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Thread: Fate/strange fake (Free-Range Spoilers)

  1. #11521
    Certified Bazett Appreciator Armandoiskyu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bunhelier View Post
    I thought the theory about True Assassin being Rashid ad din Sinan is quite plausible too. I mean one of his skill is Shadow Lantern which is one of the story of Rashid is about a Lantern that goes down from the mountain and not to mention he left a message on paper to Saladin beside his bed which told Saladin to fk off from his mountain or else he will kill him. Guess what happen when Faldeus summon True Assassin? He got a message on paper from True Assassin.

    This also could explain why he has EX ranked PC because he is considered the best Hassan and the legend about Old Man of The Mountain too comes from him not the founder.
    This was my theory too, besides Rashid is contemporary with Richard who mentioned he and Saladin made a truce with Hassan to kill the DA during the crusade, there are too many references to him that if TAssassin wasn't him i'd be surprised

  2. #11522
    世はまさにパンテオン Comun's Avatar
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    Chapter 23: 5th morning - The age of gods and the modern age <Daybreak> (part 2)

    Outside the temple

    "What the... hell?"

    Jester Karture was astonished.

    He was standing in the forest, taking the form of an attractive young man. The same form he displayed in the police station.

    If his memory serves him right, this was just a forest back when he inspected the area before the Grail War.

    But the landscape now was completely different.

    A giant building resembling a small mountain appeared in the flatland forest.

    In front of it, there was a large gate colored with the bluest lapis-lazuli, and after the gate, there was a stone staircase leading to the level of the temple.

    Atop the staircase, there was a building designed to resemble the ruins of ancient Mesopotamia, and both sides of the top step of the ladder were decorated with gold and silver statues modeled after the Kokopelli dolls, American symbols that attract money and refinement.

    So far so good. The real issue is the sculpture placed further outside the building.

    The disturbingly-shaped object, presumably supposed to be a guardian statue, looked like a monster out of some East Asian fairytale.

    "Am I still inside their illusion...?"

    Hidden in the shade of the large trees, Jester inspected the temple.

    As much as the landscape he was seeing looked like a joke, he could feel it was unarguably real.

    That is because he knew the Prelatis' illusions wouldn't so easily be able to produce the inexhaustible divine aura filling this temple.

    "What's a temple like this doing here? It doesn't fit its surroundings... not aesthetically and much in less in power magnitude."

    Jester openly praised what he saw when Archer and Lancer clashed in the desert on the first day of the Grail War, but this time his impression was that he didn't want his beautiful Assassin to be part of this buffoonery.

    Looking at the designs and the objet d'art in isolation, one could see it being an art museum in the middle of an orient-themed event, but the very real divine aura engulfing the temple made it feel like a repulsive joke to the bloodsucker.

    (I felt this divine aura before... in front of the hospital, before Kuruoka swallowed everyone. The Prelatis weren't lying. There really is a Divine Spirit or someone really close to it outside town. Yeah, it can't be a Heroic Spirit. It's impossible to summon something this profoundly arcane within the framework of the Grail War. Then she's indeed an outsider to this... Like me.)

    Jester meant this in the sense that they're both non-humans. He was fully aware that the godly presence occupying the temple before him was leagues more noxiously rejecting of Human Order than he was.

    (Only Ancestors would be able to compete on an even level with this!)

    In his top condition, he could have done some level of damage.

    But now he had several parts of his body's foundation destroyed, on top of being abandoned by the Ancestor who served as his origin as a vampire.

    The hunter became the prey. The manipulator became the puppet.

    Jester couldn't hold back a pained smile.

    (Huhu, I sought the Grail because I couldn't stand the boredom, but I didn't see myself feeling fear here. If this sham god is also here for the ritual, I must admit I made a mistake. It was very dismissive of me to assume the Grail War was a mere human ritual.)

    A rare moment where Jester had an admirable thought in his heart.

    With caution beyond caution, Jester hid himself to his maximum capacity and waited for a chance to pollute the temple. Until...

    Raving Shadow Flash
    "Zabaniya".


    He heard a sound.

    A beautiful voice.

    A beloved voice.

    A fragrant voice instantly awakened Jester's mind from the bottom of the well.

    "UOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH!"

    With a delighted war cry, he jumped and twisted his body mid-air.

    Countless strands of hair turned into black blades passed through the space between his limbs.

    The blades of freshly washed hair swayed in their positions in an attempt to capture and dice Jester's body but Jester danced in the air, dodging them with movements that defied the laws of physics.

    "Wonderful! Gorgeous! Excellent! The world you rewrite is always more wholesome yet titillating! Your movements are the most beautiful and refined! Cutesy, that's the word! Truly, truly cutesy!"

    Jester danced to the lapis-lazuli gates of the temple, the word "stealth" completely deleted from his memory, and screamed, not for himself or for Assassin, but for the world to hear.

    "It's you! Just you! You're the one! You taught me the joys of life! You gave me everything I have! You pulled me out of the sands of despair! Nobody else but you!"

    "..."

    To show his words were worthless, the owner of that hair—the nameless Assassin—continued the barrage of hair blades.

    "You, beautiful zealot! Though I didn't think you'd follow me to such a dangerous place... a place filled with the power of a pagan god!", Jester proclaimed even louder as he dodged all attacks by the skin of his teeth.

    After his joyous yelling, Jester jumped to the top of a large tree.

    When his hand touched the trunk, the tree instantly transformed. It twisted, broke, and creaked until it became a giant wooden tentacle full of branches and leaves attacking Assassin.

    "...!"

    Assassin questioned where the supposedly debilitated vampire was taking all this power from.

    But Jester's reply would have been "it's the power of love", so she wouldn't get any elucidating answer if she asked.

    Jester's movement did in fact go beyond what the laws of the world permitted. He was noticeably losing chips of himself every time he forced his power to activate.

    The nameless Assassin kept her Noble Phantasm active, hitting the countless hair blades against the tree tentacle.

    While she did, Jester extended his hand to a new tree, making a new tentacle. The cycle continued until,

    "Silence!"



    A gallant voice reverbed when no one expected it, stopping Jester and Assassin.

    In the direction of the voice, the two saw a girl atop the temple staircase, standing before the inner entrance.

    Because the girl looked too young to be considered an adult, and because her western outfit clashed with the temple's decoration, she looked like the average tourist visiting ancient ruins.

    But her voice was loaded with some modicum of divine aura, allowing it to reach the ears of everyone in the area, despite the loud winds blowing around them.

    "This forest is the garden of the great goddess Ishtar. No further tumult will be allowed!"

    X X

    Snowfield Central Church

    "The signs of the land are clearly different.", mumbled Executor Hansa Cervantes of the Holy Church while he watched TV in the back room of his chapel.

    He had noticed yesterday that the west side of the land was altered and that change was spreading, but he interpreted it as just circuits being replaced, and now was the moment when the switch was flipped.

    The turning point he's thinking about was Ishtar naming Haruri head priestess, but from the church, Hansa had no way of knowing that.

    Hansa generally used only the Sisters, but this time he was using all of the Church's contacts in the city to gather information.

    He was ready to look for Jester Karture the moment he returned from the dream world, but immediately after it happened, he heard witness reports that Flat Escardos was shot, and that his corpse got up and killed all snipers.

    "Flat Escardos... Not a bad man, for a mage... Considering he caught an Ancestor's attention, the thing inside him could be pretty much anything."

    They only knew each for 1 day, but he quite liked the young oddball mage. With this in mind, Hansa silently crossed himself.

    (If he revived as a Dead Apostle, I should be the one to purify his soul. It's the least I can do.)

    "Still... The way things are, I can't convincingly guarantee the safety of the Holy Grail War losers when they come here."

    Large parts of the chapel's roof collapsed in the battle between Saber and Archer, and the only thing done to fix it was slapping NO ENTRY tape.

    After some pulled strings, the priest normally in charge of this church was called to Las Vegas, where Hansa's teacher was. Hansa knew he would fall to his knees when he got back.

    "If he still has a city to come back to, that is."

    Hansa Cervantes received a message from the Holy Church saying the city was at risk of being erased.

    Considering one of the functions of the Holy Church is to clean up cities destroyed by Dead Apostles, the possibility of the Grail War masterminds wiping out the city with 800 thousand of people in it felt normal to them.

    "Someone in the upper echelon of the public side of society thinks the Holy Church way" is what they'd think.

    The lack of clearer information meant the process they'd carry out would not be public knowledge.

    The TV screen before him showed looping satellite footage of the water of the river next to the White House exploding into an upward coil and the North Pole ice cap missing a perfectly spherical chunk. It made sense that the masterminds would want to erase the city.

    "Though it looks like that hurricane will uproot the city before they do."

    Even Hansa, who is relatively uneducated compared to a mage, could feel the powerful presence approaching from the west.

    Most mages in town were in a panic because they didn't know what the hurricane was but could tell it was a magical storm containing extraordinary amounts of mana.

    Magecraft can make thunderclouds and cyclones, but something capable of freely manipulating a storm that giant is closer to magic than to average magecraft.

    According to the Holy Grail War data in the Assembly of the Eight Sacrament's intelligence department, Fuyuki's Grail Wars also caused a disaster beyond what could come from a duel between Heroic Spirits.

    He hears there was a huge ruckus on all levels of the Holy Church hierarchy when a giant demonic beast appeared in the river and fighter jets started dropping like flies. Add that to the collapsed hotel and the great fire that came immediately after the end of the ritual, and the typhoon destroying everything becomes preferable for how much easier to write off it is.

    Hansa received a directive ordering him to stay away from the city and then sneak back in for the clean-up after everything was over.

    He intentionally didn't read it.

    (I wish could make unemotional life choices like my teach. Unfortunately, Mr. Dilo's influence is not that easy to shake off.)

    Hansa had 3 people he considered to be his parents. The mother who raised him in the mountains; Bishop Dilo, who took him out of the mountains; and Delmio, who trained him as an Executor.

    Hansa was taken out of a quite unique environment in the mountains and taught the common man's virtues. After all his Executor training, those virtues remained in him, even if twisted into a bizarre form.

    This is why he remained in the city, and in this church.

    Since the Sisters were with him, he had everything packed to leave if the situation called for it, but he stayed there, believing he'd need to be present down to the last second to hear the voices of those asking for protection.

    It's also possible his light-hearted interactions with, and subsequent loss of Flat Escardos had some effect on him.

    Hansa tried to come up with a plan to deal with the western forest, drinking coffee mixed with jolokia powder to dispel the softer side of his heart. But these thoughts were interrupted by

    "Hansa, we have a visitor. She's waiting outside."

    One of the Sisters in his Quartet came back and reported to him.

    "A Master!?"

    (I can only see it being Saber's Master. Despite her abnormal amount of magical energy, she didn't seem to be a mage.)

    Considering the situation, she could ask for protection even if Saber was not dropping out of the competition.

    But despite Hansa's speculation,

    the Sister delivered an answer he would never have guessed.

    "Yes. She says she's Rider's Master."

    "Say what?"

    (Rider... the mounted Heroic Spirit? It can't be Kuruoka Tsubaki. Then that leaves... that one other Heroic Spirit... the one that isn't Pale Rider?)

    Hansa was the overseer, but he wasn't a Master, so he wasn't even sure if Pale Rider was a Rider.

    Seeing how Hansa was full of questions, the Sister dispassionately continued.

    Her words left Hansa wondering what took her so long.

    "She says she wants to announce her participation in the Holy Grail War to the overseer."

    X X

    West Snowfield, in front of Ishtar's temple

    "These grounds are blessed by the radiant goddess under the name of Neo Ishtar Temple. Her Holiness welcomes those from different doctrines or species with open arms, so if you're here for pilgrimage, be quiet and stand in line."

    The woman spoke like a tour guide for ruins or an art museum, provoking indecision in both Jester and Assassin.

    Though that indecision lasted but an instant.

    Jester leaped the instant he felt sure the woman's presence was too faint for her to be the Divine Spirit the Prelatis told him about.

    No one knows if his plan was to drink her blood to recover himself, to keep her a hostage against Assassin, or something else entirely.

    Because, whatever his goal was, it was clearly beyond his reach.



    Countless blue bullets appeared from behind the woman and pierced Jester's body.

    "Gh...!?"

    Jester assumed that even in his weakened state, he'd be able to shrug off any impromptu magecraft, so he was caught off-guard by the damage to his body going so much beyond what he expected. A second wave of blue bullets came, so he grabbed one from that.

    Soon after he did, intense pain circulated in his right hand, and one dissolved finger fell off.

    "...!"

    The attack could not only inflict localized pain to a Dead Apostle but also damage his body.

    (No, that's not it.)

    He analyzed the mutation in his body and immediately understood it was not mere destruction.

    (What amazingly powerful hypnotoxin! The pain was actually my soul rejecting the venom!)

    The melted finger was presumably a rejective reflex to a direct attempt to put the soul to sleep.

    Jester grit his teeth as he took a look at what tried to corrode him.

    The bullet was actually a bee.

    But not an ordinary bee.

    Each and every bee had its exoskeleton dyed blue, making them look almost like intricate lapis-lazuli statues of bees.

    (Golems?! No, that's not it! It can't be... those are real bees!?)

    Lapis-colored bees don't exist.

    Multiple species of bees, like the prettier variants of the cuckoo bees, are naturally blue.

    But this bee was not like that.

    Normally, bees this large are marked with a vivid combination of yellow and black tones. It looked as if these were those bees after evolving into learning to wear lapis armor.

    (I've seen the bee-controlling properties of this magical energy before...)

    "Woman! Could you be Odd Borzak's successor?!", yelled Jester as he took a big step back after swatting the bee away.

    "!"

    The woman's face lost composure for a second.

    "You know my grandfather?"

    "Sure do! He made quite a name for himself, both among mages and among our kind. Though I hear this fame was his downfall, as the humans put a bounty on his head."

    "A Dead Apostle..."

    "Don't be so on edge. I wasn't his enemy."

    Multiple thoughts crossed Jester's mind all at once while he conversed with the woman before him. And through all of this, he still didn't distract himself from Assassin's threat.

    (Odd's successor.)

    (But she's not one of our kind.)

    (Command Spells on her left hand.)

    (She's a Master?)

    (Where is the Servant?)

    (Did she inherit the Dead Apostle bees?)

    (If she did, can she use them?)

    (I'll bet on no.)

    (Wait.)

    (It doesn't matter if she inherited them. With my power, I can turn her current bees into Dead Apostle bees!)

    The only Borzak mage Jester knew was a fellow Dead Apostle. A man who controlled venomous bees with the power to turn humans into Dead Apostles.

    If he uses the bees' venom to increase the number of his Ghouls in Snowfield, he could both recover his strength and breed hesitation in Assassin's heart.

    (I was avoiding spreading my kind while there are swarms of mages out and about everywhere, but if I use these bees, I can avoid the issu—)

    His head rolled backward.

    A blade of dark hair shot through the place his head once was.

    "HAHA! Jealous, my beautiful Assassin? You don't need to worry, I'm not making any moves on that woman! I'm just trying to raise some funds to able to love you more!"

    "..."

    Assassin continued her attack without a word, but Jester's words only got the beemaster girl warier of the two.

    "Assassin...?! What's a Servant doing with a Dead Apostle?!"

    "...!"

    Those words made Assassin realize that the beemaster woman atop the stairs was part of the Grail War.

    She obviously never doubted the involvement of anyone in that temple, but that confirmation also intensified Assassin's wariness of the mage woman.

    (But that's a problem for later. The hellspawn comes first and foremost.)

    Assassin turned to Jester, her priorities unchanged.

    However...



    "Being a Servant doesn't make you an exception."

    Since Ishtar's magical energy invaded her, Haruri's mind is in the process of changing to make her a better conductor of rites.

    She always thought of the Holy Grail as merely a tool to destroy the world of magecraft, so now protecting Ishtar's temple became a priority above the Grail. Meaning that working for Ishtar was gradually becoming her core goal.

    "My name is Haruri. The high priestess granted her life and her role by Her Holiness goddess Ishtar. As such, I cannot tolerate further use of violence within these grounds."

    That is because painting the world in Ishtar's colors would have the exact same effect of destroying the world as many mages know it.

    There was a major contradiction in her thought process, but she can't notice it while her soul is getting charmed by Ishtar's magical energy.

    Not that it matters. Even if there wasn't a hint of Charm involved, Haruri would still say the words she was about to say out of gratitude for Ishtar saving her life.

    The first thing she was supposed to say, with or without a Dead Apostle and a Heroic Spirit causing a ruckus.

    "By my Command Spell, I order you:"

    A Command Spell on Haruri's left hand shone brightly.

    (She'd use a precious Command Spell just because a Servant and Dead Apostle appeared here? Is she going to pull all stops to make sure Assassin and I are eliminated?)

    Jester's doubt lasted only until he heard her command. Once he did, everything made sense.

    She used hers the way any Master offering their whole being to this temple would.

    "be the watcher of this forest and temple, and such, defend them for eternity!"

    The three marks on her left hand shone and one of them was lost.

    The land shook for an instant.

    A monumental, obscenely gigantic steel beast appeared from inside the forest.



    What shook the land wasn't the creature's steps.

    The creature had its form and presence hidden by some form of concealment magecraft, so when its magical energy was finally released, its shockwaves provoked a tremor in the forest's essence.

    Its magical energy was not only gigantic but also dense.

    Jester immediately could tell.

    "That's... the thing that was in front of the hospital back then!"

    Its very presence made Jester doubt it was something the Grail was capable of calling.

    It was expanded dozens of times bigger than it was back in the hospital.

    『        ─ ─ ─ ─         ─ ─     ─   ─     ─ ─ ─ ─ ─   ─       ─ ─       ─ ─ ─ ─   ─ ─ ─ ─         ─ ─ ─ ─     ─ ─   ─   ─ ─           ─   ─ ─ ─     ─ ─ ─      』

    Its roar resembled the one he heard before.

    Jester couldn't tell one roar apart from the other, but Assassin noticed the difference.

    The previous one sounded like a roar of resentment cursing all there is in the world. In contrast, the current one felt like a scream of delight blessing something.

    The roar caused every winged animal in the forest to take it to the skies, casting a shadow over the woods as they flapped against the powerful winds.

    "What the hell..."

    As a Dead Apostle, Jester could comprehend the creature before him and tried to reject her.

    "My body can reject the presence of any product of man... but not this."



    By feeling the magical energy on his skin, Jester analyzed all substances inside the creature and voiced a hypothesis.

    "Impossible. This is a person... and at the same time, a weapon made by the gods...?"



    "Wrong guess."

    A voice from inside the temple denied his supposition.

    With the clicks of human heels, a woman appeared at the tallest step of the staircase where Haruri stood.

    "Our pantheon didn't make her to be a weapon."

    Haruri kneeled and lowered her head in reverence.

    Likewise, the colossus in the forest lowered its body and offered what seemed to be its head, like a knight taking an oath of fealty.

    "They birthed her through methods that go against my principles, but that's no reason not to bless her once she's born. I'm having her be the watcher of my sanctuary, and look how happy she got from having the same role again. Gotta wonder what's so nice about that. What a cute girl."

    The beautiful woman directed an earth mother goddess smile to the creature as big as her temple.

    Jester quickly figured out that she was an Einzbern homunculus, since one of his masks was that of a mage.

    But at the same time, he figured out something else:

    The magical energy in what was inside the homunculus was different in nature from the creature but equally powerful.

    "What are you?", Jester reflexively asked.

    "Oh, you don't know? Are that dumb?", the woman with the body of a homunculus answered.

    Hearing this response, Jester gritted his teeth before opening his mouth again.

    "Ok, fair, that was a stupid question. That high priestess girl already gave me the answer before. She even said whose temple this is."

    Jester was perfectly frozen in place and even then Assassin couldn't bring herself to follow up on her attack.

    She wouldn't be allowed any careless move.

    She wouldn't be allowed to ignore the woman to act.

    The pressure taking hold of the air in the whole area felt like the world itself ordering her not to do anything.

    The only one able to flash a cynical smile in defiance of this air was Jester, who was a denier of Human Order, and who was already charmed by Assassin before the goddess' divine aura could charm him.

    "I didn't think you'd really build a temple in this land... goddess Ishtar."
    Last edited by Comun; January 12th, 2023 at 07:22 PM.

  3. #11523
    The Long-Forgotten Sight Rafflesiac's Avatar
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    Jester UOOOOHs, good lord.
    Quote Originally Posted by Arashi_Leonhart View Post
    canon finish apo vol 3

  4. #11524
    アルテミット・ワン Ultimate One asterism42's Avatar
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    Aww, Haruri's first day at her new job

    I'm so proud of her
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandstorm77 View Post
    He's just putting the bone of his sword into other people until it explodes and lets out parts of him inside them.
    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerEmiya View Post
    Genderswaps are terrible, but I think I and other people would hate them less if Fate didn't keep ignoring actual heroines throughout history and folklore. Like, why bother turning Francis Drake into a woman when Ching Shih and Grace O'Malley exist?
    Quote Originally Posted by Five_X View Post
    Fate Zero is just Fate Stay Night for people who think Shirou is too girly
    Quote Originally Posted by Comun View Post
    I think Alex IV can eat Goku.

  5. #11525
    Wings of the Sunlit Sky Hermitfold's Avatar
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    Jester is charmed by Zealot that he's resisting Ishtar's charm? Man really is a simp among simps.

  6. #11526
    Cats are awesome RCM9698's Avatar
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    Thank you for the translation, Comun!

    Huwawa and haruri are happy at their new jobs, and Jester isn't so happy to come across them. A win on both counts.

  7. #11527
    Certified Bazett Appreciator Armandoiskyu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hermitfold View Post
    Jester is charmed by Zealot that he's resisting Ishtar's charm? Man really is a simp among simps.
    The simp to end all simps

  8. #11528
    This tiny fart of a curse left behind by Ishtar feels more threatening and divine than most the divinities in FGO. I guess the descriptions of how she's warping Haruri and the later fuckery with the missiles helps.

  9. #11529
    هههههههههههههههههههه Kamera's Avatar
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    Maybe because Narita can juggle powerlevels better than any other TM writers.

  10. #11530
    改竄者 Falsifier Petrikow's Avatar
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    Ever since the farce that was the Olympians, anything feels more threatening.

  11. #11531
    Quote Originally Posted by Formless Creature View Post
    Has Ishtar done a single good thing in her life?
    Mythologically she is Goddess of pretty much all good things. Harvest, power etc.

    So she is to be thanked for all harvests in ancient Mesopotamia

  12. #11532
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six OnesFleetingGlory's Avatar
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    I didn't notice that Ishtar actually holds Siduri in that high of regard. So it's safe to expect a battle even larger than Proto's Tokyo Bay.



  13. #11533
    Wings of the Sunlit Sky Hermitfold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CO9p5JMGv!p9 View Post
    This tiny fart of a curse left behind by Ishtar feels more threatening and divine than most the divinities in FGO. I guess the descriptions of how she's warping Haruri and the later fuckery with the missiles helps.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sione View Post
    Maybe because Narita can juggle powerlevels better than any other TM writers.
    Divine Spirit Servants are gods that got humanized by their containers, which fits their roles as protectos of the Human Order. F/SF Ishtar is like an actual god slumming it with the humans, which is way scarier.

    Quote Originally Posted by Petrikow View Post
    Ever since the farce that was the Olympians, anything feels more threatening.
    Olympians, Super Arjuna, Skadi, etc are all broken beings living in broken worlds imo

  14. #11534
    هههههههههههههههههههه Kamera's Avatar
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    The gods in FGO suffers from the "Tell, don't show" storytelling the most, while it's pretty much the opposite here.

  15. #11535
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six OnesFleetingGlory's Avatar
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    That's a rather ironic view when FGO has the advantage by showing the visuals as the story goes by. There should've been more graphic depictions when Demeter razes Olympus to the ground without caring about the Olympians, or when Aphrodite enthralls the Servants and the citizens not unlike what Ishtar did to Haruri.



  16. #11536
    FGO has very little non-dialogue narration in its stylistic framework (and it always stands out when it's used, mostly by Sakurai) so I guess it can't be helped. They seem to want to be married to their early stylistic choices rather than evolving.

  17. #11537
    Quote Originally Posted by OnesFleetingGlory View Post
    That's a rather ironic view when FGO has the advantage by showing the visuals as the story goes by. There should've been more graphic depictions when Demeter razes Olympus to the ground without caring about the Olympians, or when Aphrodite enthralls the Servants and the citizens not unlike what Ishtar did to Haruri.
    FGO's VN engine seems antiquated and rather limited, and while they have been improving a little bit (notably with the addition of battle cutscenes), it still restrains them. This can be circumvented through narration (as pointed out above, rarely seen), but I'd prefer if the game as a whole just got a client update or something since this is not the only thing that is affected by the legacy engine being developed with a small budget under the assumption the game would've gone nowhere.

    Though this also seems partly as a result of the fact that Narita is simply better at dealing with overpowered power scales, as opposed to the FGO writers, which seemed to prefer smaller scale stuff despite FGO being explicitly a story where the stakes and scaling are at their absolute highest. It's not that it's incapable of pulling off this kind of thing (SPOILERORT recently really does feel like a real threat), but I do find it funny.
    Last edited by Formless Creature; January 14th, 2023 at 08:32 AM.

  18. #11538
    هههههههههههههههههههه Kamera's Avatar
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    The powerlevels in most Grail War stories and FSF especially can be properly observed and measured because we can have multiple characters having multiple battle encounters which then can explain their strength, weakness and compatibilities better, from multiple point of views. In FGO the only measure we have of the enemies' powerlevel most of the time are either Da Vinci/Mash/Holmes technobabbling with their convenient technomagi Power Level Scouter.
    Last edited by Kamera; January 14th, 2023 at 09:37 AM.

  19. #11539
    You don't, strictly speaking, need multiple viewpoints to have a particular frame of reference for how strong a character is really supposed to be.

    The reality is that this kind of thing is something that requires some level of subtlety, and all things that require subtlety inherently require trust in your audience. It's a leap of faith. That's why it's so much easier to simply point a guy and say "hey you know that guy? he's really strong" because that ensures everyone's on the same page. A writer that is overly concerned with making sure their audience 'gets it', because they inherently fear that the audience is too stupid to 'get it', won't be able to express the trust necessary to make such a leap of faith work. Not only that, but it also requires more time and more of the audience's investment to establish the frame of reference needed to make a character feel strong without caveats.

    For example, let's say you have a character who can destroy a mountain. This really means nothing in of itself, unless compared to something else. Let's say that everyone else so far has only been capable of regular mano a mano combat, or perhaps capable of wrecking a house. By comparison, a character that can level a mountain would seem godly, even if characters in other works of fiction are capable of much worse. You must first establish a 'normal' before you can utilize an 'abnormal', and you must have the absolute faith in your audience that they will be able to recognize the 'normal' and the 'abnormal' for what it is.

    One good non-spoilery example of FGO managing to pull this off is probably with Tiamat. Most of Babylonia is, somewhat subtly, setup for the later final fight with Tiamat. It establishes the concepts and limitations that will later be used, and it ultimately requires the culmination of all that you have learned and seen to defeat her and to get a sense of what she is and what her power is. In Olympus, perhaps the greatest issue is the inherent ambition in the concept involved - Tiamat was one opponent it took an entire chapter to establish as a legitimate threat, and how it would take everything to take her down, but there are quite a few Olympians, they are all supposed to be super OP, and Zeus especially is meant to be super mega duper OP, to say nothing of Chaos. Thusly the problem is that Olympus is so 'abnormal' that there is no real 'normal' to draw as a point of comparison, rendering it meaningless. It's kind of like how in DBZ it was a monumental feat to go Super Saiyan but by the end everyone and their mom's already Super so it's not as cool.

    Spoiler:

    This is also present with ORT who can casually destroy the Earth, a feat we simply know is impressive because this is already established as so difficult that Moriarty had to go with an extremely convoluted plan that was the focus of an entire storyline just to achieve it.


    However, even more so than any of that, Olympus seems to be plagued by an overwhelming issue of an overuse of the legendary writing technique of "wouldn't it be cool if", where things exist basically mostly to seem impressive rather than any particular objective. Tiamat is powerful not simply because she is a thing that is hard to kill and does a lot of damage, but because she is also equivalent to a force of nature. She is the sea of life that birthed all things. This is inherently something too difficult to overcome by itself; rebelling against her is identical to rebelling against one's own origin, and appropriately difficult. Triumph against Tiamat is the triumph of humanity against their own nature, and proof that we are destined for great things beyond our own origin, which is quite literally everything that Gilgamesh's character stands for, and something that reinforces the overarching themes of the story up to that point as well. The Olympians are just overpowered mecha.
    Last edited by Formless Creature; January 14th, 2023 at 09:52 AM.

  20. #11540
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six OnesFleetingGlory's Avatar
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    Y'know, it's a real wasted opportunity when they didn't even show Crypters fight each other at all, since it's supposed to be competition. FGO's Part 2 without Chaldea would've simply been HGW on global scale, with Alien God as overseer and the winner rewarded with a chance to rewrite the planet's texture. They each have Servant(s) and serve a faction under some monarch, given the time to grow strengths and armies, allowed to scout their opponents' turf so long they have the means, but the scouted faction is allowed to intercept the intruder if they're found out, and a battle can only occur once a Lostbelt's boundary touches the other's and connects the two or more Lostbelts. Feels like Warhammer 40K TRPG, which I'm tempted to write about, but only after LB7's conclusion so that I don't need to worry about retconning stuffs.

    But I digress. As to not diverge further, I'll get back to FSF. If Ishtar has Gugalanna manifested, I'm guessing only Gil and Enkidu are able to stand a chance against it. Though there's also Huwawa. Unless Thia somehow decided to intervene, perhaps wanting to help Flat's friends. Speaking of Thia, he's supposed to be a potential Ultimate One, but he's still struggling somewhat when fighting Enkidu.



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