Sooo, i come up with an original-flavor Assassin. I couldn't find myself to craft some mystical Assassin, so i go through the mundane way.
Meet Rashid ad-Din Sinan, which is arguably second in name to Hasan himself. He was the leader of Masyaf, a stronghold of the Assassins near Jerusalem. His most infamous deeds are infiltrating Saladin's camp twice (the second time even personally leaving a dagger in Saladin's personal tent, warning him to stay off Assassin business) and killing Conrad of Montferrat. The deeds puts him at odds with the central command in Alamut, so when he died Alamut took direct control of Masyaf. Masyaf itself remained as an Assassin stronghold up until the order's final downfall in ~1265 (Alamut fell to Hulagu Khan in 1256).
Also, by crafting this sheet I've cleared up a personal misconception. Hasan ash-Shabbah (the proper Arabic rendering) itself is not a title, but an actual name; he's the one who founded the order. The title "Old Man of The Mountain" is more correctly termed Syaikh al-Jabal in Arabic, so calling an Assassin leader as "the nth Hassan-i-Sabbah, Old Man of The Mountain" is a misnomer. The Syaikh al-Jabal title, meanwhile, was indeed used as title by a few Assassin leaders.
But eh, Nasuverse.
On with the sheet then. I'm quite influenced by I3uster's Hasan sheet, and decided to approach Rashid from a more realistic angle especially for my rendition of Zabaniya. Rashid's ability is far less magical than Hasan's and requires extensive setup, but what can be more satisfying than seeing an enemy fall to a well-timed gambit?
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Rashid ad-Din Sinan "The one who killed your king... is him."
Image (c) Runshin @ Deviantart
Grandmaster of the Hashashin order of Ismaili sect, one of the nineteen who have bore the name Syaikh al-Jabal, the Old Man of The Mountain.
Born to a religious family in a village near Basra, Rashid was not a particularly outstanding man. Only after his schooling in Alamut, that the young man truly showed his worth. Through the rigorous study of mysticism, theology, and various physical and mental exercises, he emerged as the premier candidate to be chosen by Hasan Ash-Shabbah as the Assassin's grandmaster. However, Hasan's death not long after Rashid's tutelage prevented him from actually assuming the position. Internal powerplay then saw Rashid assigned as a regional leader of the sect, first to his homeland Basra and then to Masyaf, an Assassin stronghold in Syria north of Jerusalem. The timing of his appointment in Masyaf cannot be more opportune, for by that time events has aligned itself for the Third Crusade...
Possible Class: Assassin Master: ???
Parameters:
* Alignment: Neutral Evil
* Noble Phantasm: C
* Strength: D
* Endurance: E
* Agility: B
* Mana: C
* Luck: A
Class Skills:
* Presence Concealment A+
(Assassin-specific class skill)
this skill grants the capacity to hide one's presence as a Servant. It is a common skill to the Assassin class. At this rank, it is possible for Rashid to disappear completely and become almost impossible to be detected. However, efficacy will decrease once preparations to attack are taken. Rashid usually uses this ability to completely suppress his presence as a Servant, but he can use it to physically disappear as well.
Personal skills:
* Throwing Weapons B
This skill represents the expertise for thrown projectile weapons. At this rank, Rashid's thrown weapons's power and penetration are now comparable to bullets. While in his life he utilizes thrown daggers, Rashid can master other weapons (throwing axe, shuriken, kunai, etc) in a short time.
* Subversive Activities B+
This skill represents the talent to reduce the enemy forces in the preliminary stages, before going into battle; An expert of traps. However, the higher is the ranking of this Skill, the more one's spiritual status as a hero declines. At this rank, it is possible to disable as much as 30% of the total military force before the enemy advances, causing the command structure to be confused and hindering battle abilities greatly. This ability receives an improvement from Zabaniya.
* Information Erasure A
This skill represents the removal of information regarding the Servant's true name, abilities, and appearance from the records and memories of all witnesses, including the opponent, following the conclusion of an engagement. At this rank, this effect is enforced even within digital recordings by a camera in broad daylight. High-level divination magecraft must be employed to obtain evidence of foul play, and even then deductive reasoning must be used to piece together what actually happened. There is scant and conflicting records of Rashid's history and lesser deeds today, testament of how meticulous and secretive the man could be.
* Shapeshift E
This skill refers to both borrowing bodies and appearance change. A method used by the millenary spirits of foxes and badgers of China that are put on par with the kitsune of Japan. At this low rank, Rashid can change most of his appearance though the higher aspects like spiritual signature remains unchanged. He also cannot change genders, although he can simulate a convincing female body and features.
Noble Phantasms:
* Zabaniya [Delusional Loyalty] Anti-Army/Anti-Unit Target: 10 meter radius continious aura (Anti-Army); Up to 15 at a time (Anti-Unit) Rank: C
As an Assassin, Rashid's abilities is not in straight-up battles and not even in 'mundane' assassinations; His forte is on leading enemies into a mire of deception and misdirection, and uniting his allies under his leadership. As such, his Zabaniya manifests as the ability to control loyalty and incite sedition in enemy ranks.
The effect of this always-active phantasm is fairly subtle. Rashid is not the type of assassin that conceals himself heavily; instead, he mingled into the populace wearing various guises while his high rank in Presence Concealment effectively covers his spiritual presence as a Servant. While doing this, his Zabaniya would extend as a passive aura and would 'mark' people he come in contact with its radius; these 'marked' people, while not actually supportive to his cause, will nonetheless not impede him and his 'agents' when the time of plan execution presents itself.
After Rashid figured out the lay of the land, he then selects a number of 'agents' out of the 'marked'. He will then approach the selected people and build a connection with them; the guise of comparing/discussing theology is a favorite, but something more mundane like being a frequent customer can work too. It takes an hour of parley before the person becomes an 'agent', but the duration need not be continious; resisting the attempt is possible, but Rashid can be highly charismatic and persuasive so voluntary agreement is a possibility. This personality aspect will develop regardless of current allegiance, and the effect cannot be dispelled or traced with modern magecraft. Only 15 'agents' can be active at a time, though Rashid can make many candidates; Also, Rashid does not gain any sort of link between him and his 'agents', so constant mundane communication is necessary (though it could be coded).
These people will then develop a 'secondary personality' loyal to Rashid. The 'agents' will then be empowered to the extent that their physical abilities (STR, END, and AGI) will be elevated to rank E, as well as aptitude to the Subversive Activities skill (to the same extent, rank E); however, the ability needs prana supply (if token) from Rashid so his prana draw from his Master will increase. Rashid can bring out the secondary personality with a keyword unique to each person, and while Rashid is not fully in control of them they are fanatically devoted to him and is unlikely to disobey.
I like him (yay for actual Assasins as Assassins!), but the NP feels a bit confusing to me. Could use a bit of streamlining imo.
Well, the flowchart is a little like this:
Rashid walks around >> people within 10 meters of him became 'marked' >> Rashid selects his 'agents' candidate >> Rashid plans execution of enemy Master >> Rashid activates up to 15 'agents' >> ??? >> Profit!
It IS cumbersome to properly use, because it requires a lot of walking, preparation time, scheming, and trap-laying. He's more suited to a HGW of medium to long length, at least a month to give him enough prep and scheming time to actually be useful. And once he does... well, he's still pretty weak as raw power indicates. He lacks a punch, but he compensates with being essentially tricky and very hard to track.
I spoilered a few things which I think were more "optional" than the rest.
Heraclius the Last Augustus
Personal Information:
Class: Saber Heroic Spirit: Heraclius Alignment: Lawful Neutral Height: 183 cm Weight: 73 kg Appearance: A tall and stout man of somewhat swarthy complexion, summoned by the grail in his prime, as he may have looked when he initially usurped the throne from Phocas. He wears decorative and elaborate armour of the usual roman stock that radiates of gold, with all the cloth, such as the cape, being imperial purple. Around his neck hangs the Sancta Crux in its magnificent reliquary. His facial features are stereotypically masculine yet of smooth curves. His chin shows signs of a growing beard.
Details:
Spoiler:
The final Augustus of the Roman Empire and the first Basileus of Rhomaion. He was crowned Flavius Heraclius Augustus in the Chapel of St. Stephen after personally executing the previous Emperor, a deeply unpopular, tyrannical and incompetent usurper by the name of Phocas. It is recorded that when Heraclius had Phocas at his mercy, he asked “Is this how you have ruled, wretch?” to which Phocas replied “And you will rule better?” at which point Heraclius decapitated him.
Heraclius inherited a four front war from his predecessor. There were the Persians in Asia Minor and the near east, the Slavs and Avars in the Balkans, the Lombards in Italy and the Visigoths in Spain. The Empire look like it was destined to fall just like its western brother had 200 years earlier. Coins were minted which read “May God save the Romans” and a sense of impending doom haunted the entire populace.
Heraclius hastily arranged a peace with as many of the parties as he could, ceding all of the remains of Spain to the Visigoths and everything in Egypt, Syria, Armenia to Persia, having to pay tribute to stop them from further rampaging across Asia Minor, all just for a 5 year peace treaty. The empire was now officially broke. Sergius, Patriarch of Constantinople, offered to sell church property in order to scrape together enough money to raise another army. Heraclius took up on the offer and started building the army, personally attending drills and giving instruction, despite lacking any form of military education.
Heraclius had been personally slighted by the Persian Shahanshah Khosrau II “the Undefeatable” in a letter sent after the fall of Egypt, in which the Zoroastrian ruler had insulted Christianity, insulted Heraclius’ helplessness and insulted his sovereign right to rule. The letter, combined with the fact that Khosrau had sacked the holy city of Jerusalem and stolen its holy relics, caused a general outrage among the Christian populace of the Empire and as the newly formed army started to march on the Persians with Heraclius at its front, it had taken on the characteristics of a holy war, with relics adorning the standards carried into battle.
There was no thought of reconquest. This final army was to be used for an all out offensive, an attempt to force the Persians to concede. Heraclius, who was the first emperor to personally lead a Roman army into battle for hundreds of years yet had never tasted war before, managed to miraculously lead his men to victory, battle after battle, eventually reaching the Persian capital of Ctesiphon, having sacked the sacred Zoroastrian fire temple along the way.
After losing the decisive Battle of Nineveh and being stopped at the Siege of Constantinople after having allied with the Avars, the Persians were suddenly the ones on the verge of collapse, Khosrau’s ambitious conquests having depleted most of their resources. Faced with a mutiny, the Shahanshah was assassinated by his own men. A brutal succession struggle erupted and in the confusion, Heraclius managed to sign a peace treaty which returned all the lost lands along with the plundered relics of Jerusalem, including the True Cross and other Instruments of the Passion. This was the climax of a war that had been going on and off since the days of the Roman Republic, over 700 years ago. Having descended into a state of complete chaos, the Zoroastrian Persians would never threaten the Romans again.
Yet such a colossal triumph was suddenly eclipsed by another foe dramatically emerging from the normally divided Arabian Peninsula. Having been united by the Prophet Muhammed and his word of Islam, the newly formed Caliphate burst onto Roman and Persian territories, overwhelming the exhausted empires. The Persians were conquered outright while Heraclius struggled to hold onto his own empire. Egypt was overrun and so was Syria. Heraclius finally managed to establish a defensive perimeter along Armenia which stopped the Arabs from completely destroying the Empire.
Now old, and growing increasingly mentally unstable, Heraclius finally passed away after 31 years of reigning, most of which had been spent campaigning against the Persians. His reign had saved the empire from complete destruction, but had also seen the loss of some of its most coveted territories. The most enduring legacy of Heraclius was that of him changing the official language of the Empire to Greek, from Latin, in the process rejecting the old imperial styling in favour of the Greek word for sovereign, “Basileus”, the same title held by Alexander the Great, another destroyer of Persian dominance. The years of Heraclius’ reign is said to be the end of late antiquity and the beginning of the medieval era, something which the radical changes occurring around him seems to perfectly symbolise.
Parameters:
STR: B AGI: C
END: C MGI: D LCK: D NP: A+
Class Skills:
Magic Resistance: A+
As an incredibly devout Christian and having faced the magecraft of Zoroastrian magi, Heraclius boasts an immense level of magical protection.
Riding: C
Most vehicles and mounts can be handled with average skill. However, cannot ride the likes of Phantasmal Species such as Demonic Beasts and Divine Beast-rank creatures.
Personal Skills:
Charisma: A
Leadership skills. Dramatically increases the morale and combat efficiency of allied troops. It truly is at the level befitting of an Emperor.
Protection of the Faith: A+
A protection born from faith, not directly granted by God. It ranks the conviction of belief in God. This high level of faith grants Heraclius miraculous properties, but also causes problems in his personality. He displays high levels of bipolarity and may sometimes be struck with an all-consuming depression if he believes God has abandoned him.
Sacred Heart: B
A divine presence born out of compassion through faith. It radiates through the air and empowers those nearby who are favoured by the user. Their wounds are healed, spiritual protection is raised and a holy energy reverberates within them.
Noble Phantasm:
The First Icon Made Without Hands
Mandylion
Rank: C
Type: Barrier
Range: -
Maximum Targets: 1
An image of Christ not created by human hands but born out of divine intervention. It is called the “Image of Edessa” in the western traditions of Christianity. Heraclius bore it into battle, fixed onto a pole as a battle standard, when he led his army to battle against the Persians. It was brought to Paris following the Fourth Crusade and then lost forever in the chaos of the French Revolution.
Heraclius uses it not unlike a shield, for any non-believer who strikes the image of Christ’s visage will suffer from an inner conflagration inside their body, starting from the arm. This effect only extends to the offending appendage, such as against the sword arm, or the leg used to kick. It is especially deadly when used to block magecraft as it will then target the offending magic circuits.
Should a believer strike it, they will experience a similar, less harsh effect, but will, however, be designated as a non-believer for the remainder of the encounter.
Foremost Instrument of the Passion
Sancta Crux
Rank: A+
Type: Anti-Unit
Range: 2-3
Maximum Targets: 1
The largest remains of the True Cross upon which Jesus Christ was nailed and executed. The splintered remains are kept within a gold adorned reliquary which belies the relic’s true appearance. Though it is only a small part of a once man-sized cross, the holy power carried within the relic is still massive.
It is used to amplify the virtues of its user and focus them into a weapon of Christ. It is wielded as a sword, with the cross within its reliquary as the handle and guards, a faint beam of light extending out of it as a blade. It does not injure the physical body but rather does damage on a spiritual level, sapping their strength regardless of where it hits. This extends to things such as armour, shields and even other weapons, things that will simply let the blade phase through them. Only Noble Phantasms of high rank can even interact with it.
No single hit is instantly lethal but by forming a cross using two slashes, Sancta Crux’s true ability is revealed. Upon revealing its true name under such conditions, the Noble Phantasm will re-enact the crucifixion of Christ upon the enemy, causing their soul to be banished from earth and purifying them of their sins. Such is the mercy of Christ.
Sancta Crux has no effect against other believers and also requires of its wielder to maintain their faith, as its power is directly tied to the wielders devotion to God.
Weapons:
Spathion:
A straight two-edged sword of above average length. Heraclius uses it to engage his enemies and determine their characteristics before he pulls out his Sancta Crux.
Analysis:
PROS:
+ His strength lies in his Noble Phantasms.
+ Works well together with a trusted Master thanks to his high-rank support skills.
+ Magi are practically ineffective against him and the Caster class poses little to no danger thanks to his incredible Magic Resistance and Mandylion Noble Phantasm.
CONS:
- Possesses less than stellar stats for someone in the Saber class.
- His strong points are directly tied to his faith which, thanks to his bipolarity, is sometimes severely compromised.
- Is weak against other Christian Heroic Spirits.
Design notes and additional comments:
Spoiler:
Out of all the emperors who have ever ruled the Roman Empire, I personally find Heraclius the most intriguing.
There was a lot of stuff that went into me wanting to do a sheet like this. The traditional neglect of all things Byzantine here and everywhere else, the fact that there were a lot of unexplored Christian relics and my personal interest in the figure.
The most interesting aspect is how his entire profile revolves around the notion of faith, specifically faith in Christianity. As long as Heraclius is steadfast, he will prove powerful, but a bad Master and unfortunate circumstances may cause him to falter. As a side-note, he is especially fearful of Arabs.
When I wrote the details part I got very involved and as such it came out very long, something which caused me to spoiler it. It is probably too much history and too little Nasuverse. I shouldn’t get carried away...
The way his Noble Phantasm work together is quite interesting and though it is not outright stated, I think it should be clear that if Heraclius encounters a Christian Heroic Spirit, then he will try to bait them into hitting the Mandylion so that they can be hit by Sancta Crux. By the way, if you spit on the Mandylion the insides of your mouth will ignite. I suppose I should also note that it is unknown specifically which Acheiropoieta had been used by Heraclius in his campaign, but I chose the Image of Edessa because it was in their possession at the time and because it had previously been used to "repel" a Persian siege.
I think the way he works together with a Master is quite interesting. He will always dislike whoever summoned him by virtue of them being a heretic magus, which is sure to cause problems early on. Getting him to warm up will be a challenge to even the most skilful of Master, but may definitely be worth the effort considering his skills. Sacred Heart is a great boon to a magus as the divine energy will increase the effectiveness of their spells.
Even more so than even Arturia, Heraclius is a true mage-killer. One of his Noble Phantasm can even completely cripple an unsuspecting magus. Those who do not rely on their magic circuits such as old Heroic Spirits will still find trouble piercing his Magic Resistance.
Last edited by Petrikow; February 15th, 2013 at 07:56 PM.
... It's rather funny to see an Islam sheet preceeding Heraclius'.
Anyway, Heraclius is pretty solid. The concept of a semi-support Saber is executed pretty well, but Charisma is a bit too high. Heraclius isn't quite the 'most popular amongst human beings' guy, that's more Julius Caesar or Augustus. B or B+ is more appropriate.
I think he'd certainly make for a more interesting Assassin rather than a Saber. I can see him being competent in one-on-one combat, but lacking the extravagant skills that would really make him match most Servants. Gotta say, a knight that has to pick his battles a bit more is an interesting idea.
He can be pretty powerful Saber, who excels at weakening opponents, before and during the fight.
Rashid ad-Din Sinan
Heh, I planned to do him after my series of dual-class Servants... Well, it seems like you already covered everything.
I think that high-rank of Information Erasure isn't exactly justified, though. Yes, we don't know much about him, but he lived about 900 years ago, and certainly where were enough people to remember him, and write down his deeds. While, Jack The Ripper is complete mystery even today, despite he lived relatively short time ago.
Heh, I planned to do him after my series of dual-class Servants... Well, it seems like you already covered everything.
I think that high-rank of Information Erasure isn't exactly justified, though. Yes, we don't know much about him, but he lived about 900 years ago, and certainly where were enough people to remember him, and write down his deeds. While, Jack The Ripper is complete mystery even today, despite he lived relatively short time ago.
I thought his case was pretty clear but just fucked up because it was someone with ties to the aristocracy, now only milked as mystery because of tourism. Then again it's been ages since I looked into this.
... It's rather funny to see an Islam sheet preceeding Heraclius'.
Anyway, Heraclius is pretty solid. The concept of a semi-support Saber is executed pretty well, but Charisma is a bit too high. Heraclius isn't quite the 'most popular amongst human beings' guy, that's more Julius Caesar or Augustus. B or B+ is more appropriate.
Actually, many historians believe that the greatest trait of Heraclius wasn't his capable reforms of both the army and the administration but rather his incredible ability to inspire hope in the most desperate of situations. After all, this is the guy who managed to somehow destroy an opponent other Roman generals and emperor hadn't been able to beat in 700 years using pretty much only his own charisma. There was no army, there was no money and there was definitely no hope left in the empire before Heraclius. Making the general populace (which his army was formed of) go from "the end times are upon us" to "determined enough to permanently beat back the empire's oldest foe" is no little achievement.
I honestly believe that the only reason you say that Julius and Augustus is more qualified for such a rank is because they're more famous, which might entirely be because of the Enlightenment movement in the 18th century condemning any learning of the post-Western Roman Empire period.
And the last Servant I wanted to write.
I guess, I will take a break for some time.
«Kaw»
Name: Kyrkyl. More famous as The Raven.
Class: Caster
Aligment: ???
STR: D
AGI: C
CON: E
MGI: A+
LCK: A
Noble Phantasm: A++
Class Skills.
Territory Creation.
Rank «C»: Due to bad compability, Raven can barely create a Workshop-level territory. He only obtained this Skill due to providence of the Holy Grail.
Item Creation.
Rank «A++»: Capable of creating powerful Mystic Codes, rivalring Noble Phantasms. However, the Raven may not have capacity to use them as proper Hero would, and due to his nature rarely bothers to do anything.
Personal Skills.
Nescience. Natural tendency to be considered anomalous and mysterious. Can negate effects of Skills, aimed to understand true nature of an opponent, such as Discernment of Poor.
Rank «A»: While it is possible to perceive actions and words of the Servant, it's completely impossible to comprehend the reasons and motives behind his them.
In mythology of paleo-Asian people, Raven appears to as trickster, capable of easily tricking other beings.
Divinity. Measurment of Divine Spirit aptitude. It also has an effect which reduces special defensive values called "purge defense" in proportion to the Divinity's Rank.
Rank «B+»: Raven holds divinity of Supreme God lineage. His skill provides him with considerable defense against Heroes with Divinity of any kind of rank «C» and lower. This does not extends on Heroes of Sun or Moon Deities lineage, since he didn't made a Sun himself.
Where are conflicting stories about Raven. Many of them portrait him as son of Creator of the world, or as Creator himself. However, in other he appears as human-level figure, or even demonic being. It's also noted what while he made the world, he had to stole the Sun and Moon from the other place.
Living Miracle. An ability to activate mystery just be virtue of being born in a special way. Natural talent to perform miracles, without special training of any kind.
Rank «A»: Realisation of High Thaumaturgy and Grand Ritual-level mysteries can be done with a single action.
In some legends it is said, that Raven was the first being to teach people magic. Or, to be specific, it is claimed that shamans first learned about magic by imitating Raven.
Hunting. An expertise of a hunter. Ability to track enemies by small and insignificant traces. Also includes mastery of hunting equipment.
Rank «A»: Capable of succesfully tracking even experts of stealth movement. Also, Servant happens to be master of bow, nets and other simple equipment.
It also believed that the Raven invented hunting and was one of the greatest hunters, who slays many other beings to feed his family.
Noble Phantasm.
Kyikinyakku - Big Raven
Rank: A++
Type: Barrier.
Mystery of the highest level. Ability similiar to Reality Marble, but it's not projection of inner world, but rather return of the world to the state, long forgotten. The humanity did split from the World, but none of the concepts, associated with it, such as speech, tools and magic, didn't existed. Because of this, when such things are brought into this simple world, they became subject of changes.
Inside the barrier, Magecraft, Noble Phantasm and sometimes even Skills can be either sealed, or warped beyound recognition. For example, shield-type Noble Phantasm may become attack, and attack turn into shield, fire spell become water spell, etc. Exact effect of this Noble Phantasm is impossible to expect, or predict. Raven is not affected by it, because for him it is natural environment, most suitable. It is not possible to warp the nature of abilities activated outside (i.e. it is not possible to say, block all-destroying beam, sent from beyound Kuikinyakku reach), and some concepts may be immune to changes by virtue of simplicity.
This ability is always active near the Raven. However, barrier can be extened to a size of an building, or with sufficient energy expenditure affect entire city block. By the way, it is impossible to use Command Spells on Raven, because their magic is warped.
Background.
Kuth. Kurkuli. Kyikinyakku. The Raven. Stories about him, are widespread amongst aboriginal people of North-Eastern Asia and Northern America. Practically, all people living where, from Koryaks of Kamchatka Peninsula and Nankilstlas and Tlingits of Alaska. He is portrayed differently in legends. In some of them he is the Maker of the world, who used the mud to make humans, in others he is benevolent trickster, who uses his wits to bring people Sun and Moon, and in others he is just a guy, who wants to abandon his family and eat all his kills alone. The myth itself is very old, and it's certainly what it predates history.
As a Servant, he remains mysterious figure, who is hard to understand and control (because Command Spells are not effective against him). He communicates in simple-worded phrases, and his actions may appear random and chaotic, however where is always hidden motives behind them. He is also clearly motivated enough to obtain the Grail, but will rarely engage in fighting first.
He is very powerful magus, and his Noble Phantasm is capable of pretty easily lay enemies off. However, he is still weak against enemies with Magical Resistance, and those, who rely on simple means, such as brute strenght in combat. Because he frequently uses bow, one may think about him as Archer (initially).
I honestly believe that the only reason you say that Julius and Augustus is more qualified for such a rank is because they're more famous, which might entirely be because of the Enlightenment movement in the 18th century condemning any learning of the post-Western Roman Empire period.
Mmmm. The freakishly adoring works which set up Augustus particularly as God and Messiah are pretty hard to overpower. Herakleios was a Christian in a Christian Empire: he couldn't be elevated so highly. (In terms of military achievements, I would argue he's still easily the equal or better of either, though I'd rate Augustus as stronger in the field of politics).
As to the learning ... eh. The dividing line was drawn much more strongly than modern historians like, and there was definitely a resultant focus on Rome over its continuation in the East for various reasons (it being the origin point, Latin being more widely taught and probably more accessible, the stronger feel of Rome having an influence on the Western Renaissance scholars than the Eastern city and empire). But that particular point at about the turnover of the Common Era has its own pretty extraordinary circumstances which lent it especially to study. There were happenings and changes there which I honestly believe Herakleios' era just does not equal: if the military and religious chaos is arguably equalled, the artistic explosion of that time (literary and architectural especially) is incredible - and all the more notable for the relative desolation for a number of centuries afterward, marked by few sparks of genius to equal that time. You can certainly argue that a greater breadth of study was warranted, but I don't think that finding the 100BCE-100CE era so worthy of note is wrong. (And the condemnation wasn't precisely universal, else The Decline and Fall of the Roman Gibbon by Edward Empire would never have reached to that part of the state's history, whatever the inadequacy of his coverage). Credit for the joke goes to ISIRTA.
Heraclius is an interesting one, in that he really could have accomplished great things - had he been born a half century earlier.
His rule came about after the political, economic and social "bubble" of Justinian's rule had burst; the triumvirate of Theodora, Justinian and Belisaurius had accomplished more than any Roman rulers, Eastern or Western, had managed in the last few centuries. However, their plan failed when Justinian wasn't succeeded by a capable ruler, and the many problems of the Justinian Empire were too much for any lesser ruler to bear. Someone with skill and determination, like Heraclius, certainly could have carried through the tumult of the post-Justinian era, but the problem is he came in too late. The empire had already collapsed like a poorly baked pie, the ingredients being set up by Justinian but his successor being a poor baker with an all-too unreliable oven, in this example.
Heraclius was great, but he didn't have the opportunity to show that too well because of the era he was in. All in all, though, he wasn't too spectacular, but like the famous Flavius of the late Western Empire, he was a last spark as the glory of the empire began to fade to darkness.
<NEW FIC!>Revolution #9: Somewhere out there, there's a universe in which your mistakes and failures never happened, and all you wished for is true. How hard would you fight to make that real?
[11:20:46 AM] GlowStiks: lucina is supes attractive
[12:40] Lace: lucina is amazing
[12:40] Neir: lucina is pretty much flawless
Every Roman emperor gets born into A rank charisma, what a sweet deal.
Given the wording is 'sufficient to rule a country', I think lots of the emperors would miss out. Either because they devolved everything onto bureaucracy, or because they utterly failed at ruling their empires.
@ Blastedspider - Yeah, he fits better as an Assassin, but he does make for an interesting villain. He wants to be a big-shot, but he's too inherently cowardly to risk a fight against an enemy who isn't handicapped. He feels almost like your stereotypical fairytale/comic book/Saturday morning cartoon villain, but I am guessing that's the point of him.
@ Gunbazca - I like his "Bourne Identity" NP. Converting people to sleeperagents with hypnosis is a very interesting ability.
@ Petrikow - A bi-polar, support-type Saber? Awesome! If things go well he's a beast with a shield that acts like Kiritsugu's Origin Bullets and a sword that works almost like Soi Fong's "Death-in-Two-Steps", but if his Master is a jerk or things start going wrong it can all fall apart. Nicely balanced!
@ Blastedspider - One of the original Trickster archetypes and just as impressive as you'd think that would imply in the Nasuverse! He's basically a more mellowed out, mysterious and crafty Looney Tunes character once his NP is active, isn't he?
^^^
^^
Yeah, Charisma feels like the ability to rule just using your own Charisma. Modern day leaders wouldn't get it or at least not a very high one because they rely on systems put in place earlier.
<NEW FIC!>Revolution #9: Somewhere out there, there's a universe in which your mistakes and failures never happened, and all you wished for is true. How hard would you fight to make that real?
[11:20:46 AM] GlowStiks: lucina is supes attractive
[12:40] Lace: lucina is amazing
[12:40] Neir: lucina is pretty much flawless
Heraclius is an interesting one, in that he really could have accomplished great things - had he been born a half century earlier.
His rule came about after the political, economic and social "bubble" of Justinian's rule had burst; the triumvirate of Theodora, Justinian and Belisaurius had accomplished more than any Roman rulers, Eastern or Western, had managed in the last few centuries. However, their plan failed when Justinian wasn't succeeded by a capable ruler, and the many problems of the Justinian Empire were too much for any lesser ruler to bear. Someone with skill and determination, like Heraclius, certainly could have carried through the tumult of the post-Justinian era, but the problem is he came in too late. The empire had already collapsed like a poorly baked pie, the ingredients being set up by Justinian but his successor being a poor baker with an all-too unreliable oven, in this example.
Justinian arguably helped doom the empire more than he helped strengthen it. His campaigns completely bankrupted the Empire. The Italian campaign cost several tens of times more than the building of the Hagia Sophia, for example. To blame his successors seems way too superficial. Besides, Maurice, who was the third emperor after Justinian was in fact quite competent and did a lot to strengthen the Empire, yet ultimately fell to mutinying troops, who were upset about pay among other things, a policy he had needed to adopt because of Justinian having spent too much money.
In the end, the crisis faced by Heraclius was almost singlehandedly caused by Phocas, a completely incompetent tyrant who possibly possessed not a single positive quality.
Heraclius was great, but he didn't have the opportunity to show that too well because of the era he was in. All in all, though, he wasn't too spectacular, but like the famous Flavius of the late Western Empire, he was a last spark as the glory of the empire began to fade to darkness.
Nah, the Empire rebounded again under the Macedonian dynasty to the point that under Basil II it was probably stronger than under Justinian.
Originally Posted by Seika
Mmmm. The freakishly adoring works which set up Augustus particularly as God and Messiah are pretty hard to overpower. Herakleios was a Christian in a Christian Empire: he couldn't be elevated so highly. (In terms of military achievements, I would argue he's still easily the equal or better of either, though I'd rate Augustus as stronger in the field of politics).
As to the learning ... eh. The dividing line was drawn much more strongly than modern historians like, and there was definitely a resultant focus on Rome over its continuation in the East for various reasons (it being the origin point, Latin being more widely taught and probably more accessible, the stronger feel of Rome having an influence on the Western Renaissance scholars than the Eastern city and empire). But that particular point at about the turnover of the Common Era has its own pretty extraordinary circumstances which lent it especially to study. There were happenings and changes there which I honestly believe Herakleios' era just does not equal: if the military and religious chaos is arguably equalled, the artistic explosion of that time (literary and architectural especially) is incredible - and all the more notable for the relative desolation for a number of centuries afterward, marked by few sparks of genius to equal that time. You can certainly argue that a greater breadth of study was warranted, but I don't think that finding the 100BCE-100CE era so worthy of note is wrong. (And the condemnation wasn't precisely universal, else The Decline and Fall of the Roman Gibbon by Edward Empire would never have reached to that part of the state's history, whatever the inadequacy of his coverage).
While it certainly is true that the changes the ascent of Rome brought in the first place is more important than its contiunation (something which I attribute more to the Republic rather than the Empire), the arbitrary nature of the division of learning is still jarring and terribly western-eurocentric. In most schools they barely mention a word about the eastern part who survived for an additional 1000 years, an attitude that may have been provoked by Gibbon and his peers almost universal disdain for what they saw as a purely Christian institution (Gibbon was, after all, a stauch critic of all things Christian, he did a good job covering Byzantium as objectively as he did though). It is a funny attitude considering that a lot of important Roman legacies in the west comes from the early Byzantine Empire, such as the Code of Justinian and the Strategikon. Also, "Heraclius' era" is probably as important as the "Roman Republic era" if you look outside the empire, it was, after all, the time of Muhammed revelations, something which spurred the Golden Age of the middle east, something which, incidentally, most western schools ignore as well. Eurocentrism, ho!
Last edited by Petrikow; January 25th, 2013 at 05:56 PM.
Given the wording is 'sufficient to rule a country', I think lots of the emperors would miss out. Either because they devolved everything onto bureaucracy, or because they utterly failed at ruling their empires.
Because Arthur did so great with her country, lol.
Originally Posted by I3uster
