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Thread: Unpopular TM opinions you have

  1. #7281
    リビングデッド Living Dead TheSkipRow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AsGryffynn View Post
    It's literally called the "Gate of Bullshit" for a good reason: it's bullshit Gil can use to get away of situation X, Y, Z with little issue. GoB and Avalon are essentially "Deus Ex Glittery Air" and "plot shield" enbodied.

    When Nasu introduces a single universal force that, when applied in enough amounts, can shatter concepts/NPs/whatever, we will talk, since it means even the setting no longer tolerates using bullshit "I believe!" rubbish to get out of a bad situation and the good guys can actually lose without a loss being a bad thing.
    To be fair, a lot of Servants would be stupidly overpowered if they got to use their powers creatively or properly.

  2. #7282
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors Alternative Ice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ratman View Post
    To prove me wrong all you have to do is point out any kind of controversy they went all in on. DEmiya doesn't count, they didn't know.
    Wasn't there an fgo event set in 1945 that caused some controversy when it was announced?
    Quote Originally Posted by Nasu
    I don't care if it doesn't make sense. I don't have any intent of making it make sense.

  3. #7283
    I told 'em, I told 'em. Bugrit! eddyak's Avatar
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    That was this one, a few Koreans heard the number 1945 and started up a Twitter anger masturbation party without knowing what the event was.

    By "this one", I meant Guda 3, which is about to start on NA.
    Last edited by eddyak; June 2nd, 2020 at 12:16 PM.
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  4. #7284
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six pinetree's Avatar
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    Yeah and the controversy was just about the year, nothing about what was written or shown.

    While I agree TM won't ever go into nazis in FGO, I think Ratman is being too extreme. The fanbase's excitement over a series on the Stay Night timeline that can be marketed as a prequel to Zero would overwhelm any amount of pushback they'd get for nazi villains to the point that any drama would be irrelevant.

    Regardless, I honestly doubt TM will ever bother with the Third War.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Besides, I don't even think nazi would be that relevant. They'd be mentioned occasionally and there'd be, like, a single edgy man negotiating with Darnic, who then dies a horrible death.

  5. #7285
    The Greatest Cool Reign's Avatar
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    Aren't Nazis pretty prominent in the Koha-Ace Grail War?

  6. #7286
    Quote Originally Posted by Bobin View Post
    I feel like attempting to quantify GoB in the context of powerlevels is a diseased train of thought since narratively how it represents Gil as a Heroic Spirit and an extension of himself matters way more than detail of its described content in any case.

    Like, knowing whatever he has in there isn’t going to stop him from jobbing or steamrolling and people incessantly calling out on it. That’s why justifying his win or lose according to his mood and status as the King of Heroes matters more above anything else and why I don’t have much a problem with the design of GoB since it reflect Gil in that aspect perfectly imo
    See you can say all you want bout how it represents him as a HS, problem is nasu blatantly uses it as a powerlevel stick, plus the issue in that FSN and even occasionally now they act like he had all this stuff in life and only sometimes say its retroactive, even in CCC they say he IN LIFE collected human knowledge.

    Honestly a lot of post FSN gil feels like a blatant patching of GoB and trying to finesse it with several different mutually exclusive ideas since they act like he had most of it in life as i said above.

    GoB is the black lotus of noble phantasms

  7. #7287
    love warrior <3 world-0 the god of world-0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Byegod View Post
    See you can say all you want bout how it represents him as a HS, problem is nasu blatantly uses it as a powerlevel stick, plus the issue in that FSN and even occasionally now they act like he had all this stuff in life and only sometimes say its retroactive, even in CCC they say he IN LIFE collected human knowledge.

    Honestly a lot of post FSN gil feels like a blatant patching of GoB and trying to finesse it with several different mutually exclusive ideas since they act like he had most of it in life as I said above.

    GoB is the black lotus of noble phantasms
    Hey, nothing wrong with a power level stick if it's used properly. And it is used properly in FSN and Zero. Heck, I say even Strange fake is doing a good job with it.
    As I said, it's almost like Nasu could not predict just how big fate would become, or how many more times gil would have to show up.


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  8. #7288
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six pinetree's Avatar
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    How is it used as a powerlevel stick when it gets defeated by trickery and compatibility in the very first work it appears in? GoB is representative of Gil as an HS because Gil as an HS is meant to be the most powerful, still, GoB is never used as the definitive win condition of Gilgamesh's most decisive fights, only working in scenes designed to build up him as a threat and the heroes as underdogs. Time and time again, GoB is defeated not by being weaker, but by trickery or compatibility in match-ups.

    I don't see how any of what you said about Gate of Babylon is mutually exclusive when the NP itself is all about being inclusive of everything. Collecting treasures in life and acquiring them retroactively as a Heroic Spirit are not mutually exclusive concepts, they are cause and consequence.

    Gilgamesh has a literal powerlevel stick already so I don't see why your problem is with GoB specifically.

  9. #7289
    Gorgeous~! Happy~! Elegant~! Bobin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Byegod View Post
    See you can say all you want bout how it represents him as a HS, problem is nasu blatantly uses it as a powerlevel stick, plus the issue in that FSN and even occasionally now they act like he had all this stuff in life and only sometimes say its retroactive, even in CCC they say he IN LIFE collected human knowledge.

    Honestly a lot of post FSN gil feels like a blatant patching of GoB and trying to finesse it with several different mutually exclusive ideas since they act like he had most of it in life as i said above.

    GoB is the black lotus of noble phantasms
    I'm kinda at a lost at what examples you seem to be thinking of. Like, imo God Hand is an offender of being a powerlevel measuring stick, but I'm not seeing how the same has ever applied to GoB in a specific context.
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  10. #7290
    Quote Originally Posted by Bobin View Post
    I'm kinda at a lost at what examples you seem to be thinking of. Like, imo God Hand is an offender of being a powerlevel measuring stick, but I'm not seeing how the same has ever applied to GoB in a specific context.
    Sorry, for some reason all my explanations come out as muddled

    It's less measuring stick and more "GoB is why he's so strong" and then nasu adds more shit to gil to wank him like super clairvoyance and 'he has everything past and future' and that part has barely come up since CCC

    If memory serves doesnt gil say in the ubw anime he doesnt have god hand

  11. #7291
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six pinetree's Avatar
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    IMO a super clairvoyance that doesn't factor into any demonstrations of how strong he is doesn't count as an addition to justify him being the strongest.

  12. #7292
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six Zork Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Byegod View Post
    Sorry, for some reason all my explanations come out as muddled

    It's less measuring stick and more "GoB is why he's so strong" and then nasu adds more shit to gil to wank him like super clairvoyance and 'he has everything past and future' and that part has barely come up since CCC

    If memory serves doesnt gil say in the ubw anime he doesnt have god hand
    God Hand is a sacred treasure, but not a treasure treasure.

  13. #7293
    Quote Originally Posted by pinetree View Post
    IMO a super clairvoyance that doesn't factor into any demonstrations of how strong he is doesn't count as an addition to justify him being the strongest.
    IT felt like it to me, or at least it makse him jobbing even worse to me as i feel the 'too prideful' excuse gets a bit old after a few times.

    What would a more accurate gil look like, not in looks but more items and abilities, clairvoyance and a axe?

  14. #7294
    I told 'em, I told 'em. Bugrit! eddyak's Avatar
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    More like, God Hand is a concept, rather than a physical object. The nature of GoB as a literal vault almost precludes any non-tangible treasures.

    He has all the heroes' Noble Phantasms (or their origins, if they count as a treasure), but he doesn't have their blessings of the fae, or their inborn gifts, or their innate skills.

    It's powerful, but it isn't game-breaking. He's almost guaranteed to have a weapon or poison or alcohol or just a treasure that suits your specific weaknesses that he can use to kill you, but he himself almost definitely isn't gonna wield it, and in any case, GoB doesn't have an amazing track record of killing heroes. Berserkerlot takes a good spray head-on and comes out unscratched, Saber takes a few waves and survives, several times, Archer survives being pincushioned, Medea takes a continuous barrage of weapons for ages and ages, Herc kept the fight going for a good while, even while defending Illya, Cu survived twelve hours of GoB barrage.
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  15. #7295
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors Menwearpink's Avatar
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    It is absolutely gamebreaking.

    regardless he probably has things that can provide or enact curses too tbh

  16. #7296
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six forumghost's Avatar
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    Hey, remember that time he pulled a set of Command Seals out of his vault because of course he has a bunch of spell-tattoo's in there?

  17. #7297
    闇色の六王権 The Dark Six Zork Knight's Avatar
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    I suppose there's a big difference between actually activating a Noble Phantasm and just launching it at someone.

  18. #7298
    I told 'em, I told 'em. Bugrit! eddyak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menwearpink View Post
    It is absolutely gamebreaking.

    regardless he probably has things that can provide or enact curses too tbh
    Not really- he can pull one specific thing at a time and use it, or he can just toss a bunch of crap at random. There's some middle ground there, but it's not as if he can pull a Zerkerlot and pull out an axe, fight a top tier hero with it, let them get used to fighting that weapon, and then insta-switch it out with a spear and murderise them. He's also not super good with any weapon we've seen him use so far. Gate of Babylon isn't the end-all be-all of Noble Phantasms- it's incredibly dangerous, but then so is literally any Saber class hero with any sharp metal implement.

    He'll only have curse thingies if they qualify as a treasure, or something something humanity original. He's probably got cursed amulet type dealies, or Jafar's hypnosis snake staff or somesuch, but he isn't gonna open GoB and whoops! You've got Magic HIV! Guess you're dead now!
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  19. #7299
    死徒二十七祖 The Twenty Seven Dead Apostle Ancestors AAM1232's Avatar
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    I mean that's underselling Saber's problems in Fate but sure, it's not gamebreaking.

  20. #7300
    love warrior <3 world-0 the god of world-0's Avatar
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    It's a game-changer, for sure. Like a newbie player with a premium account, he has a lot of overpowered items that he has absolutely no idea how to use and, as such, he will end up having his but kicked by someone who either knows how to deal with it (Lancelot) or has the means to counter it with the same (Shirou). That's why he has his actual Cheats (Ea and Enuma Elish).


    here is a list of my servant sheets(new and improved format for my servant sheets)

    Come explore the White Library, and reach the bottom of this Abyss
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