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Thread: Lord El-Melloi II Case Files

  1. #3301
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors
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    Quote Originally Posted by All fictions View Post
    The Truman Show.
    Where was that of all things acknowledged?

  2. #3302
    People forget that HP was/is pretty popular in Japan. Takeuchi even drew Hermione once lol.

  3. #3303
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaehaerys48 View Post
    People forget that HP was/is pretty popular in Japan. Takeuchi even drew Hermione once lol.
    Got an image of this drawing?

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    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors AAM1232's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by warellis View Post
    Got an image of this drawing?
    https://mobile.twitter.com/jaehaerys...159680?lang=en

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    Knight of Joestar SirGauoftheSquareTable's Avatar
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    Hermione as a saberface actually kind of works, at least for younger Hermione.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Really, all 3 of the romances in F/SN are 'for want of a nail' kind of situations.
    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    You mean because Shirou winds up falling for the first of the three that he Nailed?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    I speak for the majority of important people* *a category comprised entirely of myself

  6. #3306
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    Quote Originally Posted by warellis View Post
    Where was that of all things acknowledged?
    Fate/strange fake, where else:
    Quote Originally Posted by FSF 6 Chapter 18
    “Oh, you know about that! Yes, this world inside the ward is like a massive stage set made to be a whole fake city. . . . You see that as a setting in games sometimes. I think there was a Jim Carrey movie like that too.”

    “I’m pretty sure that was a city set built from the ground up, not a reproduction. . . . That last scene was great, though. It was a good movie.”

    “Wasn’t it?! I want to teach my liquid mercury Mystic Code friend the greeting from it next time I see her!”
    Quote Originally Posted by Rafflesiac View Post
    Punching out some nerd doesn't make you a better magus.

  7. #3307
    Quote Originally Posted by All fictions View Post
    >Harry Potter is a LN

    Aaaaargh
    Quote Originally Posted by Rafflesiac View Post
    Most successful magic high school story of all time.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaehaerys48 View Post
    People forget that HP was/is pretty popular in Japan. Takeuchi even drew Hermione once lol.
    It remembers me I still don't know how the fuck the magic in Harry Potter works.

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    Quote Originally Posted by All fictions View Post
    Fate/strange fake, where else:
    So then I guess the question becomes "When was the last time a piece of literature was acknowledged in a TM work that doesn't involve it being real in some form a la Sherlock, Jekyll & Hyde and Nemo...and it didn't involve Flat?"

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    On the Holy Night Reign's Avatar
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    Does Mash and Roman watching the 1984 Holmes series in Babylonia ep 0 count since it's not Doyle's books?
    Otherwise, there's Vlad's thing about how Dracula is made up and ruined his reputation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reign View Post
    Does Mash and Roman watching the 1984 Holmes series in Babylonia ep 0 count since it's not Doyle's books?
    Otherwise, there's Vlad's thing about how Dracula is made up and ruined his reputation.
    Both of those could arguably fall under "real in some form". Sherlock because it's just another adaptation of the original piece of "fiction" that turned out "real" (like so many other examples of "real" fictional Servants) and Vlad because the vampiric legends that largely gained notoriety only because of Stoker's Dracula actually affected the manifestation of his Servant form.

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    Knight of Joestar SirGauoftheSquareTable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by quigonkenny View Post
    So then I guess the question becomes "When was the last time a piece of literature was acknowledged in a TM work that doesn't involve it being real in some form a la Sherlock, Jekyll & Hyde and Nemo...and it didn't involve Flat?"
    Hm, I suppose JJBA remains a strong contender for last time this had happened.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Really, all 3 of the romances in F/SN are 'for want of a nail' kind of situations.
    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    You mean because Shirou winds up falling for the first of the three that he Nailed?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    I speak for the majority of important people* *a category comprised entirely of myself

  12. #3312
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors weeblord's Avatar
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    Wait til they casually reveal stroheim participated in the 3rd grail war.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ballinamon View Post
    It remembers me I still don't know how the fuck the magic in Harry Potter works.
    Author fiat, mostly. It's a very loosely-defined system that most of the time boils down to "if a wizard says funny latin and waves his wand then magic happens" but also sometimes has complex self-sacrificial rituals because the plot demanded it. Specific details are hand-waved unless they're directly relevant to the plot, and half the time explanations are meaningless magibabble.

    It's worth remembering that Rowling explicitly designed the rules of Quidditch to make sports fans angry. That's the type of author you're dealing with.

    On the scale of soft magic to hard magic, it's definitely soft magic while Type-Moon magecraft is more on the side of hard magic. Note that there's definitely softer magic systems, though, and that magecraft is nowhere near the hardest it can get. Not for a lack of trying, mind you.

  14. #3314
    Quote Originally Posted by neveron View Post
    Author fiat, mostly. It's a very loosely-defined system that most of the time boils down to "if a wizard says funny latin and waves his wand then magic happens" but also sometimes has complex self-sacrificial rituals because the plot demanded it. Specific details are hand-waved unless they're directly relevant to the plot, and half the time explanations are meaningless magibabble.

    It's worth remembering that Rowling explicitly designed the rules of Quidditch to make sports fans angry. That's the type of author you're dealing with.

    On the scale of soft magic to hard magic, it's definitely soft magic while Type-Moon magecraft is more on the side of hard magic. Note that there's definitely softer magic systems, though, and that magecraft is nowhere near the hardest it can get. Not for a lack of trying, mind you.
    Depends on the mage craft. I would say using thing mage craft like Imaginary magic numbers, using your origin like shirou etc does contend for being one of the hardest magic imo

  15. #3315
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    Quote Originally Posted by Takashi View Post
    Depends on the mage craft. I would say using thing mage craft like Imaginary magic numbers, using your origin like shirou etc does contend for being one of the hardest magic imo
    To give examples, a softer-than-HP system might be something like Narnia (where magic is entirely unexplained and merely serves the purposes of the plot) while a harder-than-TM system might be one of the various "magic is just poorly understood science (or sufficently advanced technology), actually" takes out there. Note that there are very few works that go fully hard or soft, and neither is better than the other. Personally I'm not much for the more sci-fi takes, though.

    Seriously, though, you just need to look at the concept of "ranks" (or NP stats in general, really) to realize that the system usually fudges just enough lines to be able to bullshit stuff the plot requires. The fact that Mystery requires a lack of rational explanation is also a convenient out.

    It's a hard magic system, don't get me wrong, it's just not exactly on the level where you start to get GURPS fans sweating. You don't have it written down that one unit of magical energy is 360 kilojoules, because you're writing a story and not an RPG system for math-obsessed nerds. (Writing what I know, here. That old usenet(?) gate argument was fascinating to read.)

    Also Heroic Spirits as a whole kind of run on Narrativium, so, y'know. Fate is inherently a bit softer. Case Files mostly avoids this by focusing in on the more occult aspects of mages in general and leaning a lot on IRL mysticism (which gives it historical realism points if nothing else), but even then it tries its hardest to leave things fuzzy enough to not constrain future writers.

  16. #3316
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    Quote Originally Posted by weeblord View Post
    Wait til they casually reveal stroheim participated in the 3rd grail war.
    Considering Hansa Cervantes exists, this is a real possibility.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Really, all 3 of the romances in F/SN are 'for want of a nail' kind of situations.
    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    You mean because Shirou winds up falling for the first of the three that he Nailed?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    I speak for the majority of important people* *a category comprised entirely of myself

  17. #3317
    Quote Originally Posted by neveron View Post
    Author fiat, mostly. It's a very loosely-defined system that most of the time boils down to "if a wizard says funny latin and waves his wand then magic happens" but also sometimes has complex self-sacrificial rituals because the plot demanded it. Specific details are hand-waved unless they're directly relevant to the plot, and half the time explanations are meaningless magibabble.

    It's worth remembering that Rowling explicitly designed the rules of Quidditch to make sports fans angry. That's the type of author you're dealing with.

    On the scale of soft magic to hard magic, it's definitely soft magic while Type-Moon magecraft is more on the side of hard magic. Note that there's definitely softer magic systems, though, and that magecraft is nowhere near the hardest it can get. Not for a lack of trying, mind you.
    As one thing that always bother me in Harry Potter after I soaked in other fantasy stories (mostly japanese, mostly TM). That is, the magic expenditure. As I don't remember have seen something of this in all 7 books, that means they don't have it and you can spam Avada Kedavra non-stop?

  18. #3318
    祖 Ancestor TheSeaDragon's Avatar
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    oh, no.she is cute

  19. #3319
    Knight of Joestar SirGauoftheSquareTable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ballinamon View Post
    As one thing that always bother me in Harry Potter after I soaked in other fantasy stories (mostly japanese, mostly TM). That is, the magic expenditure. As I don't remember have seen something of this in all 7 books, that means they don't have it and you can spam Avada Kedavra non-stop?
    I don't think it plays a huge role, but there are hints of certain spells taking a lot out of you. At least, I think there might be. Honestly, my main issue is that wizards don't use magic to strengthen their hand-to-hand like they do in Japanese series. It seems like such an obvious application, especially for law enforcement. Also, do even non-European wizards use Latin spells? What about pre-Latin times? We don't know.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathhappens View Post
    Really, all 3 of the romances in F/SN are 'for want of a nail' kind of situations.
    Quote Originally Posted by forumghost View Post
    You mean because Shirou winds up falling for the first of the three that he Nailed?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    I speak for the majority of important people* *a category comprised entirely of myself

  20. #3320
    Quote Originally Posted by neveron View Post
    To give examples, a softer-than-HP system might be something like Narnia (where magic is entirely unexplained and merely serves the purposes of the plot) while a harder-than-TM system might be one of the various "magic is just poorly understood science (or sufficently advanced technology), actually" takes out there. Note that there are very few works that go fully hard or soft, and neither is better than the other. Personally I'm not much for the more sci-fi takes, though.

    Seriously, though, you just need to look at the concept of "ranks" (or NP stats in general, really) to realize that the system usually fudges just enough lines to be able to bullshit stuff the plot requires. The fact that Mystery requires a lack of rational explanation is also a convenient out.

    It's a hard magic system, don't get me wrong, it's just not exactly on the level where you start to get GURPS fans sweating. You don't have it written down that one unit of magical energy is 360 kilojoules, because you're writing a story and not an RPG system for math-obsessed nerds. (Writing what I know, here. That old usenet(?) gate argument was fascinating to read.)

    Also Heroic Spirits as a whole kind of run on Narrativium, so, y'know. Fate is inherently a bit softer. Case Files mostly avoids this by focusing in on the more occult aspects of mages in general and leaning a lot on IRL mysticism (which gives it historical realism points if nothing else), but even then it tries its hardest to leave things fuzzy enough to not constrain future writers.
    I guess concept of "mystery" is where they dish out where plot demands but I find it reasonable considering it gives "each power is limited to a certain aspects". For example
    Let's say Harry potter's Abra kadebra , a death magic it's defined as something that could kill anyone.
    Any hax (hacks) can be overpowered.
    Even though just simple mana blast could effect them any way. I like the concept but requires more explanation I guess

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