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Thread: Heaven's Feel Movies - Third was coming Spring 2020, now on hiatus

  1. #10721
    Behold the King's smirk Orivaa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Comun View Post
    The version I knew of the trolley problem had a loved one on one track and 5 strangers on the other. It was about small personal benefit vs large collective benefit, not about agency. Though I guess this agency version is just as valid of a thought experiment.
    Your version is definitely not the usual one, unless my education on the history of the thought experiment is much worse than I thought.
    At any rate, who is whom, here? Is Aniplex the person pulling the lever? The one who tied people to the tracks? The one putting my in front of the lever?

    Quote Originally Posted by Inuhanyou View Post
    I brought up children because humans can be infantile and corporations and corrupt politicans take advantage of exposing that and using it to their benefit. Its not a matter of simply people making choices but being allowed to make choices that will negatively impact more than themselves.
    I think we have a fundamental disagreement. I disagree with infantilizing people, and I don't think you or any institution ought to go play Big Brother to save people from themselves. I think such attitudes, if implemented by a government as a matter of public policy and state ideology, would lead to a totalitarian hell-hole that would do far more damage than Covid ever could, both in terms of material damage to people's health and in terms of human rights oppression. I hold that every adult is wholly responsible for their own actions. If we disagree on this, we're not going to find any common ground.

    As an aside (cause I read ahead), laws don't exist to prevent people from being dumbasses. They exist for a variety of purposes, most commonly to ensure that people aren't allowed to violate the rights of others. That's my two cents, anyway.
    Last edited by Orivaa; October 18th, 2020 at 09:11 PM.

  2. #10722
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors Comun's Avatar
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    Aniplex would be the person tying the people to the tracks. The builder of the dilemma, not the person taking part on it.

  3. #10723
    Black King Inuhanyou's Avatar
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    "Freedom" does not include putting other people in danger. Its a simple story.



  4. #10724
    I told 'em, I told 'em. Bugrit! eddyak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orivaa View Post
    I think we have a fundamental disagreement. I disagree with infantilizing people, and I don't think you or any institution ought to go play Big Brother to save people from themselves.
    Your point would be valid if you were the only person at risk from Covid. Which you're not.

    It's like driving a car- the government at the very least has a responsibility to make sure you're going to kill other people by accident, but actually it's not like driving a car because the results are invisible, take weeks to show, and the murdering isn't serial, it's exponential- instead of just plowing into some poor old lady at a zebra crossing, you end up spreading the disease to eveyrone you meet, and they spread it and kill every old lady they meet, and every old lady those old ladies meet in the next two to three weeks, and so on, and so on, and so on and are you getting it now?
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  5. #10725
    吸血鬼 Vampire
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    HF3 pamphlet
    https://imgur.com/a/2YzK2RC

    Someone from discord summarised some stuff

    I feel like the first paragraph hints that not everything went smoothly.
    Notable info:
    - Tsunematsu directed the scene in the car and the part when Illya talks about you know who
    - Nasu and Takeuchi singing praises about Miura and his storyboards, even though, at first they had a hard time imagining they could top the Saber vs Berserker fight.
    - Sudo praising the AD work of Kouji Akiyama and Yaeko Watanabe
    - Takiguchi did the last part (synced with music)
    - Nasu says that due to his inexperience Sakura's reception was mixed and that's why he wrote Fate/Extra CCC to "save" her. He was afraid that animating HF would expose his flaws again but ended up being impressed by the adaptation and said that if the HF route was adapted earlier he wouldn't have to write F/E CCC.

    Sudo explains that he wanted the Shirou x Kirei fight to be more grounded compared to all the fights between servants but in exchange he wanted every punch to have a meaningful impact on their bodies also blades are hard to draw

  6. #10726
    リビングデッド Living Dead
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    can someone translate the full pamphlet?

  7. #10727
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors weeblord's Avatar
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    Smash the like button if youre not a post CCC fake fan

  8. #10728
    全力後輩 - Zenryoku Kohai Altima of the Gates's Avatar
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    Soooo, now that Sakura has gotten more and more fans over the years and not less and less, can you just let that go Nasu and just use her more as a character? Please?
    No? Damn.

    But semi-seriously, I am guessing BB was going to be Sakura's Magical Amber, yet people just like both. Him asking Sudo to change things now makes sense, hopefully Sudo being successful and the fact she gained more appreciators will put that nagging in his chest to rest.
    Last edited by Altima of the Gates; October 21st, 2020 at 04:36 PM.

  9. #10729
    Knight of Joestar SirGauoftheSquareTable's Avatar
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    I do agree that Sakura in HF was just fine, really.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Really, all 3 of the romances in F/SN are 'for want of a nail' kind of situations.
    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    You mean because Shirou winds up falling for the first of the three that he Nailed?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    I speak for the majority of important people* *a category comprised entirely of myself

  10. #10730
    If he had such a problem with it, he shouldn't have made her the way she is or what happened to her in the first place.
    Spoiler:
    Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by Shrapnel View Post
    Bob the Builder's evil twin.
    Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by Imperial View Post
    HF felt like Nasu holding up a megaphone and screaming, "LOOK AT HOW SAD THIS IS! ISN'T IT SAD? YOU SHOULD FEEL SAD!"


    Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by Altaris View Post
    > Einzbern

    > Making smart decisions


    Pick one


    Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by You View Post
    Palingenesis just sounds like we're creating Sarah Palin.


    Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by Leftovers View Post
    >tfw you betray your ideals to get some


    Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by Mizukume View Post
    In short, Japan's syncretism BS striked again.




  11. #10731
    Knight of Joestar SirGauoftheSquareTable's Avatar
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    Eh, old shame as a concept is perfectly valid. Who we are at particular moments in time influences what we write, and Nasu was a different person back then.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Really, all 3 of the romances in F/SN are 'for want of a nail' kind of situations.
    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    You mean because Shirou winds up falling for the first of the three that he Nailed?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    I speak for the majority of important people* *a category comprised entirely of myself

  12. #10732
    The horror GarlandGreene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirGauoftheSquareTable View Post
    Nasu was a different person back then.
    Yeah he actually wrote stuff that was good.

  13. #10733
    Knight of Joestar SirGauoftheSquareTable's Avatar
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    I personally think he leaned a bit too much into grimdark back then.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Really, all 3 of the romances in F/SN are 'for want of a nail' kind of situations.
    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    You mean because Shirou winds up falling for the first of the three that he Nailed?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    I speak for the majority of important people* *a category comprised entirely of myself

  14. #10734
    I told 'em, I told 'em. Bugrit! eddyak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Altima of the Gates View Post
    Soooo, now that Sakura has gotten more and more fans over the years and not less and less, can you just let that go Nasu and just use her more as a character? Please?
    No? Damn.

    But semi-seriously, I am guessing BB was going to be Sakura's Magical Amber, yet people just like both. Him asking Sudo to change things now makes sense, hopefully Sudo being successful and the fact she gained more appreciators will put that nagging in his chest to rest.
    I think I wrote a thing about this a while ago, something about how Sakura doesn't really fit into the Fate series the way almost everybody else in the series does, given that the main drive of the series is agency- all the heroes want this magic wish so they cross space & time itself, most of the magi want the cup for its ability to reach something even greater, even this near-powerless sword nerd wants to achieve something, and this ritual is the one thing that might actually answer his question, and meanwhile we have the girl who wants nothing, who's afraid even to wish for something, who isn't allowed, neither by her circumstances, nor by the plot, to actually want to reach out for something.

    I think that's what explains Sakura's lackluster showing throughout most of the series, and even the fanbase. Everybody comes to Fate because badass sword lady who goes head to head with Heracles and also gets tentacled a lot in doujins, or badass twintailed mage who's fighting this war just because she wants to prove something just to herself, and then there's the character who doesn't really do anything, at least partly because the plot doesn't allow it, and the series doesn't cater well to the damsel in distress crowd.

    But I might be misremembering it for one of the other stupid things I post well past midnight, oh look, like it is now.
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  15. #10735
    Knight of Joestar SirGauoftheSquareTable's Avatar
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    I personally interpreted Sakura's character arc as a struggle FOR agency even as she is afraid to want it or have it and in the face of dire consequences for her agency. I mean, Zouken's and Kirei's plans for Sakura only really came to fruition because she ultimately made choices that cast the die of fate a certain way.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Really, all 3 of the romances in F/SN are 'for want of a nail' kind of situations.
    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    You mean because Shirou winds up falling for the first of the three that he Nailed?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    I speak for the majority of important people* *a category comprised entirely of myself

  16. #10736
    The horror GarlandGreene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirGauoftheSquareTable View Post
    I personally think he leaned a bit too much into grimdark back then.
    What did you expect out of someone whose biggest influences includes the likes of Wicked City, Demon city Shinjuku, Vampire Hunter D and Evangelion. Plus it's not like he's completely abandoned them nowadays. There's plenty of edge in FGO. At least those grimdark elements used to feel a lot more natural and well integrated within his prior works rather than coming off as some hodge podge of poorly thought out anime cliches that mesh as well as oil and water. One minute, it's trying to be Carnival Phantasm and the next, it's Akame ga Kill.

  17. #10737
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors TheSeaDragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by weeblord View Post
    Smash the like button if youre not a post CCC fake fan
    smashing.

  18. #10738
    Quote Originally Posted by eddyak View Post
    I think I wrote a thing about this a while ago, something about how Sakura doesn't really fit into the Fate series the way almost everybody else in the series does, given that the main drive of the series is agency- all the heroes want this magic wish so they cross space & time itself, most of the magi want the cup for its ability to reach something even greater, even this near-powerless sword nerd wants to achieve something, and this ritual is the one thing that might actually answer his question, and meanwhile we have the girl who wants nothing, who's afraid even to wish for something, who isn't allowed, neither by her circumstances, nor by the plot, to actually want to reach out for something.

    I think that's what explains Sakura's lackluster showing throughout most of the series, and even the fanbase. Everybody comes to Fate because badass sword lady who goes head to head with Heracles and also gets tentacled a lot in doujins, or badass twintailed mage who's fighting this war just because she wants to prove something just to herself, and then there's the character who doesn't really do anything, at least partly because the plot doesn't allow it, and the series doesn't cater well to the damsel in distress crowd.

    But I might be misremembering it for one of the other stupid things I post well past midnight, oh look, like it is now.
    There's no reason Nasu couldn't just push the angle he pursued with her in the F/HA finale harder and make her develop strength and confidence as a fighter. Battle Moon Wars is a good example of how Sakura should have been treated all along. Also, ironically, Sakura is probably the least damsel in distress out of the heroines even in the original VN. Looking at the results, Sakura has a far better showing in her route than the other heroines do in theirs; it's just that the narration doesn't glorify her.

  19. #10739
    I told 'em, I told 'em. Bugrit! eddyak's Avatar
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    That's true, but again, even as far as HA, she still doesn't actually have a goal she's pursuing. She isn't the hardcore magus her sister is, magic isn't one of her reasons for being. She doesn't have a great wrong she thinks needs righting like Saber, she doesn't have the vague end goal of "hero" that Shirou's stumbling along towards, still trying to figure out his way, her end goals are "senpai" and "nee-san", and along the way she's learning magic for... some reason. She's... well, she's another regular person, closer to one of us than to the rest of Stay Night, at the end of the day, and that's the opposite of, I think, literally everybody else in the series.

    Strength and confidence are almost the opposite of what she was originally written and intended for, even if she had those she'd still be a ways off the lovable weirdoes the rest of the main cast is.
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  20. #10740
    The Greatest Cool Reign's Avatar
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