Random Thoughts Thread

[Spinach]

Being religious and not wanting to sign gay fanart is whatever. It's the kind of stuff that should just be laughed off.

[Mattias]

I always find it worse when the person is hyper religious. People like Weinstein and Moonves are dirtbags, but every time it's a Cardinal or hardline conservative it comes with the added layer of hypocrisy on top.

[Spinach]

Better to laugh at them for being clowns than to hold being religious against them honestly.

[Deathhappens]

And that's the kind of attitude I don't agree with. Understand, first and foremost, I don't give a rat's ass about Mignogna and whether he really is a major creep or not (and including here I've heard about as many stories painting him as an angel as horror stories making him a rampaging pedophile). I really don't. What I DO care about is this ridiculous #metoo movement enabling and encouraging the social lynching of pretty much anyone solely on the basis of mob rule: "If so many people say it, surely it must be true!" Bam, no trial, no FAIR AND EQUAL chance to defend oneself (because good luck being one person standing against the mob, even if you have a PR department-and while Mignogna probably has one, not everyone thus targeted does), skip straight to the execution. Innocent until proven guilty beyond all reasonable doubt is the cornerstone of the modern justice system. Those people just now stepping up to add fuel to the fire, and ESPECIALLY the ones bringing up "evidence" years late, in the best case scenario where they speak the absolute truth? They're accomplices to the crime for not having spoken up until now, same as if they covered up any other crime. And don't give me the "lol the justice system doesn't work he would have gotten away anyway" shit either: It's not perfect, but it's not going to be able to do its job if you don't give it the evidence it needs to function. And if you really distrust it so much, well bad news for you, you might as well quit the country because if the courts don't work then literally nothing else does.

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Really, this entire campaign is a freaking social assassination weapon ready to be targeted at anyone with minimal preparations. Even if it didn't start like that, I have a bridge to sell you if you think it won't be. Not targeted at nobodies like Vic, of course.

[Nikiri]

i cannot quit the country

[Zurvan]

Really, this entire campaign is a freaking social assassination weapon ready to be targeted at anyone with minimal preparations.

Implying it hasn't already been used like that

[AAM1232]

I'm not seeing where innocence until proven guilty is a thing in personal opinions or company/org thoughts. Like it or not, people aren't going to think well of you when they hear of this kind of shit, at which point they have the rights to ignore/not associate with you anymore. And good job at also jumping straight to victim blaming, like most Weinstein/Cosby defenders, as if this is something that anyone can say so easily.

[Deathhappens]

I'm not seeing where innocence until proven guilty is a thing in personal opinions or company/org thoughts. Like it or not, people aren't going to think well of you when they hear of this kind of shit, at which point they have the rights to ignore/not associate with you anymore.

Yes,and that is a problem. That is what makes such weapons so terrifying, because there is no defense against rumor but denial and denial only makes you look guiltier.

And good job at also jumping straight to victim blaming, like most Weinstein/Cosby defenders, as if this is something that anyone can say so easily.

Nobody said it's easy. Risking your life outing a serial killer isn't easy. It's neccesary.

[AAM1232]

Yes,and that is a problem. That is what makes such weapons so terrifying, because there is no defense against rumor but denial and denial only makes you look guiltier.



Nobody said it's easy. Risking your life outing a serial killer isn't easy. It's neccesary.

There is the truth, which takes time to determine and which people are not beholden to right from the start. And acting as if rumors are baseless and this was all unwarranted lies is pretty unfair to the accusers. This was thrown at Weinstein accusers, at Cosby accusers and look who ultimately prevailed. Maybe wait a minute before trying to white knight for Vic.

You are acting like it is by saying that this should've been settled a long time ago but was delayed for a variety of reasons you don't seem to care about just to pretend like this is some grave injustice.

[Laserman]

Yes,and that is a problem. That is what makes such weapons so terrifying, because there is no defense against rumor but denial and denial only makes you look guiltier.



Nobody said it's easy. Risking your life outing a serial killer isn't easy. It's neccesary.

You do understand that voice actors that he worked with are accusing him too, right?

[weeblord]

Yeah if this was just some crazy twitter activist lady & her followers I’d be sceptic too, but when this has been a thing for a decade and like Laserman said his coworkers are also accusing him... not a good look.

[Deathhappens]

You do understand that I'm not talking about Vic Mignogna here, right?

[AAM1232]

You do understand that I'm not talking about Vic Mignogna here, right?

And I'm pointing out how taking the attitude of innocence until proven guilty is pretentious in the face of a lot of evidence that doesn't need the law to be judged by people. I'm still not seeing where we should be caring for him and simlar others over the accusers in these situations regarding their careers.

[SpoonyViking]

Plus, "people having their lives destroyed by false rape accusations" is basically a bogeyman. The FBI puts the number of false rape accusations (that is, accusations which were investigated by the law and then found to be false) at around 8%; there's research which shows the number to be even lower.

[Deathhappens]

And I'm pointing out how taking the attitude of innocence until proven guilty is pretentious in the face of a lot of evidence that doesn't need the law to be judged by people. I'm still not seeing where we should be caring for him and simlar others over the accusers in these situations regarding their careers.

Are you legitimately stupid enough to not realise what you're saying is "we don't need courts or due procedure, mob judgement is sufficient", or do you realise it and yet say it anyway? Because that is some legit neoanarchocommunist shit, I gotta respect that.

Plus, "people having their lives destroyed by false rape accusations" is basically a bogeyman. The FBI puts the number of false rape accusations (that is, accusations which were investigated by the law and then found to be false) at around 8%; there's research which shows the number to be even lower.

The evils of Statistic at work: The number cited is low because most of these alleged cases are never investigated at all unless sufficient evidence already exists. Unfortunately it hardly needs to get to that stage to ruin someone's life.

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Also, again, Statistics: 8% might seem low until you realise that might add up to hundreds or thousands of cases. And it's not like these people's reputation will be magically restored because a later investigation found them innocent.

As they say in my parts: "Better to lose an eye than your good name".

[AAM1232]

Are you legitimately stupid enough to not realise what you're saying is "we don't need courts or due procedure, mob judgement is sufficient", or do you realise it and yet say it anyway? Because that is some legit neoanarchocommunist shit, I gotta respect that.




The evils of Statistic at work: The number cited is low because most of these alleged cases are never investigated at all unless sufficient evidence already exists. Unfortunately it hardly needs to get to that stage to ruin someone's life.

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Also, again, Statistics: 8% might seem low until you realise that might add up to hundreds or thousands of cases. And it's not like these people's reputation will be magically restored because a later investigation found them innocent.

As they say in my parts: "Better to lose an eye than your good name".

Really? Calling me stupid for pointing out that personal/company opinions (the so-called "mob judgement" you want to twist it to) based off present evidence is enough to judge a person? Especially when people actually care about first impressions enough to judge people off it, especially in any job interview and companies wanting to be considered respectable?

The law isn't a factor here regarding no longer employing or associating with toxic people, that's up to the company and people.

Like I don't need much beyond this exchange to consider you as pretentious when you've been subtly white knighting for the "unlucky" accused.

Right, stats bullshit. Meanwhile when these people who accuse complain about their ruined lives due to the incident, you don't seem to care at all.

[AsGryffynn]

And I'm pointing out how taking the attitude of innocence until proven guilty is pretentious in the face of a lot of evidence that doesn't need the law to be judged by people. I'm still not seeing where we should be caring for him and simlar others over the accusers in these situations regarding their careers.

Bollocks. People should be able to judge personality but not as a mob. Mobs have powers similar to the law, but are not beholden to it. At best, if something is debunked, very public apologies and offers to continue their relationship and even pay reparations for it should be mandated. This does zero wrong and ensures accusations cannot be used as bait or fuel for a personal feud, as doing so will have actual repercussions on a person. Sadly, I don't think you can sue a nameless mob. Should technology be available though (I, for one, welcome our new Totalitarian overlords), I'd love to see half of Twitter crowdfunding reparations for someone

Plus, "people having their lives destroyed by false rape accusations" is basically a bogeyman. The FBI puts the number of false rape accusations (that is, accusations which were investigated by the law and then found to be false) at around 8%; there's research which shows the number to be even lower.

"One death is a tragedy. A million is an statistic."

~ Joe V. Stalin

Any number into the high thousands as low as 1% is already a big deal to me... or anyone who's had the slightest probing of how law and human rights work.

But then again, I just saw this is about Vic and how someone has been under the ilogical impression he was ever the biggest thing around (he was big, but not that big) and I just woke up and... yup, that's enough BL for today.

[AAM1232]

People haven't gotten into a mob yet, despite DH making it look like that. The only ones who've taken action against Vic and "hurt" him are Rooster Teeth and Funimation by refusing to work with him any longer, and acting as if that is unjustified is dumb. Who wants to work with someone who has that sort of reputation (which most of the time is not baseless nonsense)?

[SpoonyViking]

Also, again, Statistics: 8% might seem low until you realise that might add up to hundreds or thousands of cases. And it's not like these people's reputation will be magically restored because a later investigation found them innocent.

Oh, please. Society at large tends to side with the abuser much, much more than with the victim. Hell, up until a few days ago, Bryan Singer was still set to direct the Red Sonja movie in spite of all the accusations (which have been going for years, by the way), and the company didn't even pull him out of the movie, they apparently froze production.

[Deathhappens]

Really? Calling me stupid for pointing out that personal/company opinions (the so-called "mob judgement" you want to twist it to) based off present evidence is enough to judge a person? Especially when people actually care about first impressions enough to judge people off it, especially in any job interview and companies wanting to be considered respectable?The law isn't a factor here regarding no longer employing or associating with toxic people, that's up to the company and people.Like I don't need much beyond this exchange to consider you as pretentious when you've been subtly white knighting for the "unlucky" accused.Right, stats bullshit. Meanwhile when these people who accuse complain about their ruined lives due to the incident, you don't seem to care at all.

Yeah, that's pretty much what I thought. Maybe substitute "stupid" for "wilfully blind", though it amounts to the same thing.

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Oh, please. Society at large tends to side with the abuser much, much more than with the victim. Hell, up until a few days ago, Bryan Singer was still set to direct the Red Sonja movie in spite of all the accusations (which have been going for years, by the way), and the company didn't even pull him out of the movie, they apparently froze production.

Just off the top of my head.
https://www.theguardian.com/film/201...metoo-comments

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Anyway, as I said earlier, I'm not going to discuss specific examples. Vic Mignogna is a creep, quote me if you want- I don't give a damn. What I'm trying to do is ring some alarm bells in how much people allow rumours unfounded or at least unconfirmed by any responsible entity, to sway their opinion on matters and people. It's not even just about #metoo and rape allegations, this is but the latest offshoot of a trend that gets more and more alarming in recent years.

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tl;dr utilise ur fucking critical thinking be people not sheeple