[FGO JP main chapter] OC4: Trinity Metatronius, Courtroom for the Judgment of Mankind

[Link0306]

Very heavy spoiler from Super Jeanne's profile last bond entry unlocked after clearing OC4:

Spoiler:

Regarding Ordeal Call IV


In Ordeal Call IV, within Florence,
Dante Alighieri formed a Singularity.
During this event, Dante attempted to summon Beatrice
but failed.


As her substitute, Metatron Jeanne was summoned -
bearing the outer shell of Jeanne d'Arc
and the essence of Metatron.


However, because of Jeanne d'Arc's human vessel,
Metatron Jeanne became capable of experientially understanding
the Seven Deadly Sins that characterize this Singularity.


Driven by anger toward humanity born from this revelation,
Metatron Jeanne established her objectives as:
"Blessing the New Primates"
and
"Judging the Sins of Pan-Human History"
then began exercising her authority.


Yet in doing so, she discarded the Sin of Sloth as unnecessary.
This severed portion became the Second Ascension Metatron Jeanne -
namely, [Sloth] Metatron.


Thus, the central conflict of Ordeal Call IV was revealed.
Simultaneously, Chaldea gained qualification to Rayshift
toward Antarctica for Singularity correction.


It should be noted that her unawareness of
Pan-Human History's eventual restoration
was due to Kotomine Kirei's masterful manipulation.
He appears to have precisely anticipated
the moment she would suffer maximum psychological damage.

Aaaah that helps clarify things.

Spoiler:

So Meta Jeannr didn’t know phh could be restored, so yeah in that case Chaldea would look much worse than they actually are.

Spoiler:

I guess that goes into Guda’s punishment being postponed too, if he does bring back phh then it makes the severity of his crimes much smaller.

[InsertNameHere]

I mean, "they" in this case is literally the main culprit themselves...

He meant Metatron, although it also sounds like Metatron hates humanity on principle of their not being perfectly sinless. Like Kazuradrop but without the compassion that allows the latter to only want to "educate" humanity rather than eradicate it.

[Kamera]

He meant Metatron, although it also sounds like Metatron hates humanity on principle of their not being perfectly sinless. Like Kazuradrop but without the compassion that allows the latter to only want to "educate" humanity rather than eradicate it.

Yes, Meta Jeanne here is clearly being manipulated by Kotomine, who is the main villain's chief vizier

[mami-kouga]

Spoiler:

The Shielder class is about the pure will to defend everyone indiscriminately. It's the purity that defined early Mash, and that she lost when her Lostbelt experiences taught her that lives are not made equal and that she's capable of choosing that some lives matter to her more than others, not to mention her growing relationship with Lilith throughout the Ordeal eventually taking her to the point she actively wants someone dead. Every time she tries to act like her old self, her Galahad-like, she's hit with a flashback to Tepeu's speech about the flaws of the deinos way (classic Shiki killing a white woman's purity)

But even with Mash's purity ruined, that purity is still built upon the ideals of fairness and impartiality demanded of an arbiter, so both MetaJeanne and Galahad push her toward reclassing to Ruler if she can't be a Shielder anymore. It doesn't happen, of course. Instead she takes pride in her biases and invents Paladin, the class of "Mash Kyrielight will do what she wants without bothering herself with anyone else's arbitrary categories".

Galahad specifically believes that Mash's potential as a wonderful Ruler is being held back by her idolization of him, pushing her to insist in his Shielder class even when it doesn't fit her anymore, so he enables Lilith's awful behavior throughout the whole chapter and randomly takes over as final boss at the end to get Mash to stop respecting him. It doesn't work. Mash still thinks Galahad is the coolest at the end, so he has to give up because she clearly won't listen, plus the Paladin thing renders the whole "problem" moot anyway.

THANK GOD, SOME ACTUAL GALAHAD TEXT

[Kelp24]

Jeanne's NP looks kinda funny sped up.

[Dark Squirrel]

He meant Metatron, although it also sounds like Metatron hates humanity on principle of their not being perfectly sinless. Like Kazuradrop but without the compassion that allows the latter to only want to "educate" humanity rather than eradicate it.

Metatron got gaslit by Kirei, give it a rest. The whole thing is not actually a fair trial and was never intended to be, it's just Kirei trying his best to get rid of two problems at once by throwing them at each other's throat.

[Link0306]

Once again people judge everything on contextless spoilers.

[Reverse_side98]

Metatron hijacked Beatrice's Saint Graph to gain a body and then assumed Jeanne's personality.

Dante witnessed that and wanted to kill her on the spot.

So its not actually Jeanne but Bea who is now confirmed a Jeanneface?

[rxrx]

How many chapters are there for OC4? 28?

[InsertNameHere]

Anyway, how exactly is the world accepting that the Paladin class is a thing now just because Mash says it is? I guess there's sort of a precedent in the MoonCancer and Pretender classes, but those were the creations of beings far more powerful than Mash is right now- enough to force the world into letting them make the classes themselves.

[idpersona]

I guess I'm happy for people who are happy to have a new Jeanne variant, but as a Jewish person I will indulge my freedom of speech to say that the existence of Meta Jeanne pisses me off to no end.
Like I've mostly forgiven stuff like David's Divinity skill description, and heck King Solomon/ Romani is one of my favorite fictional characters ever and his NP is literally named after the apostle Paul.
I understand that especially when you get to the mythological and esoteric side of things the boundaries between the abrahamic religions become a lot more permeable. Also I'm an smt fan I'm used to Metatron having a giant cross on his robes, but still...
I can't help but feel like Metatron being a Jeanne variant is really really gross.
In the logic of the franchise I understand why it was done, If Rulers are perfect impartial judges whose entire purpose is to control Servants / Holy Grail Wars than Metatron is a great pic for that, it parallels Beast I being intrinsically linked to summoning magecraft.
I also understand that if you were going to make the quintessential ruler you're going to model them after the first Ruler, who's a series heroine and franchise mascot at this point.
But it's very very clear to me and very upsetting to me that Nasu, Higashide, Miwa and company unaware of or completely disinterested in the anti-semitic theological supersessionist tone that would be set if you combine the Roman Catholic saint with one of the most quintessentially Jewish esoteric figures.
And that's not helped by the other things in the setting that seem to indicate that as far as the Nasuverse is concerned Judaism was just a prototype of Christianity which can be explained by general cultural ignorance due to various factors of Japanese access to Occidental media and research sources,
Explained maybe but not really justified or excused, whether they like it or not Fate is an international franchise and they have the means and money to hire the necessary people.

I can totally forgive the Chariot Throne being a streaming chair, that's funny and novel. It really grosses me out that said throne/gamer chair is artistically modeled after the Papal throne. You are directly tying a figure of rabbinic mysticism to a religious and political symbol of Christian authority........
(I also can forgive the gigantism fetish, that's actually weirdly enough something that tracks with Metatron's lore)

Sir this is a Wendy's

[Oz1337]

I just saw Galahad NP, and it's honestly amazing. I truly am a simp for Camelot stuff LOL.

[Bookofgoetia]

I think i have one idea on how everything will end.

Spoiler:

You know seeing how the story will end with a time reset.
I think the best way to make it work.
Is very simple
Seeing how Mash powers work and how she is now not future or past heroic spirit. Seeing that the absurdly fictional servant that is Lily lancer did show up to break or hearts,and seeing how Ritsuka still has to have a punishment.
The best way to have a bitter sweet ending that wouldn't feel like a waste of time.
Is just to have Ritsuka not be a part of the normal human history. When time resets,Ritsuka is not there anymore.
Now Ritsuka,Mash and most likely the rest of Chaldea is an outside of time entity that works to protect humantiy. The punishment is this.

Ritsuka never can go back to the the normal person,but everyone that played the game will not feel that is a waste of time. (And funny enough i feel this is the ending most of the fanbase desires). It still bitter sweet,but its something that would ended up with its worth it.
Also it does open for a part 3 and events...

[Emeraldwolf]

What even happens to Kirei in the end if this is all his fault

[Gelious]

Is the whole Paladin thing reflected in the actual gameplay outside of OC 4? Or is Mash still Shielder?

[Reverse_side98]

Spoiler:

The Shielder class is about the pure will to defend everyone indiscriminately. It's the purity that defined early Mash, and that she lost when her Lostbelt experiences taught her that lives are not made equal and that she's capable of choosing that some lives matter to her more than others, not to mention her growing relationship with Lilith throughout the Ordeal eventually taking her to the point she actively wants someone dead. Every time she tries to act like her old self, her Galahad-like, she's hit with a flashback to Tepeu's speech about the flaws of the deinos way (classic Shiki killing a white woman's purity)

But even with Mash's purity ruined, that purity is still built upon the ideals of fairness and impartiality demanded of an arbiter, so both MetaJeanne and Galahad push her toward reclassing to Ruler if she can't be a Shielder anymore. It doesn't happen, of course. Instead she takes pride in her biases and invents Paladin, the class of "Mash Kyrielight will do what she wants without bothering herself with anyone else's arbitrary categories".

Galahad specifically believes that Mash's potential as a wonderful Ruler is being held back by her idolization of him, pushing her to insist in his Shielder class even when it doesn't fit her anymore, so he enables Lilith's awful behavior throughout the whole chapter and randomly takes over as final boss at the end to get Mash to stop respecting him. It doesn't work. Mash still thinks Galahad is the coolest at the end, so he has to give up because she clearly won't listen, plus the Paladin thing renders the whole "problem" moot anyway.

So you can invent class on the fly now or did something extraordinary happen?

[Dark Squirrel]

Once again people judge everything on contextless spoilers.

In fairness this time it's actual spoilers, not fake ones. And accurate too, not just MTL ones.

[AceSockVims]

What even happens to Kirei in the end if this is all his fault

He gives everyone a jolly good "Yorokobe" and skedaddles.

The most likely case is that we finally return to Fuyuki to beat his ass.

[madarra]

Is the whole Paladin thing reflected in the actual gameplay outside of OC 4? Or is Mash still Shielder?

she costs 16 to use now.

[Oz1337]

Is the whole Paladin thing reflected in the actual gameplay outside of OC 4? Or is Mash still Shielder?

According to Atlas her Class is still technically Shielder, so that hasn't changed, fully neutral to everything.