Feedback Thread - "Peanut Gallery" (Read OP)

[Spammin Spiff]

I feel like the biggest thing holding this sheet back is its preoccupation with the attempted conquest of Greece. I understand that this is supposed to be Xerxes's warlord attribute first and foremost, but Pine is certainly right that this doesn't feel worthy of three Noble Phantasms - especially since he's known for losing that fight.

...

Or to put it another way, this is a firmly Grecocentric take, which isn't necessarily a bad thing on its own, but it sort of flails a bit at the "Heroic" part of "Heroic Spirit" to make ends meet. That feels like the core of the struggle - fleshing him out based purely on the stories of his wartime exploits. The story you recount at the very end of his biography, on the other hand, pretty much admits that the build we're seeing is the tip of the iceberg. Military history can't really compare to human drama like that, and honestly I'm tearing my hair out that we got Trouble With Women instead of a Noble Phantasm based on that tale, for example.

Basically, he feels like "Leonidas's enemy" more than a king of his own people, if that makes sense. While that feels like the intent, it also feels frustratingly unambitious.

To be clear, I don't think he's badly done for what he is. Beheading is the only thing I would say doesn't really stand on its own, and you even managed to turn that into an interesting effect. But man, there's so much to work with that he feels undercooked in the grand scheme of things.

Thanks for the feedback, I totally understand what you're saying and I agree with it fully. I'm glad you understood "Rider" Xerxes is him as a warlord, as that's what I was wanting to go for when I made the sheet. I do have some ideas on how to rework parts of the sheet. I might work some things around, I might just get rid of the Immortals NP as I really don't think I can get it to work well here. I do agree that Trouble with Women would be better as an NP, and I believe I had planned on something regarding that aspect of his story to be the basis of another class for him, but after thinking it over, it probably makes more sense for him to have it here. I'll have to see if I could then make his Defensive NP into a skill in some sort of way. But thank all of you for the feedback on my sheet.

Also sorry for taking so long for this reply Random, I had a busy weekend and also took some time thinking about what you said before I replied.

[pinetree]

Alright, since it's been a while since the last one let me ask for some feedback.

My Saber Chrysaor did get some comments back when I posted it, but the concept she's built upon is kinda novel and I'm pretty invested in her relationship with Callirrhoe, so I'd like some more in-depth comments.
I'm particularly interested in how well it does at getting you interested in her dynamic with Callirrhoe. Nowadays my sheets have their climax or focal point always be the Noble Phantasm, which has also led me to 1) writing their themes to be very obvious and bombastic and 2) writing a lot of NPs that either kill/unsummon the user or are cyclical in nature. While I like these approaches and will probably continue to use them, I want to know how well I did in a sheet in which the themes are still pretty obvious, but the emotional narrative takes a backseat while still being what closes off the sheet (in a very short — but hopefully poignant — bond CE in this case).

Of course, comments on aspects other than these ones are also appreciated.

[DracoScribe]

My Saber Chrysaor did get some comments back when I posted it, but the concept she's built upon is kinda novel and I'm pretty invested in her relationship with Callirrhoe, so I'd like some more in-depth comments.
I'm particularly interested in how well it does at getting you interested in her dynamic with Callirrhoe.

Well to be blunt: I'm...not...sure...?

Allow me to elaborate.

I honestly really love the sheet. I've always been the one who wanted to know about the monsters in mythology just as much as the heroes, if not more. I'm especially a sucker for monsters who are not truly monstrous in personality or morals, or at least try to be, aka "good monsters", or are unfortunately forced into the role of a monster. It's one of the reason I'm fond of Asterios (which I am specifically mentioning because my heart melted when he was mentioned in the sheet and Chrysaor was happy for him...and her mother). So reading Chrysaor's sheet was a big treat for me. The story weaved into the sheet, even if it was very much beakseat compared to the ones I've read of you so far, was just the kind of thing I expected, but still very much loved. But in terms of interest with her dynamic with Callirhoe specifically? I'm only interested because I like her, Chrysaor. So I don't really care specifically for her dynamic with her wife (even if I suspect I'll love it if that Bond CE is any indication), I just want to see how she interacts with others and such in general, from her mothers to Asterios to any of the tragic monsters formed from humanity along with her wife. Sooo...I don't know if that counts/that was what you were going for or not, or if it's at least close enough to it. But that's how I felt/what I ended up walking away with from reading the sheet.

[pinetree]

I'm glad to hear you liked her so mcuh!
Interested was a poor choice of words on my part, I want to know if their relationship is impactful in any way.
It mostly exists as a framing device for the tragedy of being a monster, but the idea of their connection going beyond death through Affection of the Goddess and allowing Chrysaor to hold onto herself during the little scene at the end is really endearing to me, and wonder if that's the same for the readers.

Especially since it's not the most flashy moment in the sheet (I think) since there's that NP to Servant transition at the start.

[DelRey]

Couldnt comment so far, because I dont have enough time to properly ready many sheets.
So allow me to bring it back alive with a sheet that is certainly too long

My Vivaldi-Aeolos sheet.
It was posted late in a really, really strong contest. It was supposed to be my main entry, but like so often for me, my side entry stole the spotlight. It is a conceptually weird sheet and I remember sitting on this one for a long while to make things right.

[DracoScribe]

I'm glad to hear you liked her so mcuh!
Interested was a poor choice of words on my part, I want to know if their relationship is impactful in any way.
It mostly exists as a framing device for the tragedy of being a monster, but the idea of their connection going beyond death through Affection of the Goddess and allowing Chrysaor to hold onto herself during the little scene at the end is really endearing to me, and wonder if that's the same for the readers.

Especially since it's not the most flashy moment in the sheet (I think) since there's that NP to Servant transition at the start.

i nearly forgot about this reply

Ah, in that case...yeah, it was, for me personally. The little scene at the end right before the Bond CE were pretty big highlights of a sheet that I already really liked overall. Honestly, I'd say it was better than the "flashy NP-to-Servant transition", but I'm always a sucker for fluff, so that's just my bias talking.

Couldnt comment so far, because I dont have enough time to properly ready many sheets.
So allow me to bring it back alive with a sheet that is certainly too long

My Vivaldi-Aeolos sheet.
It was posted late in a really, really strong contest. It was supposed to be my main entry, but like so often for me, my side entry stole the spotlight. It is a conceptually weird sheet and I remember sitting on this one for a long while to make things right.

I'm a simple woman. I see Vivaldi, I click.

Okay admittedly that makes me sound like I've listened to his work besides "The Four Seasons"...which I have not, and even then only really heard two...sections, or however it is called, of the aforementioned work itself. But my point still stands despite that. I am fond of the "Winter" section of the Four Seasons, so the second I saw the sheet was Vivaldi, I clicked and devoured it.

And boy now I just wanna listen to The Four Seasons fully, at least, and maybe learn more about him.

Have I ever mentioned I love your artist and musician sheets? I really do. I wanna read more of them for inspiration for whenever I get around to an artist I wanna do (and any musicians and dancers I wanna try my hand at). But I digress.

I'm...not sure what you mean by conceptually weird. Is it the fact that "Vivaldi" is someone the "real Vivaldi" took in and then is trying to BE him? Is that the weird part? Because otherwise I don't see what's so weird about the sheet. Of course, that could just be me, but still, other than that, I don't find anything weird about it. In fact, I love it. I love that he controls the wind with music. I love how you incorporate his most famous work into the sheet, with the skills, NP and so on. And I love the way the was story told throughout. It was fascinating read, what with it justifying the whole Vivaldi-Aeolos connection/summoning. Like I said earlier, it made me go "okay now i wanna know more about this guy and at least attempt to listen to his other music at some point even more". My favorite part out of all of that though was the wind-music magecraft (and by extension the NP, but I'm highlighting the magecraft since the NP is basically the magecraft turned to eleven) and that it does different things based on the type of wind it is, with the types based on its direction and temprature and so on. It feels so cool.

A part of me wishes I could say more, preferably something constructive, but really, that's all I can say about the sheet I just got really lost in. Like, really lost. Couldn't tell you how much time passed despite it being long, which I admit that it was, but that did little to deter me from reading it.

[DelRey]

Thank you draco
It means a lot to hear you like my artist series
I feared my Pretender came off as too forced
One critique i got privately was that i made the reader care for vivaldi, just to say it is not him after all. I also took a lot of freedom with greek titan lore.
I will soon return to making artists. I am currently brainstorming two famous ones

[DracoScribe]

Thank you draco
It means a lot to hear you like my artist series

You're welcome!
Again, they're really great and I love the ones I've read so far.

I feared my Pretender came off as too forced
One critique i got privately was that i made the reader care for vivaldi, just to say it is not him after all. I also took a lot of freedom with greek titan lore.

Hmmm...can't comment on the lore thing 'cause I'm not (yet) familiar with it (assumung you mean Type-Moon wise of course; though even mythology wise it's not something I've yet to look that much into), but I do have some thoughts on that other thing.

I can't help but wonder if the fact that I figured out he was a Pretender pretty quickly helped with making my impression more positive than the critique you mention. Not only by the fact that the link is titled "Vivaldi=Aeolos", but because, when I pressed the link, I expected something along the lines of Hachiko-Xolotl or Romulus=Quirinus (though note I haven't seen his profile yet or any story roles he may or may not have). But then when I saw the True Name, and I was like "wait where's the Aeolos part?", until I noticed the subtle hint in the True Name: Vivaldi. Not "Antonio Lucio Vivaldi", not even "Antonio Vivaldi", just "Vivaldi". So then I went "Oh. This is a Pretender, isn't it?" and was curious how this "Vivaldi" took "Antonio Vivaldi's" place in the sheet, and by the time it finished, you gave enough justification for me.

I will soon return to making artists. I am currently brainstorming two famous ones

I'm lookin' forward to 'em!

[DesReploid]

Finally gotten around to taking a look at the Vivaldi sheet myself. And, much like the other artist sheets of yours that I've read so far, I really liked it.

It is, as you said, a bit weird, though I don't really mind it. The inclusion of the Machine Gods is really well done, I think and that you manage to make the reader care about Vivaldi only to reveal him not to really be Vivaldi is a strong point, in my opinion. I could echo most of Draco's points here. The inclusion of his music in the sheet is very well done and giving the Vivaldi family a background as a Magus family is also a nice touch. The only critique I really have is that I would have wished that at least a hint or two would have been hidden in the sheet before the Aeolos reveal - That said, I am dense as a brick, so perhaps I missed them - I think that would really have tied everything together really well.

[DelRey]

Thanks you two
More comments are welcome, but i wouldnt mind if another one wishes for feedback now

[sutaa]

This is probably vague as far as feedback goes, but I really like the... ambition of the sheet, I guess? You really went all-out in uniting base Vivaldi with Aeolos, and then you even went and integrated the Machine God lore on top of that -- it really feels the way a Pretender should, if that makes sense. Conceptually wild at first sight, but the sheet succeeds because of how much work you put into bringing it all together.

[DelRey]

yeah, my pretenders are always...sheets of big efforts behind it, lemme tell you
when i do them, i can not make them not loaded with concepts

[Alexcoene]

Yeah, you always manage to make your sheets feel harmonious, no matter how many different figures from different sources you put in. The italian composer and the greek gods feel like a completely natural combination. That's legit impressive, my few attempts at doing this kind of thing haven't been nearly as convincing in my own opinion.

And I guess I'm going to ask for feedback on my Luperca sheet. She was something that started as just a silly idea (what if Dangerous Beast was actually a Servant) that research alllowed me to make much more lore for than I expected. I kinda feel like it got overshadowed by current discourse at the time, so I'd really like to read some opinions on it.

[DelRey]

The first thing that came to my mind is to give the sheet a proper grammer check. Man verbs have the wrong ending, several words are missing letters or have too many and it is "though" not "tough"
I remember the sheet, because of course the dc and the surprise fc in the middle
I wondered why you called her a prostitute and got explanation a skill later. The order of skills can help explain the coming ones. It feels like you did not go all in the class choices, because Shielder shows in the NP. I think integrating a Double Summon in a skill would alleviate it and its acceptable in this case.
Im not feeling the shapeshifting because it feels off when you actually need a proper host body and its not in their nature to do so
Overall a fine sheet

[Alexcoene]

Thank you for the feedback. Kama can change Sakura's appearance to the point of becoming a guy, so I thought the Shapeshifting skill was okay. You're more than correct on the grammar stuff, and I should probably think more of the 'timeline' of my skills, yeah. Tough adding Double Summon didn't come up to me at all, so kudos for the neat idea!

[NailsInYourFeet]

About to ask for feedback for something a bit bigger than a Servant sheet, my Fate/Extra-style fic Starless Black. It's a reposting of an ongoing Quest, but I feel it's an easy enough read as just a fic since it's pretty light on Quest mechanics

Heads up though that it's further removed from the mainline Nasuverse than even Fate/Extra was, and there's some extra AU sprinklings on top of that

[sutaa]

Reviving the thread, and definitely not potential foreshadowing for what I might be working on for Secret Santa, I was wondering if I could get some feedback on my Poppaea/Sporus sheet? It got a good response, but I'd like maybe a breakdown on what its strengths were and where I could potentially improve.

[Spammin Spiff]

Reviving the thread, and definitely not potential foreshadowing for what I might be working on for Secret Santa, I was wondering if I could get some feedback on my Poppaea/Sporus sheet? It got a good response, but I'd like maybe a breakdown on what its strengths were and where I could potentially improve.

Honestly a great sheet IMO. The only thing I'm not sure about is the inclusion of the last NP. But, if you explained it's inclusion to me I'd probably find it sensible to keep. Other than that, like others said, it is very clear you put a lot work into it and it paid off.

[pinetree]

Reviving the thread, and definitely not potential foreshadowing for what I might be working on for Secret Santa, I was wondering if I could get some feedback on my Poppaea/Sporus sheet? It got a good response, but I'd like maybe a breakdown on what its strengths were and where I could potentially improve.

I like this one but when we get to Sporus it feels like every skill goes on for twice the length it should. The parts after Untold Tale of Sporus are the best in the sheet but I was tired of reading about him by the time I got there.
The concept is strong and there is a lot going on, but this stands out as an issue despite that. You skill descriptions are long in general but a lot here feels either superfulous or like it could've been summarized.

[sutaa]

Honestly a great sheet IMO. The only thing I'm not sure about is the inclusion of the last NP. But, if you explained it's inclusion to me I'd probably find it sensible to keep. Other than that, like others said, it is very clear you put a lot work into it and it paid off.

Thanks! For the last NP, it's sort of meant to tie together the untold tale of Sporus stuff, if that makes sense? My general thought process while working on the back half of the sheet was I wanted to give Sporus more agency as a character, both to just make him more interesting and to distinguish him more from the Poppaea persona - if Poppaea's defining quality in the sheet is 'passively being loved by Nero despite appearing active,' then Sporus' half of the sheet should be someone who 'actively loves Nero despite appearing passive,' was the idea. I wanted to go for an antagonistic vibe that still worked for the image of Nero's lover, and the idea that Sporus had actively destroyed Nero because he loved her was perfect for that -- and in my mind, if NPs are the sublimation of the Servant's character, then I wanted a perfect 'Anti-Nero' NP to finish off the sheet that demonstrated his twisted mindset.

I like this one but when we get to Sporus it feels like every skill goes on for twice the length it should. The parts after Untold Tale of Sporus are the best in the sheet but I was tired of reading about him by the time I got there.
The concept is strong and there is a lot going on, but this stands out as an issue despite that. You skill descriptions are long in general but a lot here feels either superfulous or like it could've been summarized.

Ah... My main weakness. My approach is to write as much as possible in the first draft then figure out what I can cut (this rarely works). My initial idea was to keep Sporus' half of the sheet short, but it felt wrong somehow that the 'main' persona after the Pretender reveal shouldn't be longer than Poppaea's part, and I ended up with way more than I needed. Thanks for the feedback!