General News Thread

[Mcjon01]

And people don't believe me when I tell them the US is corrupt.

I don’t believe you when you say people don’t believe you when you tell them the US is corrupt.

[SpoonyViking]

if its about who has guns then i have bad news

Guns, schmuns. People know where they live, and everybody burns.

[Kamera]

BoJo has coronavirus

sweet irony

[rxrx]

BoJo leads as an example. It will be good publicity if he survives or not since it shows he is serious about "herd immunity".

[Twelveseal]

if its about who has guns then i have bad news

Pretty much this. There are more people on the Left here, sure. Literally millions more. However, the differences between Left and Right cultures dramatically favors the Right in any sort of armed conflict. The military, law enforcement, private security, militia groups, and hell, most active terrorist groups have politically Right-Wing ideologies. There's something like 3× as many guns as there are people in this country, but a great many Leftists don't own or carry. Many have never even held a real firearm. Where the Right is full of avid hunters and sport shooters, the Left is far more likely to view guns as a public health hazard; an unnecessary risk more likely to cause harm than do them good and expensive and time-consuming besides.

Further, because of those previously-mentioned Right-Leaning institutions, it's the Right that has the combat andweapons training, the experience firing on live targets and operating in combat scenarios, the training in tactics and strategy.

They also control the means of production at both the top and the bottom. Farm country leans hard Right. They make the food and control the corporations that supply the Left-Leaning cities. They know the backwoods and cut the paychecks that keep the Left fed here, housed, clothed. You'd have to convince those people to suddenly change their entire worldview and value system when the most prominent examples of the countervailing ideological theory are failed states, authoritarian regimes, rife with corruption made worse by the consolidation of power into a single institution rather than dispersed across competing interests, or some combination thereof. People tend to conveniently forget the Nordic model most of the time, but even that gets bashed from time to time as "European-style Socialism," emphasizing the idea that it is un-American and this wrong. The US is abnormally religious for an advanced nation; even most people on the Left identify as Christians here, and on the Right it's nearly everyone short of Odinist White Nationalists. There's a sizable chunk of the Right that would rather the US be an openly Christian theocracy, complete with Biblical punishments for violating Mosaic Law.

These are the sorts of people who are armed, trained, and ready to fight here.

These people are the reason why Communism, especially Marxist-Leninism, has always been a joke meme here.

The Left has tried. First with breakaway communes, and when those failed to mismanagement, ineptitude, woo, and corruption against a backdrop of Vietnam and the Cold War, those movements turned to the violence of the 70's. Leftist terrorism amid an economic crisis. Ultimately went nowhere except to ultimately moderate the Democratic Party into what it is now, simply because the violence pushed away the moderates and turned popular opinion against the would-be revolutionaries.

You can't have a popular revolution without the people, and while the younger generations are more Left-Wing than our predecessors, most of us can't even be bothered to go out and vote once every few years. Let alone arm ourselves and train to overthrow the government. Hell, the way most of us protest these days is by not doing things, or by meming on social media. The most revolutionary action that's likely possible would be some kind of Islamist Terrorist-style, decentralized, cell-based movement of random or near-random attacks that would only make it harder to convince people that the movement had the moral and ethical high-ground and was worth joining. It'd be comprised of loonies, basically.

Most people aren't willing to throw away their lives for what seems like a lost cause. Sure, you can convince a religious fanatic to by telling them that they'll become a martyr and get a one-way ticket to eternal paradise for their troubles. It's hard to that with rational people. Especially ones aware of how outgunned they are and how thoroughly monitored they are. Or that people they care about depend on their continued performance as "productive members of society." Or who are psychologically addicted to technology that will likely be disrupted by any major conflicts or used against them. Or who depend on their erstwhile enemies for food, weapons, and income, or... you get the idea. Nevermind that hating guns is very much a thing on the Left here.

An actual, violent revolution is insane.

You'd do a better job following the Sanders path... which seems to lead nowhere, if this election is an indication of things to come. It might be best to start convincing youtubers, streamers, and e-sport athletes to become politicians under new political parties. It's pretty clear that the current ones are only out for themselves. You might actually be able to build a functional system to counter the established one with the backing of people like Pewdiepie, Criken, Ninj4 trying to win your vote.

Might.

Otherwise, we're basically left hoping for some kind of massive plague to just roll in and wipe out all the old politicians and rich people that run the system. Oh, wait...

[Pendant]

I'm on the left and am very pro gun

[I3uster]

you dont need to plot the revolution just vote in regional elections where left candidates have a much higher chance of winning because nobody cares about them and enthusiastic leftists are much better at recruiting people than any other faction in the country

It sucks that it takes a while but you can get there. Social democrat reforms have much higher staying power than armed revolutions. Sure, a Sanders presidency might have been the big prize and accelerated this but it's not like he could've done that much if not for regional power (Senate especially).

The problem is that incremental reformism that Sanders and similar people propagate right now is associated with communist revolution for some reason, and neoliberal stagnation that makes shit worse is thought of as incrementalism.

amazing rhetorical trick

[rxrx]

I guess years of propaganda from young turn the people blind to the obvious flaws of their own country everywhere.

[Pendant]

Capital will not countenance simply being voted out of power. The sooner people come to grips with the reality of that the better.

[I3uster]

It also was the complete lack of alternatives. This is what gives Biden the black boomer vote. Nobody has any hope for shit to get better, people just pray for shit to get worse slower.

But, if the Sanders momentum and networking is used beyond the presidential campaign (and from most organizers it seems that it will be) you might actually see one.

[Pendant]

I guess years of propaganda from young turn the people blind to the obvious flaws of their own country everywhere.

They see the flaws it's just that it's easier to attribute those flaws to the fat orange than to engage in any introspection.

[I3uster]

You can turn this around! Get active in your respective political parties!

after the virus

[rxrx]

They see the flaws it's just that it's easier to attribute those flaws to the fat orange than to engage in any introspection.

To people who don't know how USA's election system work, they just see El Presidente as a reflection of the people since it is a democracy. We know it isn't that way, but hey generalization.

[Twelveseal]

Ye, basically. What I'm saying is the revolution wouldn't really work here. The only change is going to be slow. Too slow to meaningfully deal with pressing issues.

Also, Spoony... rich people usually have private fire response companies here that prioritize putting out their shit and draw from the same resources as the public ones but only respond to their clients needs. They got in the way during this last run of Cali wildfires... so no, everyone doesn't burn the same here.

[Kamera]

I'm on the left and am very pro gun

under no pretext.jpeg

the first world, especially Amerikkka, are too classcucked to even manage electing a social democrat, let alone staging a revolution.

the third world is the world's only hope now. let's pray for the maoist guerillas in south-east asian jungles.

[I3uster]

The dialogue shifted from hopey changey bullshit to actual measures and democratic candidates having to pay lip service to medicare for all (even if everyone but Sanders abandoned the idea almost immediately)

I think you underestimate the speed at which electoralism can work if it actually is used properly. A big part of the reason you think change can't really happen at a good pace is because that was the Democrat's excuse to not do shit forever when not doing shit is actually their ideological core.

tl;dr shit can happen fast you just elect people that dont want shit to happen at all

- - - Updated - - -

under no pretext.jpeg

the first world, especially Amerikkka, are too classcucked to even manage electing a social democrat, let alone staging a revolution.

the third world is the world's only hope now. let's pray for the maoist guerillas in south-east asian jungles.

people think class consciousness will magically cure america but look at how the UK, the most class conscious place on earth handles this

theyre like one step away from officially classifying poor people as an animal species and they arent currently under communist leadership

[rxrx]

I'm not too sure. Didn't people turns crazy when some try to introduce policy that is good for the people which is a page out of socialism? Until now, I still think life essentials like health care for example shouldn't be privatized. Oh, and USA's medical service for regular peeps suck ass even though they have the best for the rich.

[Pendant]

I don't know where Buster is getting his optimism from but I do know I could use some of that right about now because shit's hard to come by atm

[I3uster]

That's the thing dude, people always say this would be the reaction but then you have regional implementation of free community college or national polls on medicare for all and they are all popular even among republican voters.

Material reality does not always beat ideology but it has a good matchup.

[Twelveseal]

I don't know where Buster is getting his optimism from but I do know I could use some of that right about now because shit's hard to come by atm

Ain't that the truth.