Fate/Grand Order - English

[SpoonyViking]

So, just for confirmation: in spite of Sigurd's higher Attack, Lancelot is still a better single-target Saber because of his battery and his critfishing, right?

[Strange_One]

I hereby declare I was handicapped slightly as Seiba (Edgy) straight up murdered the damage trial wave and prevented her from properly getting in crits.

Really? My Siegfried got more than that at NP1.

Weirdly enough, he did way less damage when I used George to turn Tesla into a dragon. I guess Semiramis's 50% Buster Resist Down on all three targets is worth more than having a third target for 80% Anti-Dragon.

Strange indeed. You had Anti Dragon skill at 9 as well right?

Had I more time, I woulda tried more combos. There was that Atk up diminishing returns thing, I don't have highly skilled Buster up skills.

[ttestagr]

she also has 30% np up on jp
also this chart is massively misleading lol summermedb
while knowing the boost value of single servants is nice its always about total buff combination of attack/def * card * crit/np/power

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tamamo actually has the worst combo of big 3 because arts have little to no attack ups
so overloading on arts/np up doesnt result in superior damage compared to more balanced quick or buster strategies

Arts DPS has plenty of attack up. Even in classes where there are only 5 or 6 arts units you'll have some who have a charisma equivalent. Attack up is pretty much the most common damage buff in the game, while NP damage up is one of the rarest, much less 3 turn versions on 5 turn cooldowns.

No choice but to stan any data that has Osakabehime beating Merlin tbh

Don't underestimate Neethime. She has a defense down that goes up to 40% and once her NP buff drops she'll give quick and buster 30% up for 3 turns. Its unfortunate that you have to use her NP beforehand, but she does a lot of work for those who use her.

np damage is low tier anyway, crit damage is where the big numbers shine and bustercrits rule that domain

Crit damage only gets big numbers with stacked 100% crit up skills. If you want to go to town, using a maxed Black Grail will offer the greatest damage boost in regular play and NPs get such a huge multiplier for good ones that they will beat out crits anyway. NPs are also the only way to quickly farm, 99% of the game experience.

So, just for confirmation: in spite of Sigurd's higher Attack, Lancelot is still a better single-target Saber because of his battery and his critfishing, right?

Sigurd has a higher attack, a more powerful crit damage buff, and a 1 turn buster steroid. He has no battery or star pull skill to easily apply those skills however and limited defensive ability. Saberlot is all offense, but he has a battery and star pull skill so you can focus on defensive support for him without losing out on much.

Overall Saberlot is easier to use, Sigurd has a more powerful ceiling if you have the account to take advantage of it.

[Aozaki-desu]

No choice but to stan any data that has Osakabehime beating Merlin tbh

i mean given you can afford firing Osakabe NP and you only need 1 turn damage (because her defdown is 1 turn) she is indeed really, really good
still her conditions are relevant basically never

Arts DPS has plenty of attack up. Even in classes where there are only 5 or 6 arts units you'll have some who have a charisma equivalent. Attack up is pretty much the most common damage buff in the game, while NP damage up is one of the rarest, much less 3 turn versions on 5 turn cooldowns.

there is a notorious lack of attack ups in arts supports. Tamamo has none, gil only has 20, lan ling only has 20, paracelsus has none, even nero bride caps out at 40
and since black grail is a thing, typical double tamamo has 100 arts and 60 np before black grail and no attack whatsoever which is horribly imbalanced when compared to 100quick/60defdown skadi2 and 40atk/100buster merlin2

NP damage, by its nature, is a second-tier buff while attack and card ups are first tier

np damage is low tier anyway, crit damage is where the big numbers shine and bustercrits rule that domain

incredibly wrong
np strats are easier and more efficient to play than any crits because you dont rely on the deck

[Tamamo-no-Mae Goshujin-sama]

Skadi is tied for number 1 in total potential damage buffs even today in JP outside of one rng max roll. When combining a 50% battery, her role is basically a combo of Waver's immediate NP provide and better than Merlin's damage buffs for NP. When you also consider that Quick Servants have more powerful NPs to compensate for lower card damage, it really is a brutal combo.

Rank	Servant	Damage Increase	Requeriments
1	Summer Medb (Highroll)	104%	Use NP (Single Target), Art NP
2	Tamamo	95%	Art NP
2	Skadi	95%	Quick NP
4	Caster Gilgamesh	83.3%	Use NP, Art NP
5	Osakabehime	82%	Single Target, Use NP, Quick or Buster NP
6	Merlin	80%	Buster NP
6	Lanling	80%	Use NP, Art NP
6	Summer Medb (Average)	80%	Use NP, Art NP
9	Mozart	72.8%	Use NP (RNG), Art NP
10	Reines	70%	Use NP
10	Medb	70%	Single Target, Male DD
12	Murasaki	69%	Demonic Target
12	Santa Nightingale	69%	Use NP
12	Kiara	69%	Single Target, Art NP
15	Summer Raikou	68%	Buster NP
15	Wu Zetian	68%	Single Target, Quick NP
17	Barthollomew Roberts	60.3%	Use NP
18	Elizabeth	60%	Single Target, Female DD
18	Waver	60%	Use NP
18	Nero Bride	60%	Use NP (Single Target)
18	Mata Hari	60%	Single Target, Use NP
18	Stheno	60%	Use NP (Single Target)
18	Moriarty	60%	Use NP (Single Target), Evil DD
24	Quetzalcoatl	57.3%	Buster NP

source: https://www.reddit.com/r/grandorder/...mage_supports/

Sorry this is a little confusing to me but is this saying Summer Medb has the strongest single target attack? If so why don't I hear about people using her with Tamamo and Caster Gil more? All 3 combined should reach 282.3 % right, since the 2 casters can increase others? Sorry about this but I was originally planing to not summon this summer banner but if Summer Medb can be a an Arts boss killer I may reconsider.

[Wandering Swordwoman]

What's the command code do?

[ttestagr]

i mean given you can afford firing Osakabe NP and you only need 1 turn damage (because her defdown is 1 turn) she is indeed really, really good
still her conditions are relevant basically never


there is a notorious lack of attack ups in arts supports. Tamamo has none, gil only has 20, lan ling only has 20, paracelsus has none, even nero bride caps out at 40
and since black grail is a thing, typical double tamamo has 100 arts and 60 np before black grail and no attack whatsoever which is horribly imbalanced when compared to 100quick/60defdown skadi2 and 40atk/100buster merlin2

NP damage, by its nature, is a second-tier buff while attack and card ups are first tier


incredibly wrong
np strats are easier and more efficient to play than any crits because you dont rely on the deck

That is not something I agree with. Card damage always affects a limited number of a Servant's attacks, its why the buffs for it tend to get higher than attack up. NP damage up effects less things, but it also offers boost for Servant's most powerful and useful attack. You mention the supports, but both Bride and Gil are pretty much the next best arts support. As long as you have them at an average amount the difference in results is marginal. Hence both Neethime and Merlin adding up to 70% but the multiplicative bonus being only 80-82%. If you are worrying about that level of buff, the rng of low and high rolls are worse concerns. Not to mention the most used Mystic Code also offers 30% attack up, and its pretty much a staple in any looping setup without superscope.

Tamamo's specific setups are just as competitive to anything buster or quick put out and she already has good tools for the job with more exceptional ones being added. Chen Gong is coming after all, the caster who can farm 180k hp riders much less other classes or assassins.

Sorry this is a little confusing to me but is this saying Summer Medb has the strongest single target attack? If so why don't I hear about people using her with Tamamo and Caster Gil more? All 3 combined should reach 282.3 % right, since the 2 casters can increase others? Sorry about this but I was originally planing to not summon this summer banner but if Summer Medb can be a an Arts boss killer I may reconsider.

Medb is rng. She has 20% in each arts resist down and attack up for team. Her NP has a rng mechanic where each hit has a 60-100% chance based on overcharge to apply defense down on target. It maxes out at 50%. That result is rare, and it is also possible to whiff each attempt and get no damage boost from it. the only really reliable way to guarantee it is with Edison and the Demonic Bodhisattva CE. Potentially fun, not really worth it unless you want to mess around a bit.

[Aozaki-desu]

That is not something I agree with. Card damage always affects a limited number of a Servant's attacks, its why the buffs for it tend to get higher than attack up. NP damage up effects less things, but it also offers boost for Servant's most powerful and useful attack. You mention the supports, but both Bride and Gil are pretty much the next best arts support. As long as you have them at an average amount the difference in results is marginal. Hence both Neethime and Merlin adding up to 70% but the multiplicative bonus being only 80-82%. If you are worrying about that level of buff, the rng of low and high rolls are worse concerns. Not to mention the most used Mystic Code also offers 30% attack up, and its pretty much a staple in any looping setup without superscope.

Tamamo's specific setups are just as competitive to anything buster or quick put out and she already has good tools for the job with more exceptional ones being added. Chen Gong is coming after all, the caster who can farm 180k hp riders much less other classes or assassins.

you cant disagree with the damage formula, it doesnt have an opinion

it very specifically goes ATK * CARD * POWER and its max is reached when all multipliers are equally balanced
2 * 2 * 2 = 8
1 * 2 * 3 = 6
where POWER is composite of NP-up (for NPs), crit-up (for crits) and power-up (for both)
since NPup is but an element of POWER rather than its own thing, it is, by nature, inferior than ATK and CARD buffs, in general. That and also the fact that it only affects NP instead of (all main color cards) and (all cards)
and in any situation where PowerUp is involved value of NPup is reduced further proportionally to the amount of PowerUp gained

as such, Tamamo is indeed inferior to the other, and double tamamo is not always even guaranteed to be peak damage setup, unlike say double merlin or double skadi

***

unrelated but CG does not reach 180k of halved damage under normal conditions that sounds like a bogus number
neutral sure, but not halved

[SpoonyViking]

Overall Saberlot is easier to use, Sigurd has a more powerful ceiling if you have the account to take advantage of it.

I see! I'll leave Lancelot as my support Saber, then, especially since his skills are maxed and his NP rank is 2, not just 1. Thanks!

[Deathhappens]

I don't know how the duck people had 10/10/10 Skadis out day 1, but I sincerely hope nobody's expecting me to put her up at any point in the near future. QP costs aside, wtf are these mat requirements? She needs some of every single new mat...

[Pendant]

I don't know how the duck people had 10/10/10 Skadis out day 1, but I sincerely hope nobody's expecting me to put her up at any point in the near future. QP costs aside, wtf are these mat requirements? She needs some of every single new mat...

It's not like NA people didn't know she was a long time coming and had ample time to prepare or anything.

[Deathhappens]

The only way to prepare this stuff (since there hasn't been an event with these mats yet) would be to actually go out and farm those mats in the LB themselves. I sincerely hope you don't do this.

[Pendant]

I didn't. A lot of people did tho

[Deathhappens]

It's a meme (I know people did this tho, and it's sad considering you put up an extraordinary amount of effort to gather mats for a Servant you might not end up rolling).

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Not that I'm one to talk, I once spammed Assassin Embers in preparation for King Hassan and ended up feeding them to Serenity.

[CO9p5JMGv!p9]

incredibly wrong
np strats are easier and more efficient to play than any crits because you dont rely on the deck

did I say anything about ease or efficiency? it's just unga bunga big numbers and bustercrits clearly win that contest

I don't know how the duck people had 10/10/10 Skadis out day 1, but I sincerely hope nobody's expecting me to put her up at any point in the near future. QP costs aside, wtf are these mat requirements? She needs some of every single new mat...

I started saving mats for her since the start of the year, so it wasn't too hard. skillet skadis have a grace period until gilfest but when the macro farming begins, they will get purged.

[Deathhappens]

That's fine, I'm not gonna put her up until she's done anyway.

[Aozaki-desu]

The only way to prepare this stuff (since there hasn't been an event with these mats yet) would be to actually go out and farm those mats in the LB themselves. I sincerely hope you don't do this.

its not actually that much farming if you save story rewards from lb2, its mostly just aurora steel farming

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did I say anything about ease or efficiency? it's just unga bunga big numbers and bustercrits clearly win that contest

no they dont
fishing for unga bunga buster crits requires you to roll the crits in your deck on first turn which isnt fun even on bbb servants
and unless you roll bbb (which is UNLIKELY) turn one you will in fact not outdamage an NP
NPs are supreme choice, you only go NPBB if you cant ohko
because fuck card fishing

[Pendant]

its not actually that much farming if you save story rewards from lb2, its mostly just aurora steel farming

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no they dont
fishing for unga bunga buster crits requires you to roll the crits in your deck on first turn which isnt fun even on bbb servants
and unless you roll bbb (which is UNLIKELY) turn one you will in fact not outdamage an NP
NPs are supreme choice, you only go NPBB if you cant ohko
because fuck card fishing

A change I would like to see added. Is for them to make it so that past the first clear of a CQ (the one that nets you your lore) for it to allow you to select your starting hand. It's a dead quest anyway at that point, you can't even get bond or anything from it so why not make it less frustrating on players

[CO9p5JMGv!p9]

fishing for unga bunga buster crits requires you to roll the crits in your deck on first turn which isnt fun even on bbb servants
and unless you roll bbb (which is UNLIKELY) turn one you will in fact not outdamage an NP
NPs are supreme choice, you only go NPBB if you cant ohko
because fuck card fishing

did you just ignore the part about efficiency? of course it's not efficient, it still gives the biggest numbers

[Aozaki-desu]

did you ignore the part about NP giving the biggest number?