Unpopular TM opinions you have

[Bookworm Luke]

FGO doesn't have SF in it so I don't know what you're talking about. And FSN is barely referenced, it doesn't even have a collab like Zero or Requiem.

Enkidu is Strange Fake. All Stay Night and Zero servants are there. Voyager and stuff are from Requiem.

I mean when you're not doing anything to support an argument how am I supposed to take it seriously?

I mean, the stuff you are posting are literally telling you Nasu's retconing. What am I supposed to tell you.
Even your trump card is actually an incorrectly parsed translation.

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That was not a rule tho. It's not something established in-universe, just Nasu's own "taboo" as a writer. Back then it's "Ok I will only use legendary figures with vague background to have gray areas to work with". But FGO needs a large amount of servants as a gacha game, so he has to break that personal taboo and went "I have no choice but to use those with extremely young and detailed history". Of course it would upset people, even if later on it is revealed that Voyager become a heroic spirit through worship of some future cult, similar to how the spaceships of a different universe became known as Olympian Gods. But it's more "I don't like the excuses Nasu had to use to justify this happening to stay consistent" than "Nasu retconned things and it made FSN less good".

I was thinking it made FSN less good.

But Nasu said FGO is a separate universe, so I am OK with it.

[AAM1232]

It isn't? Unless you think Japanese grammar involves mid sentence contradictions and apart from that have nothing more than vague handwringing to back it up.

Enkidu being in SF doesn't put SF in FGO, he was an explicit special case that was allowed since SF is still incomplete. I'll wait until the collab to say otherwise, like Requiem, Zero and KnK.

[Lily Emilio]

But Nasu said FGO is a separate universe, so I am OK with it.

It has always been that way from the start tho. FGO is a "what-if" of Clock Tower 2015. What if Lev Flauros did not choose to commit suicide but follow through with his predetermined 3000+ years old destiny. So in the first place it is a different world. There are certain similar background settings between Fate works like the servants, but there are also differences, and it has always been that way. FSN is contained within its own world group, Extra is within its own world group where there's an alien cube on the Moon and Shinji is an 8 years old, FGO is within its own world group and there were only 1 Fuyuki HGW instead of 5, as far as the story goes.

[Bookworm Luke]

It isn't? Unless you think Japanese grammar involves mid sentence contradictions and apart from that have nothing more than vague handwringing to back it up.

I don't think, I was helping translating Nasuverse stuff. I think I have a pretty good grasp of Nasu-ism.

Enkidu being in SF doesn't put SF in FGO, he was an explicit special case that was allowed since SF is still incomplete. I'll wait until the collab to say otherwise, like Requiem, Zero and KnK.

Well, OK sure.

[AAM1232]

Doesn't seem like it tbh. Opinions =/= reality.

[Bookworm Luke]

It has always been that way from the start tho. FGO is a "what-if" of Clock Tower 2015. What if Lev Flauros did not choose to commit suicide but follow through with his predetermined 3000+ years old destiny. So in the first place it is a different world. There are certain similar background settings between Fate works like the servants, but there are also differences, and it has always been that way. FSN is contained within its own world group, Extra is within its own world group where there's an alien cube on the Moon and Shinji is an 8 years old, FGO is within its own world group and there were only 1 Fuyuki HGW instead of 5, as far as the story goes.

Well, I was thinking because Throne of Heroes is outside of time, FGO would still be connected to FSN.
But Nasu is saying they are conceptually incompatible.

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Doesn't seem like it tbh. Opinions =/= reality.

You are literally using opinion to reject reality.
I am literally staring at the Japanese and it does not say what you are using it to claim.

[AAM1232]

I doubt that, considering I posted the JP text and a better TL than Mirror Moon.

[Mattias]

Because Caster is the dumping class for intellectuals. Scientists like Edison and Babbage, writers like Hans and Shakespeare...

Except Tesla, who's an Archer for some reason which I assume boils down to Independent Action = Unrecognized while alive.

[You]

Except Tesla, who's an Archer for some reason which I assume boils down to Independent Action = Unrecognized while alive.

It’s because he shoots lightning, a projectile. Yes it’s dumb.

[Bookworm Luke]

I doubt that, considering I posted the JP text and a better TL than Mirror Moon.

Uhh, no...
I can tell you it's not a better translation, and I read your JP text.
Also, you probably read a lot of stuff I translated if you are using the BL circulated translated materials.

[AAM1232]

Except Tesla, who's an Archer for some reason which I assume boils down to Independent Action = Unrecognized while alive.

From his mats on System Keraunos:

System・Keraunos.
Something that the great achievements of his lifetime and the mystery from a large number of supernatural myths sublimated into.
The ability to manipulate electromagnetism. It possesses such a might, that people are given the impression as if it was the second coming of the Gods of Lightning and Thunder mentioned in a multitude of myths and legends.
Generally, it launches an attack by the means of electromagnetic projection. The existence of this long-distance attack is what qualifies Nikola Tesla, who's originally not a Heroic Spirit that possess a bow or any sort of shooting weapon, as an Archer.

[Lily Emilio]

Well, I was thinking because Throne of Heroes is outside of time, FGO would still be connected to FSN.
But Nasu is saying they are conceptually incompatible.

Throne of Heroes being outside of time only means that stuffs like Voyager exists in the throne as part of the general setting. Even after knowing he exists in the throne, you can't summon him with FSN's grail anyways due to him being outside of its summoning range, so why bother?

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It’s because he shoots lightning, a projectile. Yes it’s dumb.

But is it as dumb as Sei Shonagon and her HEIAN BEAMU?

[AAM1232]

Uhh, no...
I can tell you it's not a better translation, and I read your JP text.
Also, you probably read a lot of stuff I translated if you are using the BL circulated translated materials.

Uh huh, which is why the rest of the text around that part repeats the idea that there is no real limit on the timeframe from which HS can be summoned.

[Bookworm Luke]

Throne of Heroes being outside of time only means that stuffs like Voyager exists in the throne as part of the general setting. Even after knowing he exists in the throne, you can't summon him with FSN's grail anyways due to him being outside of its summoning range, so why bother?

I don't know, I am just stubborn like that.

I don't want FGO on my FSN lawn, and I am happy with Nasu's explanation lol.

[Bookworm Luke]

Uh huh, which is why the rest of the text around that part repeats the idea that there is no real limit on the timeframe from which HS can be summoned.

I mean, you are the one who brought it up like it's definitive proof.

I don't get anything from it. It's been beaten to death in BL over the years. It is what it is. It's the in-universe excuse of not summoning modern dudes.

[AAM1232]

I mean, you are the one who brought it up like it's definitive proof.

I don't get anything from it. It's been beaten to death in BL over the years. It is what it is. It's the in-universe excuse of not summoning modern dudes.

It is better than the inconsistency mid sentence and paragraphs you seem to support. "Irrelevant of era" is apparently a waste of space, as is later on "Heroic Spirits of every era".

Of course, this is all with the caveat that Rin is right here. And past discussions aren't really relevant when you fail to acknowledge the actual lines and ignore what you don't like to stick with your headcanon.

[Bookworm Luke]

It is better than the inconsistency mid sentence and paragraphs you seem to support. "Irrelevant of era" is apparently a waste of space, as is later on "Heroic Spirits of every era".

Of course, this is all with the caveat that Rin is right here. And past discussions aren't really relevant when you fail to acknowledge the actual lines and ignore what you don't like to stick with your headcanon.

I don't know man, sounds like you are the one head-canoning here.

Looks like you got it all covered. "I am right if this quote is wrong, but I am also right if this quote is right".

Past discussions are relevant because we are ruminating old materials. It's different if we are going over new materials.

[AAM1232]

You're the one thinking the time limit is relevant here, when the rest of the surrounding texts say there isn't really one. And Rin being incorrect was brought up earlier, but we both ignored it to focus on this.

[Bookworm Luke]

You're the one thinking the time limit is relevant here, when the rest of the surrounding texts say there isn't really one. And Rin being incorrect was brought up earlier, but we both ignored it to focus on this.

Uhhhh... what?

You are the one waving the text like it was the commandment. I just told you that you read it wrong. I've read the whole block of text, it's neither here nor there. The interesting bit was the time clause, that's why it is brought up repetitively in the past.

[Zork Knight]

Didn't Nasu already break his own recency/well-documented rule as early as EXTRA with Li Shuwen, and later again in CCC with Andersen

And, well, Nursery Rhyme is pretty out there compared to what had come before