Ancient Literature Discussion (History, Myth, Philosophy &c.)

[RoydGolden]

Not necessarily the original legend, but rather why a particular legend is interpreted so commonly in a certain way: Is Odin the god of PTSD? In both Warriors Orochi and Venusblood Frontier, Odin, post-Ragnarok, is essentially the SMT version of Yahweh. Playable Odin in VBF literally had to seal away her memories (and mammaries) to avoid becoming that way (which she remembers in full in chaos route). Both works use Odin to show how the horrors of war can screw up someone. Is that a coincidence or something from the original legend?

Odin is a god of battle-madness, but I'd never heard of PTSD in particular, so I'd say no. Sounds more like a case of modern authors putting their own spin...

[Zork Knight]

We do have a very distinct view of war than our predecessors afterall

Though it should go back around in about 28000 years

[Kabalisto Koga]

I started digging throught the "YHWH was originally a polytheistic deity"* thing, so I finished the Baal's Cycle and some other things about Ugaritic-Phoenician + Old Testament myths, and... I like it. The whole thing about the Rise and Fall of Baal as random god, then the king, then a demon (and YHWH as new king), his rivalry with Mot (The Death), the relationship with Ashera and yandere Anath etc.

*Pslam 81 (Old Testament)

could you tell me your sources where you did read them as i would have two lostbbelt ideas that have something to do with those Pantheon/mythospehres ?

[Kabalisto Koga]

reminder that the Abrahamic/Yahwehistic religions are a branch of the Mesopotamian pantheon/religion. which retrospectively mean Mesopotamia religion is technically the most dominate in the world right now, albeit in a monotheistic fashion.

all heil god-king gilgamesh

Actual not exactly as the Abrahamic Religion that later got/has named themmselves Jews did formed in the Israelic Reegion that was at that called Canaan and the Maingod at that time of the Israelics was El like their Name(To El belonging) until Yahweh cult was introduced and grew bigger until it was the greatest Cult as Yahweh was like Indices are imply a souther Arabic God with the Dominions of Storm and War as at that time almost evey tribe or City had theiro wn deity like Assyria the God Ashur , Hadi of the Urartu or the God Marduk of Sumeria/Babylon had all similar Dominion at the start . though i must admio that alone from the source MAterial we know the Pantheon of the Masopthamian the best .

[Mattias]

Odin is a god of battle-madness, but I'd never heard of PTSD in particular, so I'd say no. Sounds more like a case of modern authors putting their own spin...

Someone probably saw the eyepatch and assumed war trauma.

[Wallacia]

Not necessarily the original legend, but rather why a particular legend is interpreted so commonly in a certain way: Is Odin the god of PTSD? In both Warriors Orochi and Venusblood Frontier, Odin, post-Ragnarok, is essentially the SMT version of Yahweh. Playable Odin in VBF literally had to seal away her memories (and mammaries) to avoid becoming that way (which she remembers in full in chaos route). Both works use Odin to show how the horrors of war can screw up someone. Is that a coincidence or something from the original legend?

oh definitely, that remark wasn't to imply that Yahweh should or would be identified/associated with his Mesopotamia statue and its context/background even with his monotheistic persona in current era. for the average believer, all of that could be a coincidence for all that matter, even if you try to convince them that their faith is borrowed from another, and wasn't exactly original. this is also why i said branched rather than is.

Actual not exactly as the Abrahamic Religion that later got/has named themmselves Jews did formed in the Israelic Reegion that was at that called Canaan and the Maingod at that time of the Israelics was El like their Name(To El belonging) until Yahweh cult was introduced and grew bigger until it was the greatest Cult as Yahweh was like Indices are imply a souther Arabic God with the Dominions of Storm and War as at that time almost evey tribe or City had theiro wn deity like Assyria the God Ashur , Hadi of the Urartu or the God Marduk of Sumeria/Babylon had all similar Dominion at the start . though i must admio that alone from the source MAterial we know the Pantheon of the Masopthamian the best .

i'm not sure what you're talking about but if i get it right, but yes judaism was the first Yahwehistic religion, as the ancient Israelites picked him up as their national deity, despite his minor statue in the mesopotamian pantheon. i can second that mesopotamian pantheon is the coolest.

with all that said, i'm kinda disappointed some of you have interpreted that line analytically rather than the joshing remark it is, i expect more goofing from you!

[Wallacia]

i always found it amusing how with all the technology we have, people still can't decipher ancient languages unless it takes them decades of research. heck, estrucan has been documented for like, what now? 300 years? and it's still almost as mysterious

[LegalLoliLover]

Odin is a god of battle-madness, but I'd never heard of PTSD in particular, so I'd say no. Sounds more like a case of modern authors putting their own spin...

Well, wasn't the term "battle madness" used when the term, PTSD, didn't exist? Wait, that was battle fatigue. Obviously, shell shock wouldn't make sense during a pre-bomb era.

[NMR-3]

i always found it amusing how with all the technology we have, people still can't decipher ancient languages unless it takes them decades of research. heck, estrucan has been documented for like, what now? 300 years? and it's still almost as mysterious

Modern technology can't fully translate modern languages which have millions of speakers. It's not particularly surprising that older languages, of which we have only limited fragments and vocabularies etc, aren't easy to decipher. Language is hard.

[Wallacia]

hot take: if what we refer to as humans are a ''kind'' of ape-like people from the family tree that is the homo genus, are we then the humans of now not different from the humans of then, by that, can we say that the early homo sapiens are the same as we the modern sapiens or are we too a different divergence from that as well and if so, wouldn't it be accurate to say that ''humanity'' isn't a single race, but rather a multitude of closely related human races?

dunno what i just typed, ignore it if it's too insensible. that said, back to the on going topic

- - - Updated - - -

Modern technology can't fully translate modern languages which have millions of speakers. It's not particularly surprising that older languages, of which we have only limited fragments and vocabularies etc, aren't easy to decipher. Language is hard.

honestly, with what DeepL have shown us of being capable of, i would say it's more of the public tech being ''cheap'' rather than ''inadequate'', as the tech has shown us to be capable of translating languages ''adequately''. i wait for the day when ''languages'' are obsolete and humanity has a universal language that is machine translation with impatience. screw languages. you would think that the specialized computer programmers would have figured out by now how to digitize linguistic methodology but nope.

[Kabalisto Koga]

oh definitely, that remark wasn't to imply that Yahweh should or would be identified/associated with his Mesopotamia statue and its context/background even with his monotheistic persona in current era. for the average believer, all of that could be a coincidence for all that matter, even if you try to convince them that their faith is borrowed from another, and wasn't exactly original. this is also why i said branched rather than is.

i'm not sure what you're talking about but if i get it right, but yes judaism was the first Yahwehistic religion, as the ancient Israelites picked him up as their national deity, despite his minor statue in the mesopotamian pantheon. i can second that mesopotamian pantheon is the coolest.

with all that said, i'm kinda disappointed some of you have interpreted that line analytically rather than the joshing remark it is, i expect more goofing from you!

I meant that Yahweh isnt actually belonging to the Mesopotamian /Hurrian-HEthitic Domain instead he was before a god of the southern semitic tribes and came through the Karavans and concurring tribes to the canaanitic Region and after a while did the new introduced Cult came into conflict with the older and traditionic Baal centred culture and that after awhile this conflict caused the israelitic War with the philistines which were actually not
"aggressors" as depicted in my Theory and model are they actually those that wanted to help their suppressed Brothers and Sisters (of faith) and wanted to defend their Home from the new Invasors .

[LegalLoliLover]

Someone probably saw the eyepatch and assumed war trauma.

Huh. I actually don't know any version of Odin who wears an eye patch. High School DxD one has a monocle. Venusblood one has heterochromia, and Warriors Orochi one just keeps his eyelids closed on his empty socket and cover that with his hat.

[Wallacia]

ragnarok manga?

[LegalLoliLover]

Which one? I was about to assume the one based on the MMO, but when I googled "Ragnarok manga" I got several results.

[Wallacia]

record of ragnarok but of course

[LegalLoliLover]

I love how He Man barely did anything historically, but the main reason that he keeps being mentioned is nothing more than his meme-worthy name.

[LegalLoliLover]

By the way, what was the name of that poem that took place during the US's expansion westward, during the construction of the railroads? The plot was that originally, migrant workers were hired to build them, but then they were being replaced by more efficient machines. However, there was 1 worker who apparently could hammer nails in better than the machines, but in the end, he still ended up dead.

[Mattias]

John Henry? Big black guy that they based Steel off of when they had the death of Superman storyline?

[LegalLoliLover]

Yeah, him. Thank you kindly. Basically, the American version of the more traditional samurai's "final struggle" against the rifle and the more versatile samurai able to use them.

[Tarlo]

could you tell me your sources where you did read them as i would have two lostbbelt ideas that have something to do with those Pantheon/mythospehres ?

I know that's like one month later anyway, the baal cycle is pretty easy to find with google, like https://emp.byui.edu/satterfieldb/ug...of%20Baal.html

for Essays regarding Baal and Ashera there're a ton on https://www.academia.edu/