But that has nothing to do with Comun's line about "raising Angra Mainyu properly", right?
Originally Posted by Comun
But that has nothing to do with Comun's line about "raising Angra Mainyu properly", right?
That is not how I ever interpreted it. But it sounds interesting.
What he says in the game though points to seeing himself in AM and wanting to know if something as as pure evil it would feel remorse, and thus whether he should for his own actions as well.
Similar end game, no raising.
He never sleeps. He never dies.
Battle doesn't need a purpose; the battle is its own purpose. You don't ask why a plague spreads or a field burns. Don't ask why I fight.
A true pity that Kotomine didn't read any Stirner. Especially given that, an entity like Angra Mainyu is powerful enough to avoid that 2 hunters example that I provided earlier. According to the conception of Stirner, the good is that which pleases him, and evil is what he detests. That which wounds your sympathy is evil for you, so that, while denying absolutely any value whatsoever in morals imposed from outside, we find impossible to deny the existence of good and evil. Given that, the only question is whether Angra Mainyu's immediate actions please him or fill him with disgust, not the remorse that follows because, assuming that he is powerful enough not to need the aforementioned "hunting partners", that remorse would not be there at all. This also begs the question of whether or not a fully formed Angra Mainyu would be able to make fully sentient decisions when doing his deeds or if it is an automatic process.
Okay, what the fuck is a spook? Because all I'm getting form this is LVL likes to go around in a bedsheet talking about how emotion is meaningless.
Binged All Of Gundam In 4 Years, 1 Week and All I Got Was This Stupid Mask
FF XIV: Walked to the End
Started Legend of the Galactic Heroes (14/07/23), pray for me.
All you've gotten is all there is to get.
Call me 想φαγω.
Spoiler:
Sometimes reading discussions like this just makes me content that I'm an emotional thinker.
A spook is a concept which you hold to have intrinsic value and subordinate your own desires to. Or you could just do some very cursory research into Max Stirner.
Depends. Are those emotions based on what you yourself truly feel, or is it based on spooks, such as God, property, Man, Human, Reason, community, money, the people, love, worker, race, state, morality, etc.?
Sounds like emotion to me.
But here's the important part:
Last edited by LegalLoliLover; March 3rd, 2022 at 08:43 PM.
The instant you establish there's some good and evil, even if it's sheerly in self interest or what provokes sympathy or disgust, you open the door to that leading to more sophisticated conceptions of good and evil built on greater things.
But the fact AM is powerful enough to disregard everything else is precisely why Kotomine wants to see how AM reacts. AM's reaction will be pure and true. If something that's pure evil and designed to create nothing but evil, if even that detests its own evil actions, it proves it was evil and Kotomine knows he was wrong to indulge in it even though he enjoyed it (just like AM). But if AM saw nothing wrong with it because it was just following its own nature, just like how a cheetah eats a gazelle, then Kotomine did nothing wrong. Or to put it another way, he never had a chance to succeed at being "good" and can at least not blame himself for what he does, any more than you'd blame a lion for eating a gazelle.
Kootomine's using AM as a proxy for objective truth. It's the closest he can get to just calling up God on the phone and asking, "why."
He never sleeps. He never dies.
Battle doesn't need a purpose; the battle is its own purpose. You don't ask why a plague spreads or a field burns. Don't ask why I fight.
So yes, AM would not feel disgust at his immediate actions and would not have the need to feel remorse, like that hunter in the example losing his partner, after the fact. Therefore, he cannot be evil.
Edit: Upon further reflection, I think that regret might be a better word than remorse, but semantics.
Last edited by LegalLoliLover; March 3rd, 2022 at 09:09 PM.
Was it ever stated that AM would feel that way? Where?
Would or wouldn't? Like I said, he wouldn't feel regret because he's powerful enough not to need others. Therefore, the only variable is whether he feels pleasure or detests his actions. However, if he has absolute control over his own actions, if he detests those actions, there would no good reason to assume that he would do them, anyway.
Read hollow ataraxia.
Well, is the HA Angra Mainyu the fully formed one, given the influence of both Shirou and the regular guy who was sacrificed to "make" Angra Mainyu to begin with? That's why I clarified "fully formed".
Wow, this might be the most "1st year philosphy major trying to sound edgy" thing I've ever heard. Are you sure it's not just a Swift style parody? Because that's the funniest shit I've read in a while.
Binged All Of Gundam In 4 Years, 1 Week and All I Got Was This Stupid Mask
FF XIV: Walked to the End
Started Legend of the Galactic Heroes (14/07/23), pray for me.
You have to wonder what isn't a spook at that point
Oh, then why do you briefly explain Stirner?
Self-interest. Which is the fucking point. The divine is God's concern; the human, man's. My concern is neither the divine nor the human, not the true, good, just, free, etc., but solely what is 'mine,' and it is not a general one, but is - 'unique,' as I am unique. Nothing is more to me than myself!
Do you recognize who you're quoting? That's literally all his posts. Except even "1st year philosophy major" is pushing it.
You don't know that. You're only projecting what a normal human would think onto it, but the whole point is its so beyond us that it's only through it we could know.
If Kotomine could have figured it out by just reading philosophy he would have done that already after searching high and low for years.
He's like the mirror of Kiritsugu: someone who's desperation at not reaching a dream has driven him to rely on a miracle (grail).
He never sleeps. He never dies.
Battle doesn't need a purpose; the battle is its own purpose. You don't ask why a plague spreads or a field burns. Don't ask why I fight.
Again:
Easy to criticize. Hard to actually answer, huh? "Let's just do ad hominems because we have no real response." Good job. Truly.
I did minor in philosophy, by the way.
The fully-formed AM would be where he managed to fuse with Sakura in hypothetical HF scenario; Beast of Retribution. Then it might be more of autonomous response.
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