The Grail Works Mission Dossier (Discussion & Ideas)

[Hymn of Ragnarok]

I was rereading Andraste on Dragon Age Origins wikia and...uh, wow. There are so many parallels to Joan of Arc it's not even funny. Apparently it was entirely intentional on the part of the developers. So when Jeanne explains that her ultimate weapon against the Archdemon is a crystallized mystery that recreates her burning at the stake, not only is it further proof that Jeanne is Andraste in some form, but she was may not be meant to survive the Archdemon. The Maker allowed her to leave His side so that she can save her people, but no longer.

There are so many ways to use this information to further the drama of a story. Jeanne revealing that she is a Heroic Spirit, and not strictly the woman she was in life, could also be utilized. Instead of being returned through the will of the Maker, Jeanne (still considered Andraste) is revealed to be the idealized copy of a legendary figure, powered by the belief and imagination of humanity. Or play the divine emissary to the hilt, even if Jeanne never fully realizes she has her own cult across Fereldan.

Loghain is in so much trouble that it is hysterical.

[SeiKeo]

Yeah, Andraste is Joan/Jesus in one, which is part of why this idea is so perfect XD.

[Hymn of Ragnarok]

No kidding. There are so many ways to play this, and they're all delightfully entertaining to imagine. I'm going to try to think of ways this can bite Jeanne in her dainty rear though. It's not Grail Works if being hyper-competent and suited to the local culture to boot doesn't hinder you in unexpected yet entertaining ways.

Perhaps being hailed as the reincarnation of a saint finally screws her over when she reaches Orzammar?

[SeiKeo]

Perhaps being hailed as the reincarnation of a saint finally screws her over when she reaches Orzammar?

....


ufufufufufu~

[Kieran]

It's not Grail Works if being hyper-competent and suited to the local culture to boot doesn't hinder you in unexpected yet entertaining ways.

Exactly.

[reborn214]

Out of curiosity how do you think Joan would do in a post apocalyptic setting where mankind is on the brink of extinction like either of the souls games, God Eater, or Fallout?

[Hymn of Ragnarok]

....


ufufufufufu~

Evil laughter is music to my ears.

Seeing as I'm coming up with lots of ideas, and with any luck my imagination will keep doing so, should I start PMing PhoenixAct and yourself to keep a few surprises for everyone or keep posting them here for discussion?

Out of curiosity how do you think Joan would do in a post apocalyptic setting where mankind is on the brink of extinction like either of the souls games, God Eater, or Fallout?

Fallout? Depends on whether or not she can purify the environment, like making free purified/holy water. If she can....new religion! And many bounties on her head.

Personally, I favor being able to heal ghouls with holy shrouds to really drop a bombshell.

[SeiKeo]

Evil laughter is music to my ears.

Seeing as I'm coming up with lots of ideas, and with any luck my imagination will keep doing so, should I start PMing PhoenixAct and yourself to keep a few surprises for everyone or keep posting them here for discussion?

If you have any super TWEESTS, try PMing them to us, but general ones can stay here. What you prefer, really.

[Hymn of Ragnarok]

If you have any super TWEESTS, try PMing them to us, but general ones can stay here. What you prefer, really.

Fair enough. The next idea I had ties into a pet peeve I have about Zevran. He has four ranks in Poison, but he chooses a straight up ambush. You'd think slipping poison into The Grey Warden's food is a more discreet option. So to remedy that, have Zevran try exactly that. But because Jeanne prays and gives thanks to God for each meal, all the poison and disease in her food, and possibly her companions, and wiped free of all contaminants. If Zevran gets the leftovers of food and finds that the poison is gone. The Warden didn't metabolize the poison or have some kind of immunity, the poison is just plain gone. This baffles, frustrates, and intrigues Zevran and his various assassination attempts until he gives up in frustration and opts for the canonical ambush. A foot of steel lodged in her throat should kill the Grey Warden even if she does somehow remove all traces of poison from the blade.

Zevran's final failure just cements in his mind that not only is this new Grey Warden capable, she just might be a genuine saint. Clearly it would be wise to convert on the spot, swear allegiance, and start making up for his life of sin by serving Andraste reborn with the tools of trade acquired during said life of sin. That Zevran would remain a hedonist at heart and is unable to hide it just sweetens the irony of all his interactions with Jeanne.

EDIT: Also, a running gag of Zevran not wanting Jeanne to touch his poisons. Ever. He put too much effort into distilling them for some saint to touch them and render them useless!

[SeiKeo]

Oh man you and your good ideas. I swear I am saving half the posts you make on this topic.

[Hymn of Ragnarok]

Glad to hear you like them. I actually still have a few in the tank right now, but I should be working right now. I'll come back online tonight or tomorrow to consider them further and post them.

Also, made an edit to the last post for a running gag between Jeanne and Zevran. Just in case you missed it if you made a copy of that idea.

[Hymn of Ragnarok]

Right, my next idea was the development of friendship between Jeanne and Sten. Sten has dialogue where he says women have no place on the battlefield, so Jeanne clearly is in an uphill battle to gain his respect. I think her biggest opportunity to make a breakthrough concerns Sten's sword Asala. Even if Jeanne could not plausibly get into Sten's good graces, Revelation could ensure she still comes into possession of the sword, and returns with it to camp. Another Revelation makes her approach Sten with the blade. Getting Sten to tell her about his sword is more plausible, but plausibility is not necessarily the desired route.

In canon he wonders if the Warden is an ashkaari. According to the wikia, an ashkaari is one who has attained enlightenment. Jeanne could easily make a case for being an ashkaari, despite not being a qunari and being a woman. Sten may not believe that she is the reincarnation of Andraste, but he may be persuaded that she is some sort of spiritual being. Qunari religion is tricky for me, it's been a while and the wikia only explains so much. If Jeanne can explain her role is to redeem or reform the world or defeat the Darkspawn, then Sten might have an easier time fitting her into his worldview. I think that's the hardest part. A mortal Grey Warden? Fairly easy to categorize. A superhuman combatant that exemplifies the traits of the local religion's Messiah, denies the connection, but still achieves miraculous results? I feel that Sten would not be comfortable opening up to Jeanne until he had a handle on her and how to view her. Especially if the wikia is accurate to Qunari relations and trade being opportunities to size up the opposition. No way is Sten revealing his vulnerabilities to someone he cannot understand, though this may be mitigated if he comes to trust Jeanne regardless.

There's also friction because Sten, more than any other party member, is suspicious of the Warden's ability to subdue the Blight and the Archdemon. Part of the reason his squad came to Fereldan is to assess the Blight and the Grey Wardens' ability to defeat it. He would confront Jeanne and outright ask how she plans to defeat the Archdemon as he does in canon. Will she stab it until it dies? (Insert obligatory will it die if it is killed line) While telling people to have faith may suffice for the other party members, or make them plain give up in frustration, Sten is considerably more patient and focused. He would likely push the issue until satisfied with Jeanne's answer or convinced of her incompetence. Jeanne may be willing to tell Sten that she does, in fact, have a technique that she is certain will kill the Archdemon, but it will cost Jeanne her life without fail. That fact alone may convince Sten to put some faith in her.

Now, if Jeanne can be persuaded to reveal the details of her NP, that her burning at the stake in life is manifested as a sword and that her sword actually is Jeanne, they have another way to relate to each other. Sten considers Asala to be part of him, and Jeanne's NP is very much a part of her even if using it assures her death. There can definitely bond over their respective weapons, and Sten confessing that he would like to see Jeanne with her sword in hand. Her legend is famous for her deeds and death, and she would be most magnificent in the moment she unleashes the truest expression of her existence.

It really does depend on how freely Jeanne would divulge information about herself and her capabilities. Anyone have any thoughts? This particular relationship seems more nuanced than any other.

[Ergast]

I approve of this. It's not enough to make me want a read a whole Sakura centric story for fun, but it's enough provoke my interest and give it a chance. If it fleshed out her character in a fashion I liked I'd be further intrigued. It's just a matter of believably justifying it, make Sakura aware that she could be slipping, and have her willingly risking her sanity to fully utilize the advantages it gives her.

...

Dammit, here it goes one of my ideas for a posible crossover between FSN and DA:O.

And about characters of the nasuverse in Ferelden... While Servants and high tier characters are obiously way stronger than anything in DA, the powerful human characters (or most of them) are actually at the same power levels that endgame characters from DAO. Morrigan can summon tempests and storms with a certain ease, the Grey Warden (usually, a human warrior) can take head on Dragons, that are suposedly elder gods, with a normal sword, etc. I give end of route Shirou a level between 15 and 25 depending of the route (although HF!Shirou can be even higher, taking into account the sheer amount of raw power he can display momentarily at the cost of his mind)

Aoko could make a pretty interesting Andraste reborn...

Aoko is precisely the one I was thinking when I added an exception about the human characters being around the endgame levels of power. She would be insane in Thedas.

Hmm. I feel like playing to too straight takes away the element of a fish out of water, which is one of the traits of Grail Works that I really like. Jeanne would slip into the role way too easily. Still, Lelianna fangirling over Jeanne would be damn funny. Ciel could work though.

...

IMMA STEALING THIS IDEA (That's it, if I end writing the fic, and I mean the Ciel part, of course. Servants are OP)

Okay, so, question is does just Jeanne get dropped in, or does she have support from other members?

For shit and giggles, drop her a la Terminator. Yep, even the nude part. She shouldn't need anything more to curbstomp anything in her path *laughts*

*blinks* Rin cooks? Huh - I didn't know.

Yep, and she is the best in FSN when it comes to chinese *probably failing to see the joke, but...*

GRail Work go To Fire Emblem Radiant Dawn cuase Sothe died in path of Radiance, Shirou and Tohno Shiki are sent with Saber. Recruitable Targets Ike. Dude Waht would happen.

Do you mean army sweeper Ike? The most powerful Beorc unit ever? I approve

[Larekko12]

Oh My idea for internal Irony. Grail Works gets called to the Resident Evil Verse. Missiion kill the idiots in the very first game.

[fallenblades643]

If they went to the RE verse it would be an exturminatus style mission. They would have to kill all forms of(zombie and raider)life in the world.
Fallout would be a good place for some recruiting though.

[Larekko12]

Borderlands. Go save the unvierse. Make Loads of money. Get tech Savvy. Find Recruits. Learn the value of a good Np wanna be Gun.

[Hymn of Ragnarok]

For shit and giggles, drop her a la Terminator. Yep, even the nude part. She shouldn't need anything more to curbstomp anything in her path *laughts*

It'd be hard to justify Jeanne showing up nude, even if the Naked Hello is a good tone to start the story off with.

This does raise an important question though: when should Jeanne show up? If we follow canon, Duncan is the one who should find her. Her appearing naked wold play well to a scene in my mind. Upon lending her a blade for self defense, she more or less slaughters darkspawn with casual ease. Nothing too obviously out of place, but Duncan is an experienced warrior. He would realize that she is utterly unafraid, very much unlike a civilian or even normal warrior. That may be enough for him to extend the offer. He's recruited from the gallows in canon. If anything, the only reason I think he'd be hesitant to extend the offer is that he wants this stranger to know a life that isn't that of a Grey Warden, at least before making a decision.

...Huh, there's an idea. Jeanne is Duncan's unofficial partner before the events of the game kick off, at least in part because she won't stop following him. It would give her a stronger reputation, which could be helpful. Plus you get to add in rumors of the two beings lovers. This may not be very desirable, depending on how quickly Jeanne should be hailed as Andraste. It is a useful scenario for the rumor mill to chew on though. Might make more since for Alistair to immediately defer to Jeanne as well.

As for the scene I mentioned, I'm imagining Duncan finding Jeanne in the nude, and when people start believing that Jeanne may well be Andraste, Morrigan starts to insinuate that the Maker struck Duncan down for gazing upon his bride with lustful eyes. That starts yet another row between Morrigan and Alistair that Jeanne has to break up. If Jeanne claims that she never had relations with Duncan, or insinuate that she has no desire for the male sex, Leliana can get more fuel for her fantasies.

Next part is in spoilers because...well, while it'd be a twist, it comes so early that I'm not sure if there's a point in keeping it a secret when it could promote discussion. Still, I'm hiding it in case people would prefer a surprise.

Spoiler Thoughts

Now, if we deviate from canon from the very start, I wonder when would be best. If Duncan were a mage I'd suggest him personally stumbling upon Grail Works, and if we used a Mage Origin Grey Warden we could have him/her accidentally finding Grail Works during their Harrowing. Or, I suppose any mage or demon finding Grail Works could be a start. But if Jeanne is sent there without a contact, then I rather like the idea of her charging headfirst into the battle at Ostagar and, while not saving the day, certainly saving quite a few people (including Duncan). I'd say not Cailan, but the point of Grail Works is to save everybody. Him living completely alters the plot though. Duncan surviving doesn't help all that much in the big picture, even if his reputation does make life much more convenient. Plus, Jeanne saving him at Ostagar means she doesn't necessarily become a Grey Warden.

Honestly, if she's going to make an impression of a heaven sent angel, slaughtering darkspawn, being immune to the taint, and curing the survivors is a pretty damn strong impression. The problem is that what kicks of the DA:O plot is a tragedy and it would be well within Jeanne's power to prevent it. Maybe Cailan survives, Loghain deems him an imposter, and sparks a real civil war? Cailan going through hero worship for Jeanne is rather appealing, especially if with Loghain's betrayal he starts to consider her a potential bride.

The more I think about this, the more I think Jeanne saving the day at Ostagar despite Loghain's efforts is the right way to start the story regardless of how she's initially introduced. It's the tone appropriate to Grail Works. There are still ways to split the party and cause trouble. Revelation is an easy way to make the story work however the author(s) desire. Jeanne goes to the Arl while Duncan appeals to the Circle? Now Jeanne has additional reason to rush to the Tower where people not effectively immune to magic are, so she can save the day and get the help she needs. Say she can't completely exorcise the demon because the desire demon was let in with the blessings on the Arl's son, even though Jeanne is capable of suppressing the demon. Things like that.

[Megaolix]

Hold it right there Hymn.

Loghain

I'm having a problem with you saying 'Jeanne saving the day at Ostagar despite Loghain's efforts'.

Loghain didn't leave to try to take the throne: he left because he deemed the battle lost or at least not possible to win without losing most of the army to it. After all, the torch did take far more time than the agreed moment to light up. He refused to commit more lives to Cailan's folly because he believed the darkspawn could be ended like any army: with might and tactics.

Yes, he could have tried to go in and out to see if the King was alive. Yes, his plots after created problems. But as Alistair say it in the game: he's doing what -he- believes is the best for his country. While Cailan was the son of his best friend (and why he would not actively try to kill him, since he would probably have managed that long ago), he would not sacrifice the whole army to try to save him from an hopeless battle.

[Larekko12]

I agree with Mega.

[Hymn of Ragnarok]

Hold it right there Hymn.

Fair Point

I misspoke. My phrasing does not accurately depict his character.

That said, we would have to justify Jeanne not arriving in time, her not lighting the Tower quickly enough, or her contributions not being apparent from Loghain's position (that last one's very difficult, Jeanne's arsenal has nothing like Excalibur). Also, we'd need to either have him submit to Cailan's judgement or have a motivation to defy Cailan and keep the plot closer to canon. I'm not entirely sure Loghain wouldn't commit himself to seizing the crown even after a genuine mistake. If he believes Cailan really is better off dead to preserve the country, I think he'd do it. Loghain's prestige and influence would be drastically reduced if he lets the truth out. Word of Jeanne's prowess would probably only strengthen his resolve, because trusting in the glory and legends is exactly why he was unhappy with Cailan to begin with. If Jeanne makes a name for herself, he's going to assume her contributions were exaggerated and fear that Cailan putting his trust in her is even worse than faith in the legends of the Grey Wardens.

On the note of Jeanne not arriving in time, perhaps she is sent to the world after the battle has started, and Revelation is unable to fully salvage the situation? Minor crisis of faith when she is apparently unable to fulfill the spirit of her mission from Grail Works? That would be especially apparent if she was in position to act but failed to produce the most desirable outcome.