Unpopular TM opinions you have

[Comun]

Even the human Hakuno she’s copied from is still alive.

[Kabalisto Koga]

Y'all getting all up and at them over the silly things when you should have this approach to Type Moon. You will live a happier life and become like me, a totally productive member of society.

would loving history as one reason count as "for the lore" ?

[Byegod]

Even the human Hakuno she’s copied from is still alive.

That logic doesnt work, otherwise you are actively going against the writing

They are called ghosts, the mats even speculate that hakuno retains traits of the original

"After entering the main storyline of the game Hakuno is still in a completely blank state where he doesn’t even know the difference between right and left, but it seems like his/her basic education was at a level that was rather odd high.
Hakuno sports some amazing detective skills and inference ability in the sections where he/she needs to guess the true name of each heroic spirit by only going on the fragments he/she has gathered from the game matrix. Perhaps Hakuno was a history maniac in the past."


"In Moon Cell’ core.
Before the eye of the Moon, two ghosts confront each other.
They are both humans who lived in the past.
They are two of the few people who can express their impressions of the future in an objective manner.
The King of Conflict rejects this future.
However, you do not share a similar perspective."

“The people who live in each era are responsible for choosing the path they take.
Twice H. Pieceman.
The era which you were supposed to protect, ended long ago.”

With these parting words the curtain of battle was raised."

Are you saying nasu himself is wrong?

Why call him a ghost then? most of this comes from the mats within a few paragraphs of eachother.

[sentence]

I'm a bit mentally drained from this thread tbh, thanks for the comments

Can't really debatet this atm, ill try to user numbrts and bulletpoints in the future

The third i was referring to things like in extra or apocrypha about the past people like servants not deciding for the present vs the contrast of extella where by ruling over the Moon cell they are deciding

It's called "development."

Nasu realised his old theme is absurd, and changed his views.

[Byegod]

It's called "development."

Nasu realised his old theme is absurd, and changed his views.

I would like to believe that, so why do people still repeat it? even people who speak jp

Elaborate on why you think its absurd specifically

[Mattias]

That logic doesnt work, otherwise you are actively going against the writing

They are called ghosts, the mats even speculate that hakuno retains traits of the original

Consider Ghost in the Shell, where a person's mind is called also called a ghost.

[fumei]

“The people who live in each era are responsible for choosing the path they take.
Twice H. Pieceman.
The era which you were supposed to protect, ended long ago.”

Wouldn't you think this part specifically goes against what you're trying to argue here? If you read "ghost" less literally for a start, what it says is that Twice's era is long gone, hence he has no right to decide. Hakuno's era, meanwhile, is not over, and what Comun says is the proof of that. They may be a "ghost" in the sense that they're not actively fully "human" in the moment, but this is still their era.

I'll agree that Extella is kinda dumb in that it seemingly appears to go against the established theme here, but there's a case to argue that it isn't that absolute either, because the Servants in Extella still have Hakuno as their Master, and at that point, the idea is that "humanity" will just have moved to the moon in this new world they created, so we'd just be back to "humans living here decide for civilization, Servants just kinda help out".

[Skull]

Consider Ghost in the Shell, where a person's mind is called also called a ghost.

*Cough*

[Leftovers]

The infamous ghost in the machine...

[Mattias]

Yeah, but it's a weeb forum, which would be better known, GitS or a backlash at Descartes?

[Ideofago]

Considering the backlash at Descartes is the origin of the weeb movie.

[Byegod]

Wouldn't you think this part specifically goes against what you're trying to argue here? If you read "ghost" less literally for a start, what it says is that Twice's era is long gone, hence he has no right to decide. Hakuno's era, meanwhile, is not over, and what Comun says is the proof of that. They may be a "ghost" in the sense that they're not actively fully "human" in the moment, but this is still their era.

I'll agree that Extella is kinda dumb in that it seemingly appears to go against the established theme here, but there's a case to argue that it isn't that absolute either, because the Servants in Extella still have Hakuno as their Master, and at that point, the idea is that "humanity" will just have moved to the moon in this new world they created, so we'd just be back to "humans living here decide for civilization, Servants just kinda help out".

Except why call them both ghosts in the same sentence and also define them as both as people of the past the next sentence, nor why compare hakuno to a servant?

"In Moon Cell’ core.
Before the eye of the Moon, two ghosts confront each other.
They are both humans who lived in the past.
They are two of the few people who can express their impressions of the future in an objective manner.
The King of Conflict rejects this future.
However, you do not share a similar perspective."

then you get the whole spiel on the era which then goes into the reply you highlight

“The people who live in each era are responsible for choosing the path they take.
Twice H. Pieceman.
The era which you were supposed to protect, ended long ago.”"

And if that case isn't absolute, why not elaborate on it? talk of the nuances? I cant recall that happening EVER on this topic.

spiel

Even if you can’t find any value in this era.
Even if this future is all someone else’s problem.
Even if the future that we dreamed about is a foolish dead end. I cannot reject the life of the people that live here now.”
“You… approve of this future?”
“No, like you, I cannot accept it… However, I still can’t bring myself to hate it either.”

Moon Cell; the observation device that became the stage for the Holy Grail War.
The reason why its cyber world has the appearance of an ocean.
If the basis of life is conflict, then the basis of the eye of the moon is to watch over.
That way of existing was unconsciously understood by the Masters who arrived at the Moon.
But only he who reached the core faster than anyone else, failed to understand the strength of that way of existing.

“…even so. Stagnation is our reality.”

The tragedies we caused cannot be changed.
The responsibility we stole must be carried out.
While accepting the premonition of his defeat, the fragment of a messiah, not ready to give up on his personal theory, takes up his sword.

“If you think about it, humanity is already passed its maturity.
Until the year 1900, humanity was in its growth period.
But after that, what was supposed to come after adolescent; the golden age that was finally supposed to arrive after immaturity, did not arrive.
As if it were rotten fruit.
It fell during its most rich and prosperous stage.
How incredibly sinful.
If we don’t produce results that match up to the things we sacrificed, and to the costs we fostered, then everything will be no more than a lie.
This future is wrong. Humanity has to start over from scratch again. Small-scale conflict is no good. Unless there’s a struggle for survival that can involved anyone and everyone, our eyes, our consciousness, will not grow.”

Hating war, he cannot accept doing nothing over the anger that comes from having these things taken away.
Humans are more amazing than that.
Life; humanity, must go to a place that the people of the past cannot even imagine.
The idea that man is innately good pushed this ghost to become a messiah.
Although his views are elitist, they are also correct.
Indeed, the humans of this era are tired.
They are losing interest. They are giving up. They have long forgotten what it is to dream about the future.
But—

[pinetree]

Extra conforms to the idea that humans living in the present should be the ones to decide the future and Extella is the one that ignores those values to tell a different story.
There's a reason it doesn't connect directly to Extra and instead is it's own thing. It's because both are incompatible and Nasu was trying to make do.

Well, it's also so that Hakuno could have the harem, but that's a different matter.

[Nanashi(kari)]

Ignoring common nasuverse themes and achieving a harem ending...
Is there even anything CHADkuno can't do?

[Ideofago]

Be a real human.

[Byegod]

Thats the CCC normal ending

AKA the ending noone gives a shit about and as later lore has come about may be the worst ending in terms of outcomes.


At least one of my opinions if finally not being considered bad!

And tbh there is a reason why i sometimes crack a joke "It's okay when extra does it" when it comes to this sort of thing

[Petrikow]

'Extella bad' is indeed quite a mild and uncontroversial opinion.

[Ideofago]

Code Red, opinion is not unpopular, close the thread

[OnesFleetingGlory]

Extella is good. It introduces interesting rules in Nasuverse like Quantum Time Lock and also Archimedes.

There, we're back on track.

[Petrikow]

Code Red, opinion is not unpopular, close the thread

As much as I'd love to, on each and every place where there exists a "unpopular" opinion discussion outlet, it will inevitably become swarmed with people repeating fairly benign and popular opinions.