:44 PM.
Food is going hero mode on the questions thread, I guess.
So, what happens if a magus passes his crest on, does he still excel in the attribute he did before he gave it away, or does he...lose the knowledge of his ancestors or something?
[04:55] Lianru: i3uster is actuallly quite cute
I thought we implemented an anti-double post mechanism, so I can slack off when adding points.
I guess I am too powerful even said mechanism cannot contain me.
It depends if you learned everything in your Crest before you passed it on or not.
Crest lets you use stuff you do not know. If you never bothered learning the spells, and just capitalize on the Crest, you just "forgot" all your spells.
Last edited by food; June 25th, 2012 at 03:49 PM.
The doublepost prevention only works for posts made within 10 minutes of each other, I believe.
Yeah, exactly.
If command spells still worked once they'd all been used up, then the book would continue to work too.
I know, but that doesn't mean command spells continue to work.And Rider was still connected to Sakura past the end of the War.
Yes, but it runs on the power of the executed command spell. I don't see why using a third command spell for that purpose is any different from using it for any other purpose.
Except that the contract between a master and servant remains even after command spells have been used up. So, Sakura still has the "right" to be Rider's master, and thus I don't see the issue with it.
Did you even read the part I dug up?
Forging the Book with your last Command Spell is different from using your last Command Spell up.
Forging the Book forfeits Mastership, Command and Contract and all. Just using up Command Spells alone does not end your Mastership, since Mastership consists of Contract and Command Spells.Rider became Shinji's Servant with that, and you lost your right as a Master at the same time, becoming an ordinary magus. …So when I first had you show me your arm, you'd already given your Command Spell to Shinji."
"…………"
Sakura doesn't answer and bites her lips.
See here:
"It should be quick. I am merely erasing the Command Spell on your arm.
There are two factors causing Masters to be Masters.
One is the contract with the Servant, and the other is the Command Spell on your arm.
You will be freed from the Holy Grail War if you lose both of these."
The Book burns because after you make it with your last Command Spell (thus losing both Contract and Command Spells in one sweep), your Servant becomes effectively free.
And the Book is too weak to bind a Servant alone, so it burns.
Last edited by food; June 25th, 2012 at 04:00 PM.
Ah, I see. So, the book temporarily revokes your mastership and command spells, but when it burns you get them back?
Seems so, because the transferred Mastership in that Book is still "Sakura's", when it burned, the Mastership reverts (minus one Command Spell used to forge the book).
Right, but it involves her temporarily giving it up and, thus, if she uses the last command spell to do so, it breaks the contract permanently and, thus, Rider is freed?
Well, I would think permanently in the sense that Sakura or Shinji is no longer her Master, officially or unofficially. But she can always make a new contract. Servants kind of need those to stay in the world, even those with Independent Action.
Hope Rides With His Godly Ronin/Cowboy Brother In Law
Burn Command Spell (0 Command Spell) -> Forge Book (0 Contract) -> Book Complete (Mastership = Void) -> Rider is effectively free, Book cannot bind Rider, Book burns
Kayneth summons Gilgamesh in the 4th War.
What happens.
He never sleeps. He never dies.
Battle doesn't need a purpose; the battle is its own purpose. You don't ask why a plague spreads or a field burns. Don't ask why I fight.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
