I mean, personalities aside I don't think Kerry would approve of his adopted son banging his biological daughter, no.Originally Posted by Alfredo845
I mean, personalities aside I don't think Kerry would approve of his adopted son banging his biological daughter, no.
I might be crazy but the way I always saw it was that Urobuchi was attempting to show Iskandar's thirst for conquering as an influence on Waver to be more adventurous and take more risks in his life, which explains to me why he would never focus on the downsides. It might be cheap but it really is meant to (imo) just be interpreted as "Oh, that wacky Iskandar!" like Reign jokingly said. Not the very classiest way of going about it for anyone that sits down and really tries to think about it, but it's obvious the intention Urobuchi was going for did land for the average masses.
I just said that not too long ago.
The average masses and Waver himself too I guess.
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Oh, my bad. I thought you were intending it to be negative. Like "be inspired by a bloodthirsty conquering murderer", I guess the tone went over my head in text.
There are some Elder Scrolls fans who consider Tiber Septim to be a successful Alexander the Great, and barring a few salty high elves, most consider his unification of Tamriel to be a good thing. From straight up worship, like the Nords, to more pragmatic business opportunities, like the dark elves. The main reason for this is probably due to his extremely laissez-faire imperial system. So much so that all the imperial provinces could act like nearly (pay taxes and don't attack other provinces) independent kingdoms. One extreme example is that while the Empire denounces slavery in the strongest possible terms, they make no real attempts to abolish it, should one of the provinces (Morrowind) insist on having it. In that same vein, wasn't Alexander's governance similar in that he was so focused on the next move east that he basically let every nation he conquered continue doing their own things after he left? What can this be called but art in motion?
Iskandar was more an ideal than a person to Waver, especially when he was young, and if I'm not mistaken, part of Case Files is about him growing up and wishing to stand alongside him as an actual friend. It would be interesting to see adult Waver and Iskandar interact with Waver's older, more world-wise eyes, but alas, TM doesn't want to tell that story.
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And here we go again.
Just explaining to why such a man would be considered good, both in his time and modern times, but of course, you can't see beyond your own narrow vision of morality.
Vol 1 Waver: He's a dumbass with an idiotic wish
"Th, that's stupid! The world, I don't..."
Choking until then, Waver suddenly remembers the necessity of keeping his dignity.
"Conquering the world― Fuh, I have no interest in such a vulgar goal!"
"Hoh?"Vol 3 Waver: A dumbass but at least he's better than the phoniesThat was the one book Rider looted from the library he raided right when he arrived in the present world. The 'Iliad' written by the poet Homer in ancient Greece― the epic poem describing the Trojan war, in which fought gods and humans jumbled together.
The atlas was understandable. Bragging about world conquest, Rider's interest in the geography of the modern world, was idiotic but not surprising.
“Say, kid, you don’t need to be so eager, right? No matter what, this War of the Holy Grail wouldn’t count as the climax of your life, right?”
“What –!”
Isn’t this ritual the miracle of a lifetime? – Waver, who was about to open his mouth and rebuke, suddenly understood Alexander’s meaning. For this King of Conquerors, the Holy Grail is only a method to make him appear in this world again. His true goal is the conquest the entire, wide-spanning world after the War of the Holy Grail.
“If you really wish to pursue a life full of glory and dreams, then go and fight for yourself. It wouldn’t be too late to find a battlefield made for you after all that.”
“…”
In front of the miracle that was hailed as being able to grant all wishes, this guy’s wish happened to be just obtaining a human body – just how foolish does this action sound?
However, there is nothing wrong with this wish when it comes to someone who thinks his own value is higher than that of the Holy Grail.
Just what kind of a person is this guy, who is so arrogant and confident about his might?
It was with such questions that Waver purposefully checked up on the historical records. However, the more he knew about the glorious accomplishments the history texts listed about this man, the more profoundly he felt that –
This man merely possessed a charisma that was overwhelming and incomparable with other mortals – so great was it that even those majestic and elite armies who worshiped him, believed in him like a god, and could even give their lives to him.
At the end, Waver had to admit – those who mocked the King of Conquerors’s wish as a boring wish are the foolish ones who merely dragged their bodies along from day to day, and spend their life away on nothing.
Last edited by You; November 20th, 2021 at 08:19 PM.
Though abandoned, forgotten, and scorned as out-of-date dolls, they continue to carry out their mission, unchanged from the time they were designed.
Machines do not lose their worth when a newer model appears.
Their worth (life) ends when humans can no longer bear that purity.
There's also the thing that Iskander said to Altera in Extella, that Altera was simply a machine designed to destroy, rather than one who enjoyed conquest, like he did. In other words, he was also there encouraging her to not only live life to the fullest but also to enjoy every minute of it.
As for the Grail, hey, Nobu wanted to turn it into a WMD. I would have preferred that she use it to mention a Biblically accurate angel... To use as a WMD because Kujaku-Ou is better than it has any business being.
You know that's not what I meant. Besides, we've been over why I find your pseudo-relativism a goddamn pain, and I don't want to have to litigate this again, even as you toe the line.
I was mostly referring to the barely relevant tangent with a long video embedded, anyway.
Pain or not is irrelevant, assuming that I can discuss something as relevant to Type-Moon... Which is deliciously full of examples. For example, Vlov is chaotic good.
Did they really give alignments for tsukihime R characteres
FFS...
I mean, Vlov isn't strictly evil, despite being a vampire who thinks nothing of draining people for blood and heat. Makes you wonder how evil most of the DAAs are. I personally think most of them are fairly evil, especially if they are all involved in Roa's ritual or the Aylesbury Valesti.
Oh, yes. Like I said, delicious.
I note that mandatory fatal feedings and sun damage are "older-style" vampire weaknesses, while currently, in most vampire stories, feedings do not have to be fatal at all, and sun damage is reduced to, at most, solar debilitation.Also, going by Melty Blood, most of Vlov's more erratic actions have been due to him frenzying, as opposed to the more methodical killings of Roa.Spoiler:
Last edited by LegalLoliLover; November 21st, 2021 at 10:14 AM.
To be fair, this is the novel where you know Irisviel and Maiya are diehard for Kiritsugu, but one was totally on board for being a tool to be used and thrown away, and the other thought she did, but didn't understand his ideals at all(which is why the Angra Iri is implied to partially be her feelings iirc for her reaction to shooting Ilya).
So it depends, in FGO, Waver implies that he's okay being the follower of a warlord and has moments of exhilaration for battle, so he might be okay with the ideals of conquest, primarily due to liking the person he followed.
Is it even possible for Servants to go around conquering the world without being policed by the Counter-Force? Isn't there some sort of rule for Heroic Spirits that goes like "the dead cannot interfere with the living" or something? Maybe Waver wasn't really that concerned about Iskandar knowing this.
Once he's fully incarnated, is he really a Servant anymore? Not quite, so even if that is how it works, it probably wouldn't matter to Iskandar.
Honestly I feel incarnation is a big hole if the CF ignores it
Then again the CF has to be useless for most plots to happen...
Even Gilgamesh after being incarnated, for all his megalomaniac ego, had to stay low and went hikikkomori. I'd assume they're still treated the same way as usual by the CF.
Wasnt that so he could "see" or "understand" the modern era or something.
Honestly FSN gil still feels incongruous even for all they try to fix him
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