General News Thread

[Twelveseal]

As I see it, there are a few ways the shutdown could end:

1. Trump gets to declare a state of emergency and make the military build the wall out of their budget.
2. McConnell uses the nuclear option and uses a partyline vote to pass the presidential budget.
3. Civil unrest forces one side to blink.
4. Someone kills Mr. Littlehands
5. Trump is impeached and removed from office.

None of this seems likely yet.

[Tobias]

2 wouldn’t work. It would have to be passed in the house as well, and Nancy is the speaker.

[RoydGolden]

My guess is that if the whole thing keeps dragging out both sides will eventually make a conciliatory but mostly meaningless agreement to save face, like "We agree border security is a serious issue that deserves our attention and resources". That way neither side has to technically back down but they can mostly keep doing whatever they were doing before.

I doubt Trump even really cares that much about the Wall in and of itself. It's more that he's backed himself into a position where he'd look weak if he concedes, which his notoriously PR-minded self would naturally hate doing. If the Dems can somehow give him an option to drop the whole thing without looking like he's backing down I think there's a high chance he'd take it.

[Mattias]

I doubt Trump even really cares that much about the Wall in and of itself. It's more that he's backed himself into a position where he'd look weak if he concedes, which his notoriously PR-minded self would naturally hate doing. If the Dems can somehow give him an option to drop the whole thing without looking like he's backing down I think there's a high chance he'd take it.

I'm pretty sure that's the bill the Dems are trying to pass today after the GOP wall funding one fails. The issue is that they already had a bill for full funding passed, 100-0, and ready to implement and Trump had a tantrum and refused to sign. So even if the Dems manage to push through another one, unless it has WALL stamped across the front they'll run into the same issue. Their only option is to either roast Trump publicly to the point his ego can't take it and he gives in, or somehow steal away enough Republicans that they can go around him. I just don't see either of those happening anytime soon, until some of the lawmakers start really losing their creature comforts.

[Twelveseal]

2 wouldn’t work. It would have to be passed in the house as well, and Nancy is the speaker.

I know. What makes me worry is the thought that Trump might try to push changes to the way Congress functions in an attempt to cut the usual process out in some way. It wouldn't normally be something I'd even consider a possibility, except that, of late, things that seemed impossible and absurd have become commonplace. With the potential support of a sympathetic Supreme Court and one of the two halves of the Legislative Branch, yet still backed into a corner... I really have no idea what he might try. Or actually do. Trump isn't exactly known for following rules, obeying laws, or listening to advisers at this point.

These are strange times we live in.

[Alternative Ice]

iirc wasn't the senate going to vote on a bill that would fund the gov til feb 9 yesterday?

[LJ3]

God knows they need it

Heard about there was a potential coup attempt that was squashed real quick

Since most of the military it seems is gonna support Maduro it probably wasn’t gonna work

But yeah, it’s awful

[RacingeR]

So yeah, in Venezuela the Supreme Court president auto-declared himself President of the Nation without any legal basis for doing so. Then the whole right-wing arc of America (the continent) went on to support him.

Because evidently, democracy as a value only really matters when it comes to USA itself, not in the nations outside!

Here's hoping Maduro wheathers this somehow, because Venezuela is straight up not equipped to handle the straight up massacre Macri, Bolsonaro, Pinieira and etc are doing in South America.

[Twelveseal]

Huh, and here I was hoping we were done with Neoconservative interventionism. Pretty sure not getting involved in any more wars abroad was something most people here were in favor of...

Maybe someone should tell them this will encourage immigration to the U.S. Both legal and otherwise.

[Strife ❤️]

North Korea-Contra

[SeiKeo]

So yeah, in Venezuela the Supreme Court president auto-declared himself President of the Nation without any legal basis for doing so.

Just for the thread, this is completely wrong: the president of the National Assembly (not the Supreme Court, which is packed by the regime) has assumed the acting presidency the opposition parties who he represents won the last free election for the Assembly in 2015. Immediately after this result, the outgoing regime majority packed the Supreme Court which immediately invalidated the seats necessary for the opposition to take their won supermajority, and then later ruled that they Assembly's powers were stripped and remanded to the court. Since holding free elections is the duty of the president of the whole republic, the current president is derelict and the constitution provides for the president of the National Assembly to assume the interim presidency while holding new elections.

[Tobias]

I know. What makes me worry is the thought that Trump might try to push changes to the way Congress functions in an attempt to cut the usual process out in some way. It wouldn't normally be something I'd even consider a possibility, except that, of late, things that seemed impossible and absurd have become commonplace. With the potential support of a sympathetic Supreme Court and one of the two halves of the Legislative Branch, yet still backed into a corner... I really have no idea what he might try. Or actually do. Trump isn't exactly known for following rules, obeying laws, or listening to advisers at this point.

These are strange times we live in.

Uh

i don’t have a morbo image immediately at hand but


CONGRESS DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY

[Mcjon01]

Sure it does, just write an executive order that says it works that way and when it gets challenged in the Supreme Court have the decision come back 5-4 “suck it libs” easy this will definitely happen

[Tobias]

I’m aware you are being sarcastic but seeing as how 12 thought that was plausible I’m going to respond anyway

The entire Supreme Court could be populated by 9 separate manifestations of the ghost of Scalia and it wouldn’t matter in the slightest. The constitution is rock solid in that the House of Representatives has the power of the purse. You cannot create a spending bill that did not pass the house. You can theoretically access some money the house has previously allotted, which trump has threatened to do by declaring an emergancy, but he cannot override the house and designate the way government is spending tax revenues without the house passing a budget allowing him to do so.

[Megas]

I know. What makes me worry is the thought that Trump might try to push changes to the way Congress functions in an attempt to cut the usual process out in some way. It wouldn't normally be something I'd even consider a possibility, except that, of late, things that seemed impossible and absurd have become commonplace. With the potential support of a sympathetic Supreme Court and one of the two halves of the Legislative Branch, yet still backed into a corner... I really have no idea what he might try. Or actually do. Trump isn't exactly known for following rules, obeying laws, or listening to advisers at this point.

These are strange times we live in.

.....wait what?

Like, I don't care how much you think Trump can ignore the rules, that kind of change would require a constitutional convention.

And if he had the support to do that we'd be in a whole additional mess of trouble

[Twelveseal]

Long story short, I need to review my civics, and that my faith in my fellow Americans and government is quite low

[Mcjon01]

[Megas]

Long story short, I need to review my civics.

I mean, if he had that much support he wouldn't have lost the house

Edit:

Oh, the text wall is gone

[Twelveseal]

I figured it'd be better to remove it. I completely forgot Constitution Conventions were a thing, for one. That in and of itself means I need to go home and become a family man XD

[I3uster]

Just for the thread, this is completely wrong: the president of the National Assembly (not the Supreme Court, which is packed by the regime) has assumed the acting presidency the opposition parties who he represents won the last free election for the Assembly in 2015. Immediately after this result, the outgoing regime majority packed the Supreme Court which immediately invalidated the seats necessary for the opposition to take their won supermajority, and then later ruled that they Assembly's powers were stripped and remanded to the court. Since holding free elections is the duty of the president of the whole republic, the current president is derelict and the constitution provides for the president of the National Assembly to assume the interim presidency while holding new elections.

this does not give him the legitimacy of a presidential election, this is basically if nancy pelosi just declared herself president because trump lost the popular vote dude

In fact the legitimization is lower because his party holds 14%

but weirdly enough he studied at an american university which i assume has nothing to do with anything